The economic consequences of Brexit (Vol 2)
Discussion
Breadvan72 said:
You chose to see it that way. Others may take a broader view. It's not a childish issue of getting what you want, it's a question of the wider public interest. Would you seriously argue that Trumpism is good for the US or the World? Brexit may be good for Britain, but there are serious arguments as to why it might not be.
BTW, was a clever person mean to you as a child? You seem here and elsewhere to have a thing about clever and/or educated people.
The referendum was last year, why are you still rehearsing the tired old argument?BTW, was a clever person mean to you as a child? You seem here and elsewhere to have a thing about clever and/or educated people.
///ajd said:
Others such as Santa Barbs chipped in with "who is Dan Hannan?"
The implication of your post was clear - "he's a nobody, who cares, lets move on".
Fine. Its funny, but fine.
The "never heard of the bus" line is much clearer however, and altogether much funnier.
We've gone from some never believing the bus to (for some) the bus not really being noticeable. Before too long there will be actual "bus deniers", who claim it was painted by Remain or even just photoshopped.
Thank you for proving me correct. I never said what Eddie claimed I said - ie, that I had never heard of Daniel HannanThe implication of your post was clear - "he's a nobody, who cares, lets move on".
Fine. Its funny, but fine.
The "never heard of the bus" line is much clearer however, and altogether much funnier.
We've gone from some never believing the bus to (for some) the bus not really being noticeable. Before too long there will be actual "bus deniers", who claim it was painted by Remain or even just photoshopped.
You two can keep reaching and wriggling as much as you like. It doesn't reflect well on you though.
Breadvan72 said:
powerstroke said:
I'm alright jack metropllitan elite types
It is a sad thing when terms such as elite or intellectual or even educated become insult terms, but most of the metro elite types that i have met are far from saying I am all right Jack. On the contrary, they are often bothered because of the effects that what might be bad decisions may have on people who are not metro elite types.
Edited by Breadvan72 on Saturday 23 September 11:11
You must not approach these people. They are dangerous. And they voted for a Muslim mayor.
He's in in on in too, by the way.
They are all lizard people.
Sshh......
Breadvan72 said:
You chose to see it that way. Others may take a broader view. It's not a childish issue of getting what you want, it's a question of the wider public interest. Would you seriously argue that Trumpism is good for the US or the World? Brexit may be good for Britain, but there are serious arguments as to why it might not be.
BTW, was a clever person mean to you as a child? You seem here and elsewhere to have a thing about clever and/or educated people.
No problem with clever people at all.BTW, was a clever person mean to you as a child? You seem here and elsewhere to have a thing about clever and/or educated people.
Sneering and ego-yes.
ClaphamGT3 said:
I rather tire of the sneering reference to 'metropolitan elite' from certain commentators - you seem to overlook that, for at least 25 years it is that 'Metropolitan elite' that has put food on everyone's table and that, without us, all the bigoted, turnip-munching hut dwellers are going to be biblically screwed...
I never really got on with turnips. Just didn't appeal in the same way as a nice swede.. But parsnips, now there's a good munchable veggie...I used to dream of dwelling in a hut...
Breadvan72 said:
Garvin said:
..
a regime that is terrified of publishing its accounts ...
There you see the Brexit problem writ large. Some (many?) Brexiteers believe in nonsense. The accounts are published. Also, they are signed off by auditors. The auditors enter some qualifications. Do some basic fact checking, eh? Some (many?) Brexiteers trot out the same nonsense again and again. Debunk it again and again and they still cling on to the fictions. Debate is impossible when people believe in made up hoo hah and cannot be bothered to do even the most basic research. a regime that is terrified of publishing its accounts ...
The accounts are meaningless.
ClaphamGT3 said:
I rather tire of the sneering reference to 'metropolitan elite' from certain commentators - you seem to overlook that, for at least 25 years it is that 'Metropolitan elite' that has put food on everyone's table and that, without us, all the bigoted, turnip-munching hut dwellers are going to be biblically screwed...
TIL that 'metropolitan elite' refers to farmersBreadvan72 said:
FiF said:
[Ranty rant rant rant]
I am sorry that you find the published words of one of the holy prophets inconvenient. I cite what Davis said as indication that, like all who are charged with Brexit (save perhaps Hammond, one of the few apparently sane members of the Government), Davis is clueless. You ire and finger wagging should be directed at him. Your point about February 2018 is even funnier than what Davis himself said. Are you suggesting that all shall be OK because in the four and a bit months until next February all shall become a done deal? Lemon squeezy!
As a matter or realpolitik, if the departing UK wished to negotiate with whomever it wished, there would be little that the EU could do about this, and if the hard Brexiteers were in charge that might happen. In diplomatic reality, the UK might not wish to tread on even more toes than it is already treading on. In any event, the Government does not have the personnel available to negotiate many deals at once, as everyone is busy with Brexit. Indeed, much of Government has gone into stasis over Brexit. A Tory party internal squabble that has rumbled on for 40 years is derailing an entire country.
Davis breezily said that biggly big biggly big-ass deals (big ones) would be done quickly and with ease. Two years, he said. By that I take it that he meant within two years from deciding to leave, or maybe two years from giving the formal notice. Either way, his prediction is looking even dafter now than it looked when he made it in a highly comedic article that he (or someone who handles his crayons for him) wrote for Conservative Home in Feb 2016, which article I commend to all lovers of fun stuff.
Edited by Breadvan72 on Saturday 23 September 10:51
Cue, but I'm hearing things in the Temple, don't-cha-know. Ignored.
///ajd said:
All Farage does is moan and blame others. That's all he does. That's all he has ever done, or will ever do. That's how he gets support, by getting the feeble to think that if they can blame something, and gang up on that something / hate it, everything will be ok. Just blaming something doesn't lead to positive change - Brexit is testament to that.
I notice that Brexiteers are relaxed about the extra £20bn - it has been reported as extra on top of our EU contributions. Hard to tell where the truth is, but that would mean the bus number is going up, due to leave. Still free movement but with migrants having to fill a form in - which we could have done anyway if the home office thought it useful - which they didn't because it isn't.
This govt will collapse well before 2019, let alone 2021.
Is that another wild ass guess?I notice that Brexiteers are relaxed about the extra £20bn - it has been reported as extra on top of our EU contributions. Hard to tell where the truth is, but that would mean the bus number is going up, due to leave. Still free movement but with migrants having to fill a form in - which we could have done anyway if the home office thought it useful - which they didn't because it isn't.
This govt will collapse well before 2019, let alone 2021.
SantaBarbara said:
///ajd said:
All Farage does is moan and blame others. That's all he does. That's all he has ever done, or will ever do. That's how he gets support, by getting the feeble to think that if they can blame something, and gang up on that something / hate it, everything will be ok. Just blaming something doesn't lead to positive change - Brexit is testament to that.
I notice that Brexiteers are relaxed about the extra £20bn - it has been reported as extra on top of our EU contributions. Hard to tell where the truth is, but that would mean the bus number is going up, due to leave. Still free movement but with migrants having to fill a form in - which we could have done anyway if the home office thought it useful - which they didn't because it isn't.
This govt will collapse well before 2019, let alone 2021.
Is that another wild ass guess?I notice that Brexiteers are relaxed about the extra £20bn - it has been reported as extra on top of our EU contributions. Hard to tell where the truth is, but that would mean the bus number is going up, due to leave. Still free movement but with migrants having to fill a form in - which we could have done anyway if the home office thought it useful - which they didn't because it isn't.
This govt will collapse well before 2019, let alone 2021.
ClaphamGT3 said:
I rather tire of the sneering reference to 'metropolitan elite' from certain commentators - you seem to overlook that, for at least 25 years it is that 'Metropolitan elite' that has put food on everyone's table and that, without us, all the bigoted, turnip-munching hut dwellers are going to be biblically screwed...
Sums you up rather nicely doesn't it, your arrogance and superiority complex is breathtaking.
Jesus (if he actually existed) pales into insignificance in terms of benevolence when compared to you.
ClaphamGT3 said:
None of us can know when Mays Govt will collapse but he is 100% correct about Farage. The man is a confidence trickster and, like all confidence tricksters, he has targeted the most vulnerable, the least well educated and the most frightened in society. He's never cared whether they are harmed by what he's achieved, as long as he's achieved what he wanted. Now he has, he's disappeared and left them to their fate
Another one who just doesn't get it.Which is a good thing really, so carry on..
Breadvan72 said:
Who are these unicorns? They have become a trope, but do they really exist in any significant numbers? Are they any less a stereotype than angry Huddersfield bloke in a flat roofed pub?
I would suggest that over half a million people voting about how awful it is that Uber have lost their licence is a good indicator of their existence.andymadmak said:
I voted exit after much careful consideration. I have not changed my mind. I honestly do not know any genuine Brexit voter who has changed their mind. I DO know a small number of Remain voters who have changed their mind and who would now vote Brexit.
Some of the reasons mentioned by these new converts include their utter disgust at the way the EU is going about the negotiations (100bn demands, arrogant dismissal of UK discussion papers, veiled threats etc) and the constant drip drip drip of thinly disguised bile towards Brexit voters on social media and in the mainstream media, particularly the BBC, Guardian and Independent.
I rarely post on Brexit threads now because, frankly I am tired of the arguments and the snide personal attacks from the usual protagonists.
I am not a racist, I am not thick, I am not a pensioner, I am not xenophobic, I don't "hate" european people, I am not "afraid" of immigrants, I did not believe the 350m NHS bus thing (I actually was not even aware of it) , I was not conned - but I recognise that both sides were not 100% square with the truth. I made my choice for valid reasons that I believe still hold true today.
I am tired of the likes of slasher, strohacker et al who, even when presented with salient information will nevertheless, at the next turn (or next thread) go back to promoting the same old nonsense that they always do. And it's all done with that faux wide eyed innocence that is guaranteed to make my teeth itch. So I ask myself, "why bother with these guys?" It's not as if anything that I (and others) may have to say would in any way change their opinions. They are entrenched in their belief that brexit voters are largely ignorant racists and that Brexit must surely be an utter disaster - they are the people who believe that the certain smile on the face of the NISSAN CEO is all the proof needed to support their assertions....
I am most certainly not ashamed of my vote, nor am I looking to blame anyone else for what comes next in the history of our country.
It's been said that posting on a forum cannot and will not influence the outcome of the negotiations. That might be true, but the constant deliberate misinterpretation and misrepresentation of events is unhelpful to achieving the kind of national consensous that would be ideal if we are to get the best deal and make the best of the future. Division is not helpful. Those that seek to ferment that division (presumably in the hope that they can squeak "I told you so" at some point down the line) are equally unhelpful.
I am genuinely disappointed that Mr Corbyn and his team have decided to put party advantage ahead of positive engagement in this vital process. I wished and still do wish that the best minds of all political shades would engage themselves in working out the best exit deal for and on behalf of the country, regardless of how they had voted in June 2016. .............................................................
Edited by andymadmak on Friday 22 September 11:35
Thanks for putting the most detailed refutation of the complete cobblers spouted by those who refuse to accept the views of those who want a free country. The insults and derision from them illustrates their myopic dependency on other governments who would deny UK independence.
Breadvan72 said:
Garvin said:
..
a regime that is terrified of publishing its accounts ...
There you see the Brexit problem writ large. Some (many?) Brexiteers believe in nonsense. The accounts are published. Also, they are signed off by auditors. The auditors enter some qualifications. Do some basic fact checking, eh? Some (many?) Brexiteers trot out the same nonsense again and again. Debunk it again and again and they still cling on to the fictions. Debate is impossible when people believe in made up hoo hah and cannot be bothered to do even the most basic research. a regime that is terrified of publishing its accounts ...
One can publish any old tosh, that doesn't make it acceptable.
So many remainers blindly accept that the EU can do no wrong and are willing to overlook the significant failings of the regime as if they are just trivial matters. Debate is impossible wih people of such blind faith.
FiF said:
There was no rant about it. You once again, like so many of your fellow travellers just continue along the line of suggesting that someone is saying something that clearly they have not said, indeed in this case said something quite different. Not worth carrying on communications, frankly.
Cue, but I'm hearing things in the Temple, don't-cha-know. Ignored.
Bog-standard NPE rightist: Posts nonsense, gets challenged on nonsense. Claims butthurt and adds another evil leftist conspirator to the ignore list. Debate? Er, what's that?Cue, but I'm hearing things in the Temple, don't-cha-know. Ignored.
Garvin said:
Nice try and there you see the remainer problem writ large. You seem to infer that all is rosey with the EU accounts.
He doesn't infer that at all. You infer that he infers that which means I infer you're someone willing to be wilfully obtuse/disingenuous/blind whatever you want to call the thing that goes on in here all day every day. Whaddya think you're so special? Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff