The economic consequences of Brexit (Vol 2)
Discussion
Breadvan72 said:
I am mocking Davis for claiming two years as the period within which the super mega deals would be obtained. I am not suggesting that would ever have happened. I mention Davis' prediction to make the point that Davis is an idiot. The fact that keen Brexiteers are desperate to distance themselves from the bloke who is the Secretary of State for Brexit is almost too funny.
Yet even when people put forward an argument that those 'super mega deals' aren't the most important things right now (and there are nations that have already stated a deal will not be a challenge), you ignore them. Much like playing the man leading the DexEU, whilst ignoring the men leading the 4 EU institutions, who are hardly poster boys for quality, integrity or capability - and hold views that are completely incompatible with the desires of the majority across the EU...
The attempts here to suggest that trade deals are just a minor detail and not at all important are, again, almost too funny. Brexiteers seem to have the most rapidly mobile goalposts ever designed.
It is legitimate to express concern about the competence of senior Government figures. The UK is imperilled by the desperately poor quality of the key figures in government and in opposition.
PS: how do you know what most people in the EU think or want?
PPS: Top what aboutism skillz!
It is legitimate to express concern about the competence of senior Government figures. The UK is imperilled by the desperately poor quality of the key figures in government and in opposition.
PS: how do you know what most people in the EU think or want?
PPS: Top what aboutism skillz!
Breadvan72 said:
As I clearly stated (please pay attention): (1) Davis made his prediction in an article for Conservative Home in February 2016. Context suggests that the two years that he had in mind were the two years from either (1) the referendum decision, or (2) more likely, the date of an Article 50 notice. It would be unkind to Davis to suggest that he meant two years from Feb 2016, and there is no rational reason to suppose that he meant two years from actual exit date. His message was that the UK could and would be up and running with super cool deals once it ditched the EU stuff.
Your response is to say "oh, two years aren't up yet". Is that really your answer? If you are seriously suggesting that the wonderful trade deals can be done in whatever portion of two years would now be left (starting the clock in either June 2016 or more sensibly in March 2017), then you may be an even greater optimist than Davis himself.
Note also that this is not a a case of deliberate choice not to negotiate deals because that would be against EU Rules (the UK is leaving, remember? It is amusing to see Brexiteers wriggling as they try to give Davis a let out by being super punctilious about despised rules). Nor is it a case of the deals being negotiated in secret. The open position is that no negotiations have started because the Government does not have the capacity to start negotiations, Such is the ability of the Conservative Party to place its own factional interests above national interest that Government is now bogged down in Brexit. Try getting almost anything done across Government right now and there is a notable degree of paralysis because of what was problem number something below but not far from 99 on the UK's list of problems before the country was hijacked by a group of fraudulent careerists such as Johnson and Farage.
Have a read of the Davis article. It is a breathtaking piece of fatuity, produced by a politician of astonishingly low personal ability - a buffoon who is now in nominal charge of the Brexit process.
Yes and only a fool thinks that the EU will do a sensible deal it's all about keeping the wheels on their socialist dream Your response is to say "oh, two years aren't up yet". Is that really your answer? If you are seriously suggesting that the wonderful trade deals can be done in whatever portion of two years would now be left (starting the clock in either June 2016 or more sensibly in March 2017), then you may be an even greater optimist than Davis himself.
Note also that this is not a a case of deliberate choice not to negotiate deals because that would be against EU Rules (the UK is leaving, remember? It is amusing to see Brexiteers wriggling as they try to give Davis a let out by being super punctilious about despised rules). Nor is it a case of the deals being negotiated in secret. The open position is that no negotiations have started because the Government does not have the capacity to start negotiations, Such is the ability of the Conservative Party to place its own factional interests above national interest that Government is now bogged down in Brexit. Try getting almost anything done across Government right now and there is a notable degree of paralysis because of what was problem number something below but not far from 99 on the UK's list of problems before the country was hijacked by a group of fraudulent careerists such as Johnson and Farage.
Have a read of the Davis article. It is a breathtaking piece of fatuity, produced by a politician of astonishingly low personal ability - a buffoon who is now in nominal charge of the Brexit process.
Davis is just a puppet of our 3rd rate remainer PM and Chancellor , we need to stand up against the bullies in EU the current apeasment is just being seen as weakness , tell them we are leaving, two year transition period my arse we are working towards WTO in 2019 this would
allow business to plan , we could start making trade deals and most importantly it would show the
S running the EU we won't be bullied , the sooner we admit we are at war with the EU the better for all the peoples of europe... Edited by powerstroke on Sunday 24th September 08:51
powerstroke said:
Yes and only a fool thinks that the EU will do a sensible deal it's all about keeping the wheels on their socialist dream
Davis is just a puppet of our 3rd rate remainer PM and Chancellor , we need to stand up against the bullies in EU the current apeasment is just being seen as weakness , tell them we are leaving, we are working towards WTO in 2019 this would
allow business to plan , we could start making trade deals and most importantly it would show theS running the EU we won't be bullied , the sooner we admit we are at war with the EU the better for all the peoples of europe...
Bit early, but what the hell, I'm in.Davis is just a puppet of our 3rd rate remainer PM and Chancellor , we need to stand up against the bullies in EU the current apeasment is just being seen as weakness , tell them we are leaving, we are working towards WTO in 2019 this would
allow business to plan , we could start making trade deals and most importantly it would show the
S running the EU we won't be bullied , the sooner we admit we are at war with the EU the better for all the peoples of europe... 
I genuinely feel for the sensible Brexiteers that they have to put up with pals like powerstroke! It's a bit like the David Ickers responding to all the 911 truthers, birthers, anti-vaxxers and so on, and being forced to say "Look, those people are nutjobs! Now, back to the Illuminati plots ...."
Eddie Strohacker said:
powerstroke said:
Yes and only a fool thinks that the EU will do a sensible deal it's all about keeping the wheels on their socialist dream
Davis is just a puppet of our 3rd rate remainer PM and Chancellor , we need to stand up against the bullies in EU the current apeasment is just being seen as weakness , tell them we are leaving, we are working towards WTO in 2019 this would
allow business to plan , we could start making trade deals and most importantly it would show theS running the EU we won't be bullied , the sooner we admit we are at war with the EU the better for all the peoples of europe...
Bit early, but what the hell, I'm in.Davis is just a puppet of our 3rd rate remainer PM and Chancellor , we need to stand up against the bullies in EU the current apeasment is just being seen as weakness , tell them we are leaving, we are working towards WTO in 2019 this would
allow business to plan , we could start making trade deals and most importantly it would show the
S running the EU we won't be bullied , the sooner we admit we are at war with the EU the better for all the peoples of europe... Eddie Strohacker said:
Good hit on the typo.
I realised the lack of profit in offering humour to JSF, so decided to bin it, failing to account for the fact there's always some doofus with nothing better to do at midnight. And I do have something better to do, so happy rofling into the cyber abyss.
I realised the lack of profit in offering humour to JSF, so decided to bin it, failing to account for the fact there's always some doofus with nothing better to do at midnight. And I do have something better to do, so happy rofling into the cyber abyss.
What a Trump!
Doofus with nothing better to do at around midnight accuses someone else of being same and does a flounce because he does have something better to do apparently
Breadvan72 said:
The attempts here to suggest that trade deals are just a minor detail and not at all important are, again, almost too funny. Brexiteers seem to have the most rapidly mobile goalposts ever designed.
It is legitimate to express concern about the competence of senior Government figures. The UK is imperilled by the desperately poor quality of the key figures in government and in opposition.
PS: how do you know what most people in the EU think or want?
PPS: Top what aboutism skillz!
Amazing how a material reduction in the cost of living for everyone is a diversion and shifting of the goalposts...It is legitimate to express concern about the competence of senior Government figures. The UK is imperilled by the desperately poor quality of the key figures in government and in opposition.
PS: how do you know what most people in the EU think or want?
PPS: Top what aboutism skillz!
The only goalposts moving are those whose starting position was defined by yourself.
You can read back nearly two years' worth of posts pointing some of this stuff out, and showing a consistency in aims, or you can posit shifting views that have little basis in reality.
For what it's worth, I've always stated fresh FTAs with good trading partners will be most welcome. Unilateral dropping of tariffs on our side would be superb too.
As for Davis, as you state he's not exactly a statesman that'll be remembered positively by history, nor are many in both cabinets. At least they're not up against a De Gaull. In a race for 'who's worst', Davis is perhaps not a front runner compared to some of the competition. An assessment of those leaders is entirely relevant when it seems acceptable to challenge the competence of Davis, yet it's apparently whataboutery to challenge Verhofstadt, Barnier, Juncker, etc.
Breadvan72 said:
I genuinely feel for the sensible Brexiteers that they have to put up with pals like powerstroke! It's a bit like the David Ickers responding to all the 911 truthers, birthers, anti-vaxxers and so on, and being forced to say "Look, those people are nutjobs! Now, back to the Illuminati plots ...."
panem et circenses or para bellum ?? you chose !!!Doncha just love it when the non-Latinate get a Googling on the Latin quotes? Adorable!
I am quite interested in the novel pairing of mob-management and getting ready for ruckus. I wonder do some people miss the periodic opportunity to fight some Germans or some French people that we used to get? My war gone by, I miss it so?
I am quite interested in the novel pairing of mob-management and getting ready for ruckus. I wonder do some people miss the periodic opportunity to fight some Germans or some French people that we used to get? My war gone by, I miss it so?
Breadvan72 said:
I am less a supporter of the EU than a supporter of the UK, even though I could bail to Ireland if I wished and watch sadly as the once mighty nation drifts off to 50s-Brit-Narnia. I could wish that Leavers were as keen on supporting the UK as Remainers tend to be.
Yet you ignore anything that rationally shows why there is absolutely no reason for this 'once mighty nation' to fail, nor indeed become a '50s Brit Narnia'.There are ranty people on both sides of the debate, unfortunately despite complaining about the paucity of cogent arguments, you're showing little interest in actually debating on the details.
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