Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. Vol 4
Discussion
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
LongQ said:
Paddy,
Out of interest, especially on the basis of your enthusiasm for the potential worldwide market for the UK industry's knowledge about offshore wind, do you have information about the practical options for installations based on seabed viability, wind strength and potential for connectivity?
If so, how close to the proposed target for electricity generation worldwide would these allow developers to get in, say, the next 30 years based on probably technology advances?
Nothing that "might happen is a miracle occurs".
Ignore the potential for other disruptive technologies appearing during that time.
I note that the 32 turbines mentioned in the DONG press release cover an area of 40 Square Kilometers according to a graphic in the article.
Is this typical?
re : Bold above, I can offer opinion, but not facts.Out of interest, especially on the basis of your enthusiasm for the potential worldwide market for the UK industry's knowledge about offshore wind, do you have information about the practical options for installations based on seabed viability, wind strength and potential for connectivity?
If so, how close to the proposed target for electricity generation worldwide would these allow developers to get in, say, the next 30 years based on probably technology advances?
Nothing that "might happen is a miracle occurs".
Ignore the potential for other disruptive technologies appearing during that time.
I note that the 32 turbines mentioned in the DONG press release cover an area of 40 Square Kilometers according to a graphic in the article.
Is this typical?
For the worldwide goals, I can only offer information on the trends and the projects curves I see ahead.
As for Burbo Bamk extension - 40 sq km.
32 x 8MW, 164m Rotor diameter.
Burbo phase one - 10 sq km
25 x 3.6MW, 107m rotor diameter
Those Square Kilometre facts will be I suspect the 'Consent Area' sold by the crown estate - not necessarily the grid / array spacing.
Maybe the Crown Estates site can offer more on that. I'll try to remember to check later.
LongQ said:
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
LongQ said:
Paddy,
Out of interest, especially on the basis of your enthusiasm for the potential worldwide market for the UK industry's knowledge about offshore wind, do you have information about the practical options for installations based on seabed viability, wind strength and potential for connectivity?
If so, how close to the proposed target for electricity generation worldwide would these allow developers to get in, say, the next 30 years based on probably technology advances?
Nothing that "might happen is a miracle occurs".
Ignore the potential for other disruptive technologies appearing during that time.
I note that the 32 turbines mentioned in the DONG press release cover an area of 40 Square Kilometers according to a graphic in the article.
Is this typical?
re : Bold above, I can offer opinion, but not facts.Out of interest, especially on the basis of your enthusiasm for the potential worldwide market for the UK industry's knowledge about offshore wind, do you have information about the practical options for installations based on seabed viability, wind strength and potential for connectivity?
If so, how close to the proposed target for electricity generation worldwide would these allow developers to get in, say, the next 30 years based on probably technology advances?
Nothing that "might happen is a miracle occurs".
Ignore the potential for other disruptive technologies appearing during that time.
I note that the 32 turbines mentioned in the DONG press release cover an area of 40 Square Kilometers according to a graphic in the article.
Is this typical?
For the worldwide goals, I can only offer information on the trends and the projects curves I see ahead.
As for Burbo Bamk extension - 40 sq km.
32 x 8MW, 164m Rotor diameter.
Burbo phase one - 10 sq km
25 x 3.6MW, 107m rotor diameter
Those Square Kilometre facts will be I suspect the 'Consent Area' sold by the crown estate - not necessarily the grid / array spacing.
Maybe the Crown Estates site can offer more on that. I'll try to remember to check later.
https://www.thecrownestate.co.uk/energy-minerals-a...
It does not seem to allow a link to a specific installation but it's pretty easy to navigate and click through to those of interest.
ETA:
I'm slight puzzled by the interactive map.
When I first checked I could see Icons for both Burbo Bank and Burbo Bank Extension.
However as I drilled down to see the original Burbo Bank I noticed that the last update time was 10:30 AM.
So I ran a refresh and the Original Burbo Bank has disappeared from the interactive map. Only the just started up extension is visible.
Could be a glitch of a temporary nature ... or I suppose the site might be a bit flaky.
Edited by LongQ on Thursday 18th May 17:00
Todays second Beeb cc puff piece:-
Trump 'can't escape climate change' impacts says Fiji PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3996...
Fiji's Prime Minister has issued a coded warning to Donald Trump about the dangers of climate change.
The US leader is due to decide on future US participation in the Paris climate agreement after next week's G7 meeting in Italy.
But Frank Bainimarama told delegates here that whether you lived in Miami or New York, you wouldn't be able to escape the rising seas.
Fiji will lead the next key UN climate talks later this year..............................continues
The EU also announced an extra €800m to help poorer nations between now and 2020. Around half that money will be earmarked for climate action..........................The EU will also find €3m to support the Fijian presidency of the forthcoming Conference of the Parties in Bonn in November. This will be the first time a small island state has held the role.
Follow the money !!!!
PS Not a problem actually
Will Pacific Island Nations Disappear as Seas Rise? Maybe Not
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/02/150213-...
Trump 'can't escape climate change' impacts says Fiji PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3996...
Fiji's Prime Minister has issued a coded warning to Donald Trump about the dangers of climate change.
The US leader is due to decide on future US participation in the Paris climate agreement after next week's G7 meeting in Italy.
But Frank Bainimarama told delegates here that whether you lived in Miami or New York, you wouldn't be able to escape the rising seas.
Fiji will lead the next key UN climate talks later this year..............................continues
The EU also announced an extra €800m to help poorer nations between now and 2020. Around half that money will be earmarked for climate action..........................The EU will also find €3m to support the Fijian presidency of the forthcoming Conference of the Parties in Bonn in November. This will be the first time a small island state has held the role.
Follow the money !!!!
PS Not a problem actually
Will Pacific Island Nations Disappear as Seas Rise? Maybe Not
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/02/150213-...
BBC said:
But Frank Bainimarama told delegates here that whether you lived in Miami or New York, you wouldn't be able to escape the rising seas.
Fiji, Hmmm. There are two stations.Abstract said:
Both stations are awkwardly placed on heavy harbour constructions resting on soft sediments susceptible to serious compaction problems. The nearby GPS stations resting on a bedrock hill offer no solution to the stability problems. The Suva tide-gauge has been moved three times, and must accordingly be analysed in segments. Even the last location covering years 1989 to 2917 provides a mixed picture of 16 years of stability, 10 years of rapid rise, and 4 years of rapid fall in relative sea level. This suggests the interaction of subsidence and cyclic changes in sea level.
Conclusion said:
Any application of mean trends would produce meaningless values, more detrimental than helpful estimation on-going absolute sea level changes. NOAA is unfortunately making just this mistake by applying a long-term mean trend over the combined record at Suva. The value obtained has no physical significance, creates confusion and must be challenged from a scientific as well as geoethical point of view.
Neither of the two sites provides any conclusive message...and it's Naughty NOAA (again).We're back to this.
More generally there's no shortage of grasping nations jumping on the junkscience bandwagon to get their hands on climate compo.
XM5ER said:
Paddy, Long Q etc.
Would you mind staring a new thread specifically about Wind energy. Whilst I know the thread is related and also that the windy part is interesting I think it would be better served with it's own discussion. There are a lot of members that don't venture into the CC threads but might look and comment on a Wind generation thread, so we might get a wider set of inputs.
What do you think?
In News, Politics and Economics or elsewhere?Would you mind staring a new thread specifically about Wind energy. Whilst I know the thread is related and also that the windy part is interesting I think it would be better served with it's own discussion. There are a lot of members that don't venture into the CC threads but might look and comment on a Wind generation thread, so we might get a wider set of inputs.
What do you think?
It looks possible that the subject matter could have a life of its own now so it's worth considering.
Paddy seems to be of the opinion that it's an industry that is very ready to stand economically on it's ability and achievements which suggests that it is moving away from the need of political patronage through subsidy by removing the subsidy - but not yet removing the need for political policy making.
I'm less convinced about that at the basic level and at the policy level I'm even less convinced about the long term - which means the short term decisions are even more crazy than we might think.
Those are very different sets of concerns/satisfaction. Would a separate thread survive?
Let's see if it has legs for the next 3 or 4 days and take it from there?
chris watton said:
There should be more pics of the mess made by fracking litter louts who are known for whining about their environment.
robinessex said:
Todays second Beeb cc puff piece:-
Trump 'can't escape climate change' impacts says Fiji PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3996...
Fiji's Prime Minister has issued a coded warning to Donald Trump about the dangers of climate change.
The US leader is due to decide on future US participation in the Paris climate agreement after next week's G7 meeting in Italy.
But Frank Bainimarama told delegates here that whether you lived in Miami or New York, you wouldn't be able to escape the rising seas.
Fiji will lead the next key UN climate talks later this year..............................continues
The EU also announced an extra €800m to help poorer nations between now and 2020. Around half that money will be earmarked for climate action..........................The EU will also find €3m to support the Fijian presidency of the forthcoming Conference of the Parties in Bonn in November. This will be the first time a small island state has held the role.
Follow the money !!!!
Indeed...Trump 'can't escape climate change' impacts says Fiji PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3996...
Fiji's Prime Minister has issued a coded warning to Donald Trump about the dangers of climate change.
The US leader is due to decide on future US participation in the Paris climate agreement after next week's G7 meeting in Italy.
But Frank Bainimarama told delegates here that whether you lived in Miami or New York, you wouldn't be able to escape the rising seas.
Fiji will lead the next key UN climate talks later this year..............................continues
The EU also announced an extra €800m to help poorer nations between now and 2020. Around half that money will be earmarked for climate action..........................The EU will also find €3m to support the Fijian presidency of the forthcoming Conference of the Parties in Bonn in November. This will be the first time a small island state has held the role.
Follow the money !!!!
hang fire it's not my fault my comment didn't appear before you jumped in!! But give me a chance then you can copy and paste the same reply.turbobloke said:
chris watton said:
There should be more pics of the mess made by fracking litter louts who are known for whining about their environment.
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
Stop being so f
king precious.
You stuffed up the quotation and inserting a typical 'zero-weight' sarcastic comment. Something to do with O&M costs will kill off wind power IIRC
I said "helpful and insightful as ever" because you may notice that posters tend to contribute, whether agreeable or not - rather than just chip in with a pointless one liner that is your MO.
You've now since deleted the post it appears.
I'm assuming as it was worthless in content ?
Yes I deleted my post as my comment didn't appear so was in the process of amending it before you "chipped" in !!king precious.You stuffed up the quotation and inserting a typical 'zero-weight' sarcastic comment. Something to do with O&M costs will kill off wind power IIRC
I said "helpful and insightful as ever" because you may notice that posters tend to contribute, whether agreeable or not - rather than just chip in with a pointless one liner that is your MO.
You've now since deleted the post it appears.
I'm assuming as it was worthless in content ?
Remind me of who deleted his "zero-weight sarcastic comment" ...... "f
knuckle" and thought he got away with it? Todays Beeb CC story
Decoding Antarctica's response to a warming world
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3997...
Note the claim in the title. Anyway, another expensive expedition.
Decoding Antarctica's response to a warming world
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-3997...
Note the claim in the title. Anyway, another expensive expedition.
The Guardian reports that the Global Seed Vault in the Arctic which holds sample of millions of seeds recently experienced a flood caused by melting permafrost due to rising temperatures etc, etc...
Apparently this facility was built in 2008, no doubt after years of planning and construction so considering the settled science told us that the unprecedented warming would have rendered the arctic ice free within a few years of this place opening it does raise some questions at to what they were thinking building the thing there. Clearly built by stupid science deniers.
Apparently this facility was built in 2008, no doubt after years of planning and construction so considering the settled science told us that the unprecedented warming would have rendered the arctic ice free within a few years of this place opening it does raise some questions at to what they were thinking building the thing there. Clearly built by stupid science deniers.
Science denier at the Norwegian government said:
“It was not in our plans to think that the permafrost would not be there and that it would experience extreme weather like that,” said Hege Njaa Aschim, from the Norwegian government, which owns the vault.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/may/1...Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff