Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 8

[r11co]

Vandenberg said:

They seem to have fallen into the trap of recruiting dross who cant deliver and blaming Thatcher/Westminster for all their woes.

T'was ever thus, it is just that more people are waking up to it.

[anonymous-user]

r11co said:

T'was ever thus, it is just that more people are waking up to it.

To be fair to the SNP, its not just them, I struggle to spot any talent in politics on a global level.

[r11co]

Vandenberg said:

r11co said:

T'was ever thus, it is just that more people are waking up to it.

To be fair to the SNP, its not just them, I struggle to spot any talent in politics on a global level.

Perhaps, but the SNP are particularly lacking because they were never a proper political party. They started as protest organisation and still operate as one.

[Leithen]

r11co said:

Vandenberg said:

r11co said:

T'was ever thus, it is just that more people are waking up to it.

To be fair to the SNP, its not just them, I struggle to spot any talent in politics on a global level.

Perhaps, but the SNP are particularly lacking because they were never a proper political party. They started as protest organisation and still operate as one.

With the added irony that to survive, they have to keep their core supporters happy at any cost, ensuring that they will continue to divide the nation rather than unite it.

[hidetheelephants]

r11co said:

Vandenberg said:

r11co said:

T'was ever thus, it is just that more people are waking up to it.

To be fair to the SNP, its not just them, I struggle to spot any talent in politics on a global level.

Perhaps, but the SNP are particularly lacking because they were never a proper political party. They started as protest organisation and still operate as one.

I don't know about that, but in the aftermath of Labour's implosion in scotland, particularly after the indyref, the SNP acted as a magnet for a wide variety of waifs and strays cast adrift(at least in their own minds) by the destruction of socialism in Scotland at the hands of various Labour leaders and on the fringe by the personal peccadillos of Tommy Sheridan; no political party can sensibly contain people on the full width of the political spectrum that are only united in their belief in independence, any attempt to please all these factions must eventually collide with reality, especially when the party have the inconvenient burden of being in government.

[Kccv23highliftcam]

The Political Police and the Slide to an Authoritarian State


https://theweeflea.com/2018/10/29/the-political-po...

Quote.
"I believe that this is an extremely important subject and that is speaks to a clear and present danger that all freedom loving free thinkers need to be aware of. If you agree please pass it on and let try to get our politicians and police back to what they should be doing in a free state – governing for the good of all and protecting all equally under the law. "

...

[technodup]

Kccv23highliftcam said:

Is that an example of the friendly, welcoming and inclusive Scotland we're going to be in future?

I've always wondered why it is apparently hateful/offensive for me to say "black/Irish/Jewish/gay/trans scum out", but being a Conservative is the minority which is beyond the pale and thus acceptable to hate.

I dare say they'd counter with "but you don't [i]choose[i/] to be black or gay or Jewish", but is that any justification? If I choose to 'identify' as a Conservative, I'm scum deserving of being pushed out? It's a mainstream political party ffs, the most successful in history, not some extreme KKK style wannabe militia. I thought today's landscape was all personal choice and safe spaces?

In other news I see they're ahead of Labour again in the proper polls (not the diddy Scottish ones which don't count for st). If Labour can't get the better of them now, in the midst of Brexit they have little chance down the line. So the lovely indy lot had better get used to the Tories in government, and if they ever want to get their indy they might think about trying to convince some Tories over to their side rather than singling them out for abuse. fkwits.

[simoid]

Didn’t we have recently that Scottish N/nationalism (?) is a belief that can’t be discriminated against? So it would seem only fair that Toryism would have similar protection.

It’s surely quite difficult to think of an adjective that one could acceptably put ahead of “scum” without offending someone.

Is it a crime to call someone “Nazi scum”? (End of Godwin...)

[s2kjock]

Vandenberg said:

They seem to have fallen into the trap of recruiting dross who cant deliver and blaming Thatcher/Westminster for all their woes.

You think there were traps?

I think the only trap was the one Nicola and Alex were pulling and that people keep trying to jump onto.

I'm not sure what will happen when the current pony runs out of puff and goes out to pasture.

[technodup]

simoid said:

It’s surely quite difficult to think of an adjective that one could acceptably put ahead of “scum” without offending someone.

I'm not offended in the slightest really, same as I'm not offended if someone sings a naughty word at the football (that one's for you Burger). Offence is so st and pointless. It means nothing and gets you nowhere.

But then I'm an argumentative bd, and a triumphalist one at that, so I just revel in these muppets eternal failure to get what they want, be it Tories out, or indeed independence itself. What a lot of wasted Saturdays.

[Kccv23highliftcam]

SNP head back to their "roots"

Nicola Sturgeon urged to investigate claims SNP members promoted ‘vile anti-Semitic’ blog

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/general-ele...

The pro-Nationalist “Grouse Beater” blog, in a sweeping attack on last week’s two-day public sector strike in Glasgow, includes a section setting out Hitler’s opposition to trade unions and the dictator’s claim that Jews had assumed leadership of much of the movement.
The blog also criticises GMB union chief Rhea Wolfson over her role in the strikes. But it has met with angry reaction from Labour figures who point to the fact that Ms Wolfson is herself Jewish.

“This vile blog has been shared by the Livingston East SNP and Edinburgh East SNP social media accounts,” Labour’s West Lothian MSP Neil Findlay says in a letter to Ms Sturgeon today.

“It was also shared by West Lothian SNP councillors Frank Anderson and Carl John from their joint Facebook Page."



Sorry what was that you were saying 'burger?

[r11co]

hidetheelephants said:

no political party can sensibly contain people on the full width of the political spectrum that are only united in their belief in independence, any attempt to please all these factions must eventually collide with reality, especially when the party have the inconvenient burden of being in government.

Kccv23highliftcam said:

SNP head back to their "roots"

Nicola Sturgeon urged to investigate claims SNP members promoted ‘vile anti-Semitic’ blog

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/general-ele...

The pro-Nationalist “Grouse Beater” blog, in a sweeping attack on last week’s two-day public sector strike in Glasgow....

Nestling within that story is a cast-iron example. The SNP conned millions of traditional Labour voters into voting for them as the true socialists (after branding Labour the 'Red Tories'), yet here are their members reviling the trade union movement because it dares to to action against an SNP led council that has stalled and prevaricated over settling an issue that it used in its campaign to gain votes when it was in opposition.

I know now why Strocky doesn't comment any more in here, because just like Sturgeon he's now painted into a corner. The party he supports no longer aligns with his day-to-day beliefs outside of independence, and 'doing the wrong thing for the right reasons' becomes harder to swallow when it means supporting a party that...

• intervenes politically in the Freedom of Information process
• refuses to pay out in industrial disputes it has already lost
• presides over neglected, mismanaged and consequentially deteriorating public services

Edited by r11co on Tuesday 30th October 07:00

[technodup]

r11co said:

yet here are their members reviling the trade union movement because it dares to to action against an SNP led council that has stalled and prevaricated over settling an issue that it used in its campaign to gain votes when it was in opposition.

Presumably because this is really a historical Labour/union failure which has landed on the lap of the SNP (partly by their own doing admittedly). Which is funny, because they'll now carry the can for it.

And happily, I spoke to a customer yesterday who plans to spend her windfall with me. I'm thinking of running a wee marketing campaign on the back of it actually, there's gonna be a load of money floating about in the hands of people who aren't used to lump sum cash...

As an aside, why have I literally never seen or heard Richard Leonard speak? Where is he and wtf is he doing? I don't follow closely, or watch parochial Scottish TV but I'm always online and I see the others fairly regularly. I even saw Ruthy in her hospital bed the other day. If Labour can't get their act together we're stuck with these SNP cretins for a while yet. Thing is they don't realise that they are the 'least bad' option, just like the Tories are in the UK.

[Welshbeef]

So an extra £1billion in Scottish funding block grant.

Discuss

[simoid]

Welshbeef said:

So an extra £1billion in Scottish funding block grant.

Discuss

Derek MacKay said:

It’s another cut!

Would be interesting to see the fact check on that.

[simoid]

technodup said:

resumably because this is really a historical Labour/union failure which has landed on the lap of the SNP (partly by their own doing admittedly). Which is funny, because they'll now carry the can for it.

And happily, I spoke to a customer yesterday who plans to spend her windfall with me. I'm thinking of running a wee marketing campaign on the back of it actually, there's gonna be a load of money floating about in the hands of people who aren't used to lump sum cash...

As an aside, why have I literally never seen or heard Richard Leonard speak? Where is he and wtf is he doing? I don't follow closely, or watch parochial Scottish TV but I'm always online and I see the others fairly regularly. I even saw Ruthy in her hospital bed the other day. If Labour can't get their act together we're stuck with these SNP cretins for a while yet. Thing is they don't realise that they are the 'least bad' option, just like the Tories are in the UK.

Seems Neil Findlay does most of the talking eh.

[technodup]

simoid said:

Seems Neil Findlay does most of the talking eh.

Who?

And less of that eh bks, unless you want to sound like I imagine Edinburgher talks like

Ken like, eh?

[r11co]

technodup said:

r11co said:

yet here are their members reviling the trade union movement because it dares to to action against an SNP led council that has stalled and prevaricated over settling an issue that it used in its campaign to gain votes when it was in opposition.

Presumably because this is really a historical Labour/union failure which has landed on the lap of the SNP (partly by their own doing admittedly).

Entirely by their own doing. They actively courted these voters with their promise to see the gender pay gap closed, and Susan Aitken said as much on Radio Scotland when she was interviewed on the morning of the second day of the industrial action, then in the same sentence condemned the action stating that they had set a timetable for paying the money but wouldn't disclose what it was.

In other words - accept the votes on the promise to sort it when in office and then volte-face and piss directly on the people that voted you in. Whether you agree or disagree with the dispute itself it is the bare-faced contempt and arrogance of the self-righteous SNP politicians that beggars belief. They are actually making the Tories look moderate and considerate and they can't see it.

The list of failed 'progressive' election promises by the SNP beggars belief. Some historical examples...

• reduction of class sizes in secondary school English and Maths to 20
• scrap the 'unfair' council tax
• cancel student debt

Edited by r11co on Tuesday 30th October 09:44

[Welshbeef]

simoid said:

Welshbeef said:

So an extra £1billion in Scottish funding block grant.

Discuss

Derek MacKay said:

It’s another cut!

Would be interesting to see the fact check on that.

One of the key headlines in the budget

N Ireland get £350m and Wales c£500m


Also assuming that the Scottish Govt don’t increase the tax threasholds we might now see higher rate tax payers paying thousands more tax in Scotland v rUK.

[r11co]

Welshbeef said:

simoid said:

Welshbeef said:

So an extra £1billion in Scottish funding block grant. Discuss

Derek MacKay said:

It’s another cut!

Would be interesting to see the fact check on that.

One of the key headlines in the budget. N Ireland get £350m and Wales c£500m. Also assuming that the Scottish Govt don’t increase the tax threasholds we might now see higher rate tax payers paying thousands more tax in Scotland v rUK.

This very point was put to MacKay on BBC Scotland yesterday and he did what he always does - stick rigidly to a prepared answer that says nothing. MacKay has perfected the art of Orwellian doublethink - to state the opposite of the truth with conviction and keep repeating it.