Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 8
Discussion
Welshbeef said:
In addition trumps rightful statement when you go to any US city you’ll see American made cars and mercs BMW’s etc and many of them. When you go to a European country and city you never or hardly ever see an American vehicle. It doesn’t seem fair and nor is it so Trumo is rebalancing the state of play.
Both BMW and DB have assembly plants in the US. Plenty of Fords rolling off assembly lines in Europe and they get sold and driven. GM does plenty of business too, although the less said about Vauxhall and SAAB the better. This is low grade even by Trump standards of debate.hidetheelephants said:
Welshbeef said:
In addition trumps rightful statement when you go to any US city you’ll see American made cars and mercs BMW’s etc and many of them. When you go to a European country and city you never or hardly ever see an American vehicle. It doesn’t seem fair and nor is it so Trumo is rebalancing the state of play.
Both BMW and DB have assembly plants in the US. Plenty of Fords rolling off assembly lines in Europe and they get sold and driven. GM does plenty of business too, although the less said about Vauxhall and SAAB the better. This is low grade even by Trump standards of debate.EU firms will struggle
US will struggle less so as as stated not many sold.
Remember the other thing that Trump has a bee in his bonnet the fact Germany’s DM currency of old was exchanged at what is far too low a rate building in a permanent competitive advantage to the Germans. The Germans have a huge competitive advantage over most other EU € countries and you’ll see it in the trade surpluses and trade deficits of each country
Edinburger said:
I wonder if people campaigned against airports when perfectly good trains to London were available.
It's called progress, my son.
It's not progress just because you say it is. There are a LOT of people protesting about airports/runways right now, never mind back in the day.It's called progress, my son.
I'd usually favour the train anyway. Into the actual city, no faffing about with security, more space, an actual table, plug points, a better view, and the door to door journey time isn't much longer.
Edinburger said:
Ignore polls.
Sure...bury your head in the sand and ignore everything that gives the SNP criticism they are beyond reproach after all, everything they say is the honest truth and their rose tinted crystal ball shows an independent Scotland’s streets lined with gold.Get a grip and take off the blinkers, these people will ruin this country all they want to do is sit at the big boys table in some deluded fantasy that they think somehow they have a say in the world no one gives a flying Falkirk what they say...see how much respect Blackford has in THOC.
Welshbeef said:
Remember the other thing that Trump has a bee in his bonnet the fact Germany’s DM currency of old was exchanged at what is far too low a rate building in a permanent competitive advantage to the Germans. The Germans have a huge competitive advantage over most other EU € countries and you’ll see it in the trade surpluses and trade deficits of each country
Rest of Europe twigged on to that one far too late.......... Like fools they followed the pied piper into a corner. The entire EU project is run by Germany, for Germany and France get to hoover up the crumbs. Klippie said:
Murph7355 said:
But still enough do. Why?
)(My bad on numbers. 35 not 56 (that was 2015).
I agree that they do not speak for Scotland, which makes their remain bluster all the more ironic. But they obviously ha e plenty of support.... And I suspect it will likely increase again at the next GE only heightening the noise.
They can have all the seats in Scotland it won't do them the slightest bit of good as thier Tory Masters have already said they won't give the nod to a second referendum.)(My bad on numbers. 35 not 56 (that was 2015).
I agree that they do not speak for Scotland, which makes their remain bluster all the more ironic. But they obviously ha e plenty of support.... And I suspect it will likely increase again at the next GE only heightening the noise.
They have been bleating on about this like a barin wi a soor face since the day after their 2014 failure.
Their support is on the slide...that'll make her face even more torn.
https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/poll-scotti...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/poll-finds-1-in...
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2019/10/22/nic...
There also remains the spectre, no matter how unlikely, that ANOther of the main UK parties (OK, Labour
) could well be persuaded to give them another ref in return for coalition.I also don't understand them being voted back in based on their record in Scotland of actually doing meaningful, positive things.
Do people against the SNP just not bother turning up? Or is it a case of the non-SNP vote simply being split 2, 3+ ways and hence being ineffective?
Edinburger said:
The trams are also profitable.
I'm happy to be corrected, but if the operation we're talking about is Edinburgh Trams Ltd then they are far from being profitable. Accounts published for 2018 show an operating LOSS of £9.4million. The previous year was only profitable because there was no cost of infrastructure maintenance (no surprise in year one, £1.5million in 2018) and 2018 was the first year they had to pay £8.5m for infrastructure access (assume that was waived in the startup phase).In other words, the huge cost of putting all that dedicated infrastructure in place and maintaining it will likely doom the business to bankruptcy within a couple of years, unless La Sturgeon takes the cynical political decision that it'll be written off.
CambsBill said:
In other words, the huge cost of putting all that dedicated infrastructure in place and maintaining it will likely doom the business to bankruptcy within a couple of years, unless La Sturgeon takes the cynical political decision that it'll be written off.
Firstly, well done for calling out 'burgerbot's bullcrap!Secondly, we know exactly what will happen - it'll be taken into public ownership and the losses written off as per Prestwick Airport and Ferguson Marine. Why wouldn't they when it is rUK picking up the tab.
Next time 'burger says anything take it with a pinch of salt as he's clearly a purveyor of nationalist lies.
Murph7355 said:
Or is it a case of the non-SNP vote simply being split 2, 3+ ways and hence being ineffective?
This, unfortunately. It's the reason why I think an indyref rerun wouldn't be a bad thing as the non-SNP vote will be united. Once again the parallels with Canada/Quebec are apparent - a split opposition giving separatists a disproportionate voice.Edited by Evercross on Thursday 24th October 10:32
Evercross said:
This, unfortunately. It's the reason why I think an indyref rerun wouldn't be a bad thing as the non-SNP vote will be united. Once again the parallels with Canada/Quebec are apparent - a split opposition giving separatists a disproportionate voice.
Won't you just be left with the same carp after IndyRef2 though?Someone needs to come forth and unite the non-SNP voice. I guess Ruth Davidson might have been doing this to a degree. Shame she has other priorities at the moment.
It almost needs another party being spun up that isn't Conservative, Labour or LibDem but is non-SNP.
CambsBill said:
Edinburger said:
The trams are also profitable.
I'm happy to be corrected, but if the operation we're talking about is Edinburgh Trams Ltd then they are far from being profitable. Accounts published for 2018 show an operating LOSS of £9.4million. The previous year was only profitable because there was no cost of infrastructure maintenance (no surprise in year one, £1.5million in 2018) and 2018 was the first year they had to pay £8.5m for infrastructure access (assume that was waived in the startup phase).In other words, the huge cost of putting all that dedicated infrastructure in place and maintaining it will likely doom the business to bankruptcy within a couple of years, unless La Sturgeon takes the cynical political decision that it'll be written off.
Edinburger said:
Massive issue. Jobs are at risk.
seems to be plenty opportunity for jobs on the new forth crossing. since it was "finished" i can't remember a night it hasn't been down to one lane in at least one direction with umpteen people working on it. also plenty jobs in road maintenance. again i can't remember the last time i travelled east coast to south west without major road works. every single main route south of the tay has been a shambles on a regular basis this year, just about given up on using a702 recently despite it being one of my favourite driving roads.
the snp have failed badly in education and infrastructure , i wonder what they will fubar next. they did a good job at council level around here but have been a disaster when they had to step up to the next level.
Murph7355 said:
Won't you just be left with the same carp after IndyRef2 though?
Someone needs to come forth and unite the non-SNP voice. I guess Ruth Davidson might have been doing this to a degree. Shame she has other priorities at the moment.
It almost needs another party being spun up that isn't Conservative, Labour or LibDem but is non-SNP.
Let’s start a new party:Someone needs to come forth and unite the non-SNP voice. I guess Ruth Davidson might have been doing this to a degree. Shame she has other priorities at the moment.
It almost needs another party being spun up that isn't Conservative, Labour or LibDem but is non-SNP.
The SNP are anti democratic, so let’s maybe use “democratic” in the title.
And the SNP are nationalists, so I’ll go with Unionist. Nice and simple.
“The Democratic Unionist Party”.
Sorted
bp1 said:
Murph7355 said:
Do people against the SNP just not bother turning up? Or is it a case of the non-SNP vote simply being split 2, 3+ ways and hence being ineffective?
The later.Murph7355 said:
Evercross said:
This, unfortunately. It's the reason why I think an indyref rerun wouldn't be a bad thing as the non-SNP vote will be united. Once again the parallels with Canada/Quebec are apparent - a split opposition giving separatists a disproportionate voice.
Won't you just be left with the same carp after IndyRef2 though?The parallels with Canada are there to see - the Quebecois are now a shadow of their former selves having fallen from a great high after losing a second referendum by a slightly bigger margin than the first (and thanks to Angus Robertson we can see the same trajectory in Scotland). They struggle to come up with policies because their separatist agenda has been been twice rejected by the electorate and they cannot otherwise distinguish themselves from the other parties.
wc98 said:
seems to be plenty opportunity for jobs on the new forth crossing. since it was "finished" i can't remember a night it hasn't been down to one lane in at least one direction with umpteen people working on it.
also plenty jobs in road maintenance. again i can't remember the last time i travelled east coast to south west without major road works. every single main route south of the tay has been a shambles on a regular basis this year, just about given up on using a702 recently despite it being one of my favourite driving roads.
the snp have failed badly in education and infrastructure , i wonder what they will fubar next. they did a good job at council level around here but have been a disaster when they had to step up to the next level.
Your right. The roads and trains in Wales, Ulster and England are a dream to drive on, almost Germany-esque, no road works, free flowing roads in all directions, modern train fleets with no delays. Only Scotland's road and rail infrastucure is pish. also plenty jobs in road maintenance. again i can't remember the last time i travelled east coast to south west without major road works. every single main route south of the tay has been a shambles on a regular basis this year, just about given up on using a702 recently despite it being one of my favourite driving roads.
the snp have failed badly in education and infrastructure , i wonder what they will fubar next. they did a good job at council level around here but have been a disaster when they had to step up to the next level.
Gies peace. Infrastructure over the entire UK is s
te - not strictly a Scotland only issue.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff