Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 8
Discussion
Edinburger said:
Scotland is a country, not a nation.
It does seem unclear ... but it is most definitely not an nation state or independent country Definitions From google :
Scotland is not an independent country or state, and neither are Wales, Northern Ireland, or England itself. However, Scotland is most certainly a nation of people living in an internal division of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Or
“Scotland, England, Wales, and Northern Ireland are not independent countries but are four somewhat autonomous regions which are part of the country known as the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland or just United Kingdom for short”
That is quite an incredible charge sheet against him. 
So if he is found guilty and all those sexual allegations are correct and it turns out oor wee Alex is actually a rampant sex predator, then one could well presume that there is a high probability there will be other women with a story to tell also?
I wonder if nasty Nicky has had any late night encounters she would rather keep secret, they must have spent many long hours together whilst he was First Minister.
Is there any chance Sturgeon will have to attend the trial at any point?
So if he is found guilty and all those sexual allegations are correct and it turns out oor wee Alex is actually a rampant sex predator, then one could well presume that there is a high probability there will be other women with a story to tell also?
I wonder if nasty Nicky has had any late night encounters she would rather keep secret, they must have spent many long hours together whilst he was First Minister.
Is there any chance Sturgeon will have to attend the trial at any point?
Pastor Of Muppets said:
That is quite an incredible charge sheet against him.
Is it though? Most of them read as if he's tried it on, been rebuffed and that's that. Not becoming of a married man, nor a FM, but sexual assault? The 'intention to rape' one is a bit different to touching a leg over clothing stuff though.Can't believe I'm defending Salmond, but I think this metoo b
ks has gone too far.technodup said:
Pastor Of Muppets said:
That is quite an incredible charge sheet against him.
Is it though? Most of them read as if he's tried it on, been rebuffed and that's that. Not becoming of a married man, nor a FM, but sexual assault? The 'intention to rape' one is a bit different to touching a leg over clothing stuff though.Can't believe I'm defending Salmond, but I think this metoo b
ks has gone too far.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-po...
#1 on a number of occasions
#2 is the same woman as #1
#3 repeatedly
#4 sounds like an isolated incident
#5 various occasions
#6 is not "trying it on"
#7 and #8 is the same woman. repeated.
#9 is a textbook sexual assault
#10 is the same woman as #9
Mostly just trying it on????
Why do you read this and conclude that it sounds like "metoo b
ks"? These are offenses that he's been charged with, no longer are they simply accusations.technodup said:
s it though? Most of them read as if he's tried it on, been rebuffed and that's that. Not becoming of a married man, nor a FM, but sexual assault? The 'intention to rape' one is a bit different to touching a leg over clothing stuff though.
The problem is the law on the issue is a minefield and the mechanically awkward sounding descriptions of the incidents are and attempt to ensure whatever slimy brief Salmond has hired has problems casting doubt on the victims' accounts.Salmond isn't exactly David Gandy so I cannot imagine he would find himself in so many situations so easily without some form of coercion.
Its an emotive topic and I'm oot discussing it until the case starts and we get to hear more evidence.
I'll leave these here in the meantime...
Caption for the second one.......?!
technodup said:
s it though? Most of them read as if he's tried it on, been rebuffed and that's that. Not becoming of a married man, nor a FM, but sexual assault? The 'intention to rape' one is a bit different to touching a leg over clothing stuff though.
Can't believe I'm defending Salmond, but I think this metoo bks has gone too far.
Possibly some of the charges could well be a bit ott, but there are rape allegations there also, and that warrantsCan't believe I'm defending Salmond, but I think this metoo b
ks has gone too far.the utmost scrutiny, add in the fact this is not about a single person against Salmond, its 10 different women apparently.
Any sex predator that has 10 women accusing him of assault almost certainly will have other victims who haven't come
forward, you have to wonder what else has he done we dont know about. And of course it could also be a pack of lies
and he is innocent, who knows, its all just speculation, but at this point it most certainly isn't looking good for Salmond.
Breaking my own rule here already. I am a little surprised that none of the charges relate to incidents in Edinburgh Airport, because I know for a fact that some female staff there were advised not to be alone in the VIP corridor with Salmond, before they eventually removed his access to it.
Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
Edited by Evercross on Thursday 21st November 11:34
Evercross said:
Breaking my own rule here already. I am a little surprised that none of the charges relate to incidents in Edinburgh Airport, because I know for a fact that some female staff there were advised not to be alone in the VIP corridor with Salmond.
Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
It may be because of the height of the hurdle to get from 'alleged incident' to 'charged with' - witnesses, evidence, chance of successful prosecution etc.Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
Pastor Of Muppets said:
Any sex predator that has 10 women accusing him of assault almost certainly will have other victims who haven't come
forward, you have to wonder what else has he done we dont know about. And of course it could also be a pack of lies
and he is innocent, who knows, its all just speculation, but at this point it most certainly isn't looking good for Salmond.
Agreed, I only skim read the list but it seemed several were about touching legs or arms above clothing. I don't see that as sexual assault, full stop. If however it's the same person repeatedly then I can see it would be harassment, absolutely.forward, you have to wonder what else has he done we dont know about. And of course it could also be a pack of lies
and he is innocent, who knows, its all just speculation, but at this point it most certainly isn't looking good for Salmond.
We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
technodup said:
greed, I only skim read the list but it seemed several were about touching legs or arms above clothing. I don't see that as sexual assault, full stop. If however it's the same person repeatedly then I can see it would be harassment, absolutely.
We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
Arms or shoulder no, some people do grab someone's arm while greeting them, or you sometimes need to gently tap someone on the arm or shoulder to get their attention.We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
I would say leg is out though, maybe it's not as far as sexual assualt but it's crossed a line into weird or creepy for sure.
technodup said:
greed, I only skim read the list but it seemed several were about touching legs or arms above clothing.
...as well as breasts, buttocks, removal of clothing!It is all about establishing a pattern of behaviour.......
technodup said:
We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
Not at all. The physical contact is not what makes it sexual assault, it is intent and that is the thing that has to be proven.Edited by Evercross on Thursday 21st November 11:49
kev1974 said:
technodup said:
greed, I only skim read the list but it seemed several were about touching legs or arms above clothing. I don't see that as sexual assault, full stop. If however it's the same person repeatedly then I can see it would be harassment, absolutely.
We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
Arms or shoulder no, some people do grab someone's arm while greeting them, or you sometimes need to gently tap someone on the arm or shoulder to get their attention.We seem to be getting to a stage where any contact with a female (or male) warrants explicit prior verbal consent, and I don't think that's practical nor desirable.
I would say leg is out though, maybe it's not as far as sexual assault but it's crossed a line into weird or creepy for sure.
I think there are plenty of men who need to be reminded where the line between friendly and creepy sits. It's not the sort of thing most blokes get wrong, so there's no excuse. If it helps, imagine any woman you meet as being a relative of yours; mother, sister, daughter, niece perhaps?
Edinburger said:
feef said:
Evercross said:
warch said:
Edinburger said:
You mean the way Scotland voted 62% / 38% in the Brexit referendum?
Or London? 60%/40%But to quote a 'burger trope, we've done this to death. The UK voted, not the regions.
feef said:
Edinburger said:
feef said:
Evercross said:
warch said:
Edinburger said:
You mean the way Scotland voted 62% / 38% in the Brexit referendum?
Or London? 60%/40%But to quote a 'burger trope, we've done this to death. The UK voted, not the regions.
Pastor Of Muppets said:
I wonder if nasty Nicky has had any late night encounters she would rather keep secret, they must have spent many long hours together whilst he was First Minister.
Only in her wildest dreams. Even Salmond wouldn't go there - term I've heard is.... 'even the tide wouldn't take her out'Evercross said:
technodup said:
greed, I only skim read the list but it seemed several were about touching legs or arms above clothing.
...as well as breasts, buttocks, removal of clothing!It is all about establishing a pattern of behaviour.......
rossub said:
Pastor Of Muppets said:
I wonder if nasty Nicky has had any late night encounters she would rather keep secret, they must have spent many long hours together whilst he was First Minister.
Only in her wildest dreams. Even Salmond wouldn't go there - term I've heard is.... 'even the tide wouldn't take her out'One thing that occurred to me though after reading the extended BBC article about Nicola Sturgeon's political history. Apparently Alex stepped in to run for leader of the SNP a second time, with Sturgeon as deputy only after Sturgeon entered herself as leader and was in line to get trounced by Rosanna Cunningham. Cunningham is IMO a step too far, even for Slimy Salmond.
Evercross said:
Breaking my own rule here already. I am a little surprised that none of the charges relate to incidents in Edinburgh Airport, because I know for a fact that some female staff there were advised not to be alone in the VIP corridor with Salmond, before they eventually removed his access to it.
Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
Is that true? Wow. Could of course just be because he had a 'reputation'.
Edited by Evercross on Thursday 21st November 11:34
Where is the VIP corridor?
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