Will May Pay or Hope it Fades Away? £55b exit bill...
Discussion
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
p1stonhead said:
Robertj21a said:
p1stonhead said:
Are you actually brain damaged? I was asking what you didnt like! Do you actually have any reasons?
If we were at a nightclub and you went 'I hate this im leaving', you dont think a reasonable question from someone would be 'how come mate whats wrong with it?'
I give up. Either English isn't your first language or you're simply Trolling.If we were at a nightclub and you went 'I hate this im leaving', you dont think a reasonable question from someone would be 'how come mate whats wrong with it?'
Edited by p1stonhead on Friday 24th November 13:19
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
Eddie Strohacker said:
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.
You seem comfortable with the current system having written off two generations. Why do you think populism is on the rise so much in the developed world?Brexit is just a small part of this, the rise in populism is the only real threat to the EU long term, where the policies in place drive a political fragmentation that overwhelms the political project. Brexit is just a sideshow to the main game
Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 24th November 16:40
s2art said:
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
Mrr T said:
s2art said:
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
jsf said:
You seem comfortable with the current system having written off two generations. Why do you think populism is on the rise so much in the developed world?
Brexit is just a small part of this, the rise in populism is the only real threat to the EU long term, where the policies in place drive a political fragmentation that overwhelms the political project. Brexit is just a sideshow to the main game
I don't accept the premise. The countries you have in mind struggle independently of the EU. It's a classic Brexiteer trope that pushed correlation & causation & it;s been done to death. We're not them, we're an entirely different proposition purposely shooting ourselves in the face.Brexit is just a small part of this, the rise in populism is the only real threat to the EU long term, where the policies in place drive a political fragmentation that overwhelms the political project. Brexit is just a sideshow to the main game
Edited by jsf on Friday 24th November 16:40
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
- excellent. I needed a good laugh this evening. Thanks ! Eddie Strohacker said:
jsf said:
You seem comfortable with the current system having written off two generations. Why do you think populism is on the rise so much in the developed world?
Brexit is just a small part of this, the rise in populism is the only real threat to the EU long term, where the policies in place drive a political fragmentation that overwhelms the political project. Brexit is just a sideshow to the main game
I don't accept the premise. The countries you have in mind struggle independently of the EU. It's a classic Brexiteer trope that pushed correlation & causation & it;s been done to death. We're not them, we're an entirely different proposition purposely shooting ourselves in the face.Brexit is just a small part of this, the rise in populism is the only real threat to the EU long term, where the policies in place drive a political fragmentation that overwhelms the political project. Brexit is just a sideshow to the main game
Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 24th November 16:40
You seriously cant look at the politics of the last 20 years and not see whats coming down the line? It's the only thing that will stop the EU becoming a state long term. UK doesn't matter, we were always a periphery issue to where the mainland politics will develop. We would have been a nice addition to drag along, but we aren't a game changer for the way the EU develops.
Mrr T said:
Whist I had always been concerned about a lack of democracy in the EU the referendum made me reconsider the issue. When I did I had to conclude that whist the EU may not be democratic it was difficult to complain since I already lived in one of the least democratic countries in Europe.
With about 400 seats so safe they will never change hands. The fact is less than 25% (in a close election 7%) of voters will decide the government. With a second chamber made up of those who gained favour with a king several hundred years ago, and a majority who’s only qualification is years of sucking at the public teat. Where is takes 7% more voters of one party to elect an MP than the other (thanks TM for losing the boundary review).
Maybe we should have sorted out the UK.
PR systems have their own problems as well. Chiefly that virtually every government has to be coalition one and smaller parties have disproportionate power. With about 400 seats so safe they will never change hands. The fact is less than 25% (in a close election 7%) of voters will decide the government. With a second chamber made up of those who gained favour with a king several hundred years ago, and a majority who’s only qualification is years of sucking at the public teat. Where is takes 7% more voters of one party to elect an MP than the other (thanks TM for losing the boundary review).
Maybe we should have sorted out the UK.
The advantages of the FPTP system are that it offers decisive government, developing problems IMO, are mainly due to constituency boundaries not being regularly updated and a breakdown of national parties being represented in all regions of the UK. We might moan about FPTP but looking back it is hard to disagree with the result of any election of the past 30 years, only really with margins of victory.
As long as the HOL is only a weak constraint on the HOC it doesn't matter that much it is chiefly a retirement home for old politicians plus a few independents.
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Nobody is 'writing off a generation'. Where on earth do you get these ridiculous ideas ?
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
Your words mostly.Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
[Don't bother, it's obvious that you try to deflect questions when you haven't got an answer]
Mrr T said:
s2art said:
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
eccles said:
How can a smaller party have disproportionate power when the system is proportionate representation? 
Take a look at whats happening in Germany today.Shultz very well could drive the policy if Merkel feels so threatened with what would happen if she fails to create a coalition, after she failed to create Jamaica work. Despite just 1 week ago Shultz saying he wouldn't form a coalition again, he is back in talks with Merkel this evening.
jsf said:
eccles said:
How can a smaller party have disproportionate power when the system is proportionate representation?
Take a look at whats happening in Germany today.Shultz very well could drive the policy if Merkel feels so threatened with what would happen if she fails to create a coalition, after she failed to create Jamaica work. Despite just 1 week ago Shultz saying he wouldn't form a coalition again, he is back in talks with Merkel this evening.
don'tbesilly said:
Mrr T said:
s2art said:
mx5nut said:
Robertj21a said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
Robertj21a said:
Not sure why you focus on 'sovereignty' and border control ? - I've never mentioned either as my reasons for wanting to leave.
Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
You would write off a generation for Brexit? I doubt even Farage in his wettest dreams would contemplate that.Personally, I look to the long term. If the UK will be more prosperous outside the EU in the longer term then that suits me (and many others) just fine - 10 years is fine, 20 years is a bit of a pain but still worth it for the next generations.
Do you seriously believe that even a bad/Hard Brexit will be of such enormous consequence that a whole generation will have to be written off ?
still can't answer a question even when asked about what they posted 
We are leaving on WTO, so you can all pat yourselves on the back for believing in a bunch of gangsters rather than your own Country - NOBODY knows what will happen, but 17m+ are prepared to unshackle ourselves for the long term benefit of this Country
jsf said:
Thankfully we are not them.
You seriously cant look at the politics of the last 20 years and not see whats coming down the line? It's the only thing that will stop the EU becoming a state long term. UK doesn't matter, we were always a periphery issue to where the mainland politics will develop. We would have been a nice addition to drag along, but we aren't a game changer for the way the EU develops.
I don't share your paranoid vision. The terms of our membership belie it. You've made a choice based on extrapolation not borne out by facts imo & informed by decades of poisonous nationalist narrative & that's your business. You seriously cant look at the politics of the last 20 years and not see whats coming down the line? It's the only thing that will stop the EU becoming a state long term. UK doesn't matter, we were always a periphery issue to where the mainland politics will develop. We would have been a nice addition to drag along, but we aren't a game changer for the way the EU develops.
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