Term-time holiday dad loses court battle
Discussion
surveyor said:
nadger said:
From the context of my reply, quite demonstrably not!
Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Your actually arguing about catching up with a teacher who has seen it and done it?Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Edited by nadger on Friday 14th April 08:33
Always amuses me when I see people advocating making children catch up work after any absence by working through lunch breaks and staying behind after school.
Do you fancy doing that? Been off sick at work? On holiday? When you get back, spend two weeks working through lunch and staying after work for an hour to catch up your work!
Why do we treat children so abominably? A few days of missed school will NOT destroy their life chances, whatever people with a vested interested in oppressing and controlling children's lives might think.
Do you fancy doing that? Been off sick at work? On holiday? When you get back, spend two weeks working through lunch and staying after work for an hour to catch up your work!
Why do we treat children so abominably? A few days of missed school will NOT destroy their life chances, whatever people with a vested interested in oppressing and controlling children's lives might think.
nadger said:
surveyor said:
nadger said:
From the context of my reply, quite demonstrably not!
Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Your actually arguing about catching up with a teacher who has seen it and done it?Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Edited by nadger on Friday 14th April 08:33
I really think it would be quite easy for the government to set up a website which could provide the curriculum (already there) with some resources on each point. Take the onus off the schools. Give the parents more visibility of what is being taught and more opportunity to help their children at home.
For me, why the child is off school matters little. these new fines have not changed things one iota, yet improvements in healthcare have done so. The child has no choice in either situation. It is the child we are trying to support here, and it can sometimes feel against the wishes of the parents!
Efbe said:
nadger said:
surveyor said:
nadger said:
From the context of my reply, quite demonstrably not!
Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Your actually arguing about catching up with a teacher who has seen it and done it?Illness is unavoidable unfortunately and of course teachers should support students in catching up if they have been absent as a result of this.
Holidays during term time are totally avoidable and requiring teachers to provide work for students in abstentia is additional pressure on an already substantial workload. Of course you can say what topics you're covering, but in subjects such as DT, or languages for instance, will the student be able to complete the work without the teachers' support/imput? Some will, of course, but the majority probably won't. That means then after college/lunchtime sessions need to be put on for them. Fair?
Edited by nadger on Friday 14th April 08:33
I really think it would be quite easy for the government to set up a website which could provide the curriculum (already there) with some resources on each point. Take the onus off the schools. Give the parents more visibility of what is being taught and more opportunity to help their children at home.
For me, why the child is off school matters little. these new fines have not changed things one iota, yet improvements in healthcare have done so. The child has no choice in either situation. It is the child we are trying to support here, and it can sometimes feel against the wishes of the parents!
CaptainSlow said:
surveyor said:
CaptainSlow said:
surveyor said:
Your actually arguing about catching up with a teacher who has seen it and done it?
You'reYou may have missed that lesson.
I've got three kids of school age, and I think this is a great outcome. In the ideal world, the fine dished out should be increased to three times the cost of the holiday taken, just to ensure that there's no possible benefit to it.
I chose to have my kids, knowing that holidays would be more expensive. If people have a problem with that, maybe they shouldn't have had kids?
It's bloody infuriating when selfish parents do take their kids out of class, as it just means that everyone else's kids' education gets disrupted when their darling little cherubs get back and the teachers have to bring them up to speed with what they've missed.
Interestingly, the parents who do take their kids out during term time rarely seem to be in the lower wage brackets either.
I chose to have my kids, knowing that holidays would be more expensive. If people have a problem with that, maybe they shouldn't have had kids?
It's bloody infuriating when selfish parents do take their kids out of class, as it just means that everyone else's kids' education gets disrupted when their darling little cherubs get back and the teachers have to bring them up to speed with what they've missed.
Interestingly, the parents who do take their kids out during term time rarely seem to be in the lower wage brackets either.
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
zarjaz1991 said:
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
NWTony said:
zarjaz1991 said:
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
zarjaz1991 said:
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
Kermit power said:
With the possible exception of declaring a different holiday for all pupils so that all parents can take their kids away on cheaper holidays, in what circumstance can you see letting parents take kids out of school during term time being in the best interests of the other kids in their class?
The point is not for it to be to the benefit of other students, the point is for it to benefit the student in question without hindering the other students.If that will not happen and it will hinder either the student in question or the other students, in the teacher's opinion, then the holiday should not be granted.
NWTony said:
zarjaz1991 said:
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
Countdown said:
Hypothetically speaking - if Jemima's way ahead of the rest of her class, "gifted and talented", parents make her do 2 hours worth of homework every hour, and spend every waking moment ferrying her between chess club, debating society, gymkhana, and KidsUKIP, shouldn't they trust the parents' judgement slightly more than those of Keanu and KylieKim whose parents kick them out of the house at 7:30am and tell them not to return before 7:30pm?
Jemima might be gifted and talented and great at almost everything but just no good at long division - which is what's up next week. Whilst KylieKim Kardashian might have no need to partake in the holiday festivities week in a December and would be far better served going to visit uncle Javier in Spain - the uncle who has been the one positive role model in her life to datE.nadger said:
NWTony said:
zarjaz1991 said:
sealtt said:
Leave it to school/teacher's discretion. There are some situations in term where a few days off will make no difference to a particular student, some where it will. Let the teacher make the judgement call and then back up that judgement call with the LAW.
Wait....you mean.....trust people who have professional qualifications and experience in the field, and have personal knowledge of the situation? Trust them to make a sensible decision that's in everybody's best interests?I'm sorry, we don't do that sort of thing in this country any more.
Equally there could be bias in favour of families known to the teacher / school.
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