Should remainers vote for the Libs?
Discussion
citizensm1th said:
Likes Fast Cars said:
Brexit is one factor in as much as Maggie May is looking to get the whingers and f
kers out of the way so she can get on with the job of managing the country and negotiating Brexit. The GE campaign manifestos (for all parties) will be across a range of different policy areas as sidicks says, not just Brexit.
Of course the Lib Dums well live up to their reputation of campaigning on vapour policies, in this case reversing on Brexit &/or another referendum or some other equally absurd and undeliverable promise.
https://www.conservatives.com/kers out of the way so she can get on with the job of managing the country and negotiating Brexit. The GE campaign manifestos (for all parties) will be across a range of different policy areas as sidicks says, not just Brexit.Of course the Lib Dums well live up to their reputation of campaigning on vapour policies, in this case reversing on Brexit &/or another referendum or some other equally absurd and undeliverable promise.
Our great leaders own words
"We need an election now to secure the strong and stable leadership the country needs to see us through Brexit and beyond".
"Getting on with the job and making Brexit work is the most important task the Government faces today. Our future prosperity, our place in the world, and our standard of living all depend on getting the next five years right".
"Every single vote for Theresa May and the Conservatives is a vote for strong and stable leadership in the national interest. It is a vote to strengthen Britain’s negotiating position to ensure we get the best Brexit deal possible, and it is a vote to strengthen our economy".
But Hey PH knows better right?
as she said:
"...and it is a vote to strengthen our economy".
sidicks said:
So NOT all about Brexit after all.
just wow, id say it was pretty central to the tories campain ,do you need me to explain the meaning of "central to the torys campain" to you?or are you going to just fly off on your own (totally twisted interpretation) of my words again
sidicks said:
Please can you explain, if I don't want Brexit, but I think the Lib Dems are a bunch of incompetent weasels as far as running the economy is concerned, who should I vote for?
You vote for who you want to i would not presume to tell a person of your great intellect how to vote.Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th April 20:19
as a remoaner myself i shall be voting Tory
citizensm1th said:
You vote for who you want to i would not presume to tell a person of your great intellect how to vote.
as a remoaner myself i shall be voting Tory
So your vote is nothing to do with Brexit then, yet you claim the GE is 'all about Brexit'. Righto.as a remoaner myself i shall be voting Tory
Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th April 20:40
sidicks said:
citizensm1th said:
You vote for who you want to i would not presume to tell a person of your great intellect how to vote.
as a remoaner myself i shall be voting Tory
So your vote is nothing to do with Brexit then, yet you claim the GE is 'all about Brexit'. Righto.as a remoaner myself i shall be voting Tory
Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th April 20:40
citizensm1th said:
My first thought when our great leader called this election was to vote liberal, however after thinking about it for a while i think for remainers and the left in this country a conservative victory will in the long term be a good thing.
The chances of the outcome of brexit being all things to all sides are practically zero
For leavers there will be compromises that sections of brexiteers will not be happy with and the same for remainers, who ever is in power in the next 2 to 4 years is going to be criticised from both sides
A given i am not convinced it is going to be a happy separation from the EU and that it will have consequences for both our economy and our society that i dont believe will be for the good i cant wait for our new tory government.
a poison chalice indeed
I want the torys to "own" brexit.The chances of the outcome of brexit being all things to all sides are practically zero
For leavers there will be compromises that sections of brexiteers will not be happy with and the same for remainers, who ever is in power in the next 2 to 4 years is going to be criticised from both sides
A given i am not convinced it is going to be a happy separation from the EU and that it will have consequences for both our economy and our society that i dont believe will be for the good i cant wait for our new tory government.
a poison chalice indeed
sidicks said:
citizensm1th said:
Idiot you should go back and read my posts carefully try reading it out loud it may help you to comprehend.
This one?citizensm1th said:
ergo this GE is all about brexit.
or this one:citizensm1th said:
as a remoaner myself
pitiful
citizensm1th said:
You actually think your proving/winning something here don't you
pitiful
To be clear, you want the UK to remain in the EU, but you aren't going to vote for the one party that offers that opportunity, yet you claim that the GE is 'all about Brexit'?pitiful
Seems to be that you think economic competence is more important than Brexit!
I think that covers it!
Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th April 21:20
sidicks said:
citizensm1th said:
You actually think your proving/winning something here don't you
pitiful
To be clear, you want the UK to remain in the EU, but you aren't going to vote for the one party that offers that opportunity, yet you claim that the GE is 'all about Brexit'?pitiful
Seems to be that you think economic competence is more important than Brexit!
I think that covers it!
Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th April 21:20
you have confirmed you are indeed a moron. i was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt but you have shown once again you will ignore anything anyone you disagree with posts and substitute it with your own imagined rantings and misconstrued dribble.
the floor is yours please do continue to confirm our view.
citizensm1th said:
what ever, this is a virtual form of bashing my head against a brick wall
you have confirmed you are indeed a moron. i was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt but you have shown once again you will ignore anything anyone you disagree with posts and substitute it with your own imagined rantings and misconstrued dribble.
the floor is yours please do continue to confirm our view.
You have confirmed that your own views are inconsistent with each other - i think that makes you the 'moron'!you have confirmed you are indeed a moron. i was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt but you have shown once again you will ignore anything anyone you disagree with posts and substitute it with your own imagined rantings and misconstrued dribble.
the floor is yours please do continue to confirm our view.
sidicks said:
You have confirmed that your own views are inconsistent with each other - i think that makes you the 'moron'!
No, he explained why a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
these are not inconsistent views. It depends on whether you think brexit is reversible at this stage. it is entirely logical to consider we are on a path of no return (though I still consider there are options), and hence damaging the party that brought us damaging brexit is a protest vote of sorts. hoist and petard and all that.
///ajd said:
No, he explained why
a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
Why does he want the Tories to 'own the consequences of Brexit'?a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
///ajd said:
these are not inconsistent views. It depends on whether you think brexit is reversible at this stage. it is entirely logical to consider we are on a path of no return (though I still consider there are options), and hence damaging the party that brought us damaging brexit is a protest vote of sorts. hoist and petard and all that.
Do you think that everyone that votes for the Lib Dems is doing so on the basis of their views on Brexit?sidicks said:
///ajd said:
No, he explained why
a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
Why does he want the Tories to 'own the consequences of Brexit'?a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
///ajd said:
these are not inconsistent views. It depends on whether you think brexit is reversible at this stage. it is entirely logical to consider we are on a path of no return (though I still consider there are options), and hence damaging the party that brought us damaging brexit is a protest vote of sorts. hoist and petard and all that.
Do you think that everyone that votes for the Lib Dems is doing so on the basis of their views on Brexit?2. no. the PH poll shows lib dem votes are about 75% brexit protest vote
sidicks said:
cookie118 said:
sidicks said:
The only party suggesting that they won't "implement the will of the people" hasn't got a credible chance of being able to implement that promise, so it's somewhat academic!
So the result of a general election would not be the will of the people?2) the will of the people on the EU position cannot be gauged from the results of the General Election - people are voting on a large number of different issues
2) So in response to this you would be ok with a Brexit that retains the 'four freedoms' our contributions to the EU and some form of control of the ECJ over our courts? Because the will of the people regarding these points cannot be decided by the referendum-people were voting based on a large number of different issues.
cookie118 said:
sidicks said:
cookie118 said:
sidicks said:
The only party suggesting that they won't "implement the will of the people" hasn't got a credible chance of being able to implement that promise, so it's somewhat academic!
So the result of a general election would not be the will of the people?2) the will of the people on the EU position cannot be gauged from the results of the General Election - people are voting on a large number of different issues
2) So in response to this you would be ok with a Brexit that retains the 'four freedoms' our contributions to the EU and some form of control of the ECJ over our courts? Because the will of the people regarding these points cannot be decided by the referendum-people were voting based on a large number of different issues.
cookie118 said:
1) But if a party is elected into government and it is a key pledge of their manifesto then surely that also represents the will of the people?
As above, with a GE it's much harder to say that, because people are clearly voting with a number of different things in mind. With the referendum it was a single question and there was no ambiguity.Of course, as above, it's purely a theoretical question as it won't come close to happening.
cookie118 said:
2) So in response to this you would be ok with a Brexit that retains the 'four freedoms' our contributions to the EU and some form of control of the ECJ over our courts? Because the will of the people regarding these points cannot be decided by the referendum-people were voting based on a large number of different issues.
A poor analogy - it what way would that be 'leaving the EU'?///ajd said:
sidicks said:
You have confirmed that your own views are inconsistent with each other - i think that makes you the 'moron'!
No, he explained why a) it is about Brexit
b) he is voting tory to ensure they own the consequences - which will stick to the party and the perpetrators like a very bad smell - in due course
these are not inconsistent views. It depends on whether you think brexit is reversible at this stage. it is entirely logical to consider we are on a path of no return (though I still consider there are options), and hence damaging the party that brought us damaging brexit is a protest vote of sorts. hoist and petard and all that.
That's one of the daftest strategies I've heard.
I don't see how people can call themselves remoaners or remainers then vote for a Conservative candidate, it doesn't make sense unless they were never really remainers..
herewego said:
You think that people will vote Tory to ensure brexit goes ahead so that if it turns out to have been a stupid move they can poke fun at the Tories?
That's one of the daftest strategies I've heard.
I don't see how people can call themselves remoaners or remainers then vote for a Conservative candidate, it doesn't make sense unless they were never really remainers..
In a General Election (most) people will vote for their chosen party based on a number of (potentially) conflicting issues.That's one of the daftest strategies I've heard.
I don't see how people can call themselves remoaners or remainers then vote for a Conservative candidate, it doesn't make sense unless they were never really remainers..
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