Explosions reported in Manchester?
Discussion
Read this link. Yes they have an angle, the accusations are though very specific. Also the Imam, Graf is on record giving a I escaped Gaddafi story rather than what has emerged from reputable sources like the FT that clearly evidence he fought alongside the extremists.
https://www.globalmbwatch.com/2017/05/24/featured-...
Here is more on the leader who we banned from our country under Cameron
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com...
So we ban him physically but let his teachings continue through the likes of Imam Graf.
These people will use our very freedoms against us and meanwhile politicians like Andy Burnham remain quiet. I apologise he's busy sharing a hash tag #westandtogether
Lucy Powell, the local MP gives a car crash of an interview on the BBC. People really need to dig it out, it was on Andrew Marr.
Meanwhile journalists who have the power to speak out seem reluctant.
I won't apologise for not standing together with vermin.
https://www.globalmbwatch.com/2017/05/24/featured-...
Here is more on the leader who we banned from our country under Cameron
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com...
So we ban him physically but let his teachings continue through the likes of Imam Graf.
These people will use our very freedoms against us and meanwhile politicians like Andy Burnham remain quiet. I apologise he's busy sharing a hash tag #westandtogether
Lucy Powell, the local MP gives a car crash of an interview on the BBC. People really need to dig it out, it was on Andrew Marr.
Meanwhile journalists who have the power to speak out seem reluctant.
I won't apologise for not standing together with vermin.
Wonder if this will be brought up at the inquest (or the public inquiry if one is held) or will it be brushed under the carpet on national security grounds?
Libya and the Manchester connection. There is a link between the woeful Manchester attack and the dubious methods the UK used to help Libyans topple Gaddafi.
Libya and the Manchester connection. There is a link between the woeful Manchester attack and the dubious methods the UK used to help Libyans topple Gaddafi.
article said:
Before the Arab Spring, some Libyan exiles in Manchester, the city that hosts the UK's largest Libyan community, were believed to be linked to the LIFG. Due to the group's proscribed status and alleged links to al-Qaeda, these exiles' movements were severely restricted by the UK authorities, including passport confiscations.
But the situation was reversed once Libyan regime change was in motion. Passports were returned. Intelligence officers are even said to have "sorted" exit for these exiles, so long as they were prepared to fight, produce propaganda or otherwise assist in removing Gaddafi.
As a result, numerous Libyan exiles in Britain and Brits of Libyan extraction went abroad - many who were brave and had good intentions. among these is said to have been Salman Abedi, who was only sixteen at the time, and his father, who was a member of the LIFG and had sought refuge in Britain in the nineties.
But the situation was reversed once Libyan regime change was in motion. Passports were returned. Intelligence officers are even said to have "sorted" exit for these exiles, so long as they were prepared to fight, produce propaganda or otherwise assist in removing Gaddafi.
As a result, numerous Libyan exiles in Britain and Brits of Libyan extraction went abroad - many who were brave and had good intentions. among these is said to have been Salman Abedi, who was only sixteen at the time, and his father, who was a member of the LIFG and had sought refuge in Britain in the nineties.
MikeT66 said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Hmmmm... but they want to arrest people for colluding with terrorists, don't they? 
in all of this? When we were funnelling British-Libyan fighters to Libya in 2011, she was Home Secretary and must have known of the policy and approved it. Essentially we were encouraging and supporting Islamic jihadism albeit abroad.
We have an election in less than a week yet these issues aren't even being raised.
Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
Laurel Green said:
They, the Police, are also claiming no record of warnings given to them about the bomber.BlackLabel said:
MikeT66 said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Hmmmm... but they want to arrest people for colluding with terrorists, don't they? in all of this? When we were funnelling British-Libyan fighters to Libya in 2011, she was Home Secretary and must have known of the policy and approved it. Essentially we were encouraging and supporting Islamic jihadism albeit abroad.
We have an election in less than a week yet these issues aren't even being raised.
Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
We I know its a harsh thing to say but we shouldn't be bringing democracy and capitalism to the whole world. Its not our place. We should be looking after our own population first.
BlackLabel said:
We have an election in less than a week yet these issues aren't even being raised.
Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
It was raised (I think) last night on TW by a young man interested ion politics. But (as with so many on here) it doesn't get reflected on because it doesn't fit the angry 'lefty-lefty-lefty' chants. Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
Halb said:
BlackLabel said:
We have an election in less than a week yet these issues aren't even being raised.
Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
It was raised (I think) last night on TW by a young man interested ion politics. But (as with so many on here) it doesn't get reflected on because it doesn't fit the angry 'lefty-lefty-lefty' chants. Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
Norfolkit said:
alfie2244 said:
Northbloke said:
Agree the youngish chap on This Week put his case very well. Would really like to hear more of this sort of alternative perspective without the usual frothing and anger. Well done feller.
He was good for a youngster but I never saw him chop down any trees 
alfie2244 said:
Halb said:
BlackLabel said:
We have an election in less than a week yet these issues aren't even being raised.
Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
It was raised (I think) last night on TW by a young man interested ion politics. But (as with so many on here) it doesn't get reflected on because it doesn't fit the angry 'lefty-lefty-lefty' chants. Corbyn is rightly criticised for his closeness to the IRA, to Hamas etc however the other sides support of Jihadis in Libya and now Syria is glanced over.
Norfolkit said:
alfie2244 said:
Northbloke said:
Agree the youngish chap on This Week put his case very well. Would really like to hear more of this sort of alternative perspective without the usual frothing and anger. Well done feller.
He was good for a youngster but I never saw him chop down any trees 
I posted this, from today's times in the abuse thread, but it is also (perhaps more so) relevant here:
It is interesting that former chief crown prosecutor Nazir Afzal, who convicted the Rochdale gang, has resigned this week as chief exec of the Association of Police and Crime Commissioners because they attempted to ban him speaking out against Muslim community leaders' in the aftermath of the Manchester attack.
Mr Afazl feels that Muslim leaders are often playing the victim card, rather than address issues within their community and he was particularly critical of the Muslim Council for having not even discussed the issue of radicalisation at their AGM
It is interesting that former chief crown prosecutor Nazir Afzal, who convicted the Rochdale gang, has resigned this week as chief exec of the Association of Police and Crime Commissioners because they attempted to ban him speaking out against Muslim community leaders' in the aftermath of the Manchester attack.
Mr Afazl feels that Muslim leaders are often playing the victim card, rather than address issues within their community and he was particularly critical of the Muslim Council for having not even discussed the issue of radicalisation at their AGM
Nazir's a good guy. I disagree with him on Prevent though he has earned the right to speak how he feels and has more of a right than others imo. If he's lost from public life then it's a shame.
Prevent has become toxic, though I personally find I have little in common with the agencies who want to see it closed down.
Regardless, he should have been supported. I last saw him on Question Time. I thought he spoke with both legitimacy and authenticity. If people like him do not have a platform to speak then it becomes easier for the mainstream who have little of no interaction with UK Muslims to believe we're all like the extremists.
The Muslim Council of Britain, were they not set up by the UK government? And have they not repeatedly had evidenced links with Islamist organisations?
It really is a complete mess from top to bottom. No wonder the terrorists seem to be able to act with relative ease.
Prevent has become toxic, though I personally find I have little in common with the agencies who want to see it closed down.
Regardless, he should have been supported. I last saw him on Question Time. I thought he spoke with both legitimacy and authenticity. If people like him do not have a platform to speak then it becomes easier for the mainstream who have little of no interaction with UK Muslims to believe we're all like the extremists.
The Muslim Council of Britain, were they not set up by the UK government? And have they not repeatedly had evidenced links with Islamist organisations?
It really is a complete mess from top to bottom. No wonder the terrorists seem to be able to act with relative ease.
I think you are right that the government or security services seem to have a hand in far too many of the failures. As a Mancunian friend of mine out it, they are masters of the unintended consequence.
You may be glad to hear that my friend, like many of the rest of us, is not allowing the repeated failures of the establishment to tarnish his opinion and regard for immigrants and their communities.
You may be glad to hear that my friend, like many of the rest of us, is not allowing the repeated failures of the establishment to tarnish his opinion and regard for immigrants and their communities.
The article below was published a few days ago. Any investigation into our conduct over Libya and supporting Jihadis out there will go the same way. When it comes to 'national security' it seems there is no accountability at all and everything is decided and discussed behind closed doors.
An investigation into the foreign funding and support of jihadi groups that was authorised by David Cameron may never be published, the Home Office has admitted. The inquiry into revenue streams for extremist groups operating in the UK was commissioned by the former prime minister and is thought to focus on Saudi Arabia, which has repeatedly been highlighted by European leaders as a funding source for Islamist jihadis.
An investigation into the foreign funding and support of jihadi groups that was authorised by David Cameron may never be published, the Home Office has admitted. The inquiry into revenue streams for extremist groups operating in the UK was commissioned by the former prime minister and is thought to focus on Saudi Arabia, which has repeatedly been highlighted by European leaders as a funding source for Islamist jihadis.
Guardian said:
The investigation was launched as part of a deal with the Liberal Democrats in exchange for the party supporting the extension of British airstrikes against Islamic State into Syria in December 2015.
Tom Brake, the Lib Dem foreign affairs spokesman, has written to the prime minister asking her to confirm that the investigation will not be shelved.
The Observer reported in January last year that the Home Office’s extremism analysis unit had been directed by Downing Street to investigate overseas funding of extremist groups in the UK, with findings to be shown to Theresa May, then home secretary, and Cameron.
However, 18 months later, the Home Office confirmed the report had not yet been completed and said it would not necessarily be published, calling the contents “very sensitive”.
Tom Brake, the Lib Dem foreign affairs spokesman, has written to the prime minister asking her to confirm that the investigation will not be shelved.
The Observer reported in January last year that the Home Office’s extremism analysis unit had been directed by Downing Street to investigate overseas funding of extremist groups in the UK, with findings to be shown to Theresa May, then home secretary, and Cameron.
However, 18 months later, the Home Office confirmed the report had not yet been completed and said it would not necessarily be published, calling the contents “very sensitive”.
"Manchester attack: Salman Abedi ‘made bomb in four days’ after potentially undergoing terror training in Libya
Attacker reportedly met Isis militants linked to Paris attacks ringleader Abdelhamid Abaaoud"
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk...
Attacker reportedly met Isis militants linked to Paris attacks ringleader Abdelhamid Abaaoud"
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk...
As time goes by this event slips further from our conciousness,overtaken by more recent atrocities.
Freya Lewis is the friend of a friends daughter,she was one of those injured by the bomb at the station,her friend was killed.So far she has had 21 hours of surgery and still needs more.
For many kids and parents they won't forget quite so quickly.
Freya Lewis is the friend of a friends daughter,she was one of those injured by the bomb at the station,her friend was killed.So far she has had 21 hours of surgery and still needs more.
For many kids and parents they won't forget quite so quickly.
smifffymoto said:
As time goes by this event slips further from our conciousness,overtaken by more recent atrocities.
Freya Lewis is the friend of a friends daughter,she was one of those injured by the bomb at the station,her friend was killed.So far she has had 21 hours of surgery and still needs more.
For many kids and parents they won't forget quite so quickly.
A reminder of the ongoing suffering of the innocent victims.Freya Lewis is the friend of a friends daughter,she was one of those injured by the bomb at the station,her friend was killed.So far she has had 21 hours of surgery and still needs more.
For many kids and parents they won't forget quite so quickly.
BlackLabel said:
"Manchester attack: Salman Abedi ‘made bomb in four days’ after potentially undergoing terror training in Libya
Attacker reportedly met Isis militants linked to Paris attacks ringleader Abdelhamid Abaaoud"
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk...
Also repeatedly visited a convicted terrorist facilitator in jail, yet these visits didn't raise any alerts within the security services - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4564276/Ma...Attacker reportedly met Isis militants linked to Paris attacks ringleader Abdelhamid Abaaoud"
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk...
NDA said:
A reminder of the ongoing suffering of the innocent victims.
Last I heard (on the radio) Saudi Arabia have a hand in all of this terrorism somehow. SO, seems like if your the worlds largest exporter of oil & gas and buying billions of weaponry from the west that's ok then, governments will just turn a blind eye.The ringleader of the London Bridge attack was also known to the authorities. He even appeared in an ISIS documentary on ch4.
mirror said:
It is understood the killer was a home-grown jihadi who came from Pakistan as a child but was brought up in the UK.
But in recent years he had become increasingly radical and was twice reported to anti-terror authorities, it has been claimed.
He even appeared in TV documentary about British jihadis and was questioned by police after an Islamic State flag was unfurled in a park.
The revelations will put further pressure on Britain's security services after Manchester bomber Salman Abedi also appeared to have slipped through the net before carrying out the atrocity.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/london-bridge-terror-attack-terrorists--10562096But in recent years he had become increasingly radical and was twice reported to anti-terror authorities, it has been claimed.
He even appeared in TV documentary about British jihadis and was questioned by police after an Islamic State flag was unfurled in a park.
The revelations will put further pressure on Britain's security services after Manchester bomber Salman Abedi also appeared to have slipped through the net before carrying out the atrocity.
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