Teenage Audi mechanic committed suicide after bullying

[Rich_W]

AmitG said:

For those who have been on the tools, so to speak, are there any main dealer brands or franchises that have a lower tolerance for this sort of thing? I don't know whether it depends on the car brand or the dealer group or both (or neither).

If you pay more money do you get less tttery?

I know that we are only hearing the anecdotes, but from the number posted so far, it seems pretty common.

There's no pattern to the dealer. I've worked for 6 different marques (some more briefly than others ) I thought I could narrow it down to the type of workshop (brand new or old and stty) but having worked in both over the years. There's no pattern.

The only thing I can think of is what sort of manager, you have.

I've had a few "liberal lightweight" managers and they are the type to let Apprentices get away with bloody murder. Avoid doing anything they feel infringes their basic right to do fk all. As a result these apprentices get ripped harder. The managers that exercise their authority when it comes to apprentices and ensure that they DO the things required of them. those apprentices are left alone. The grey Man (or woman)

I said it earlier, but it's how an apprentice carries themselves that determines what happens.

On a slight tangent. I know of one brand run apprenticeship scheme that gets the apprentices parents to attend various meetings to ensure they realise what is expected of their apprentice. And that they (parents) need to be supportive. Sounds great. But this happens when the apprentices are 19 and technically adults, so you are "keeping them a child" You are not letting them become independent thinking adults.

I've also noticed that these parents are the types to criticise the dealer far more than those who take a hands off approach. I've seen parents march in to Service Managers complaining that little Johnny was "asked to wash a car or mop a floor and its not the point and they are perfect" How do you think that goes down with the rest of the staff?

[Vaud]

Jazzy Jag said:

wsurfa said:

In the past I worked in site for a while and you'd expect an amount of pisstaking, however I never saw anything approaching what happened at that Audi garage.

For the most part it was harmless chat, as an example, you'd be in the middle of something often for the first time and a couple of lads would shout "STOP" at max volume at you. As a newbie you'd freeze thinking you'd fecked something up, they'd then continue "...in the name of love" ....

In my workshop when you were trying to move a car into a tight spot someone would shout "WHOA!!!"

when you have just done an emergency stop
they continue with "I’m going to Barbados"

For me that is in the "fun/very mild banter"... though WinstonWolf would probably finish with a staple gun to the temple.

[Jazzy Jag]

Vaud said:

Jazzy Jag said:

wsurfa said:

In the past I worked in site for a while and you'd expect an amount of pisstaking, however I never saw anything approaching what happened at that Audi garage.

For the most part it was harmless chat, as an example, you'd be in the middle of something often for the first time and a couple of lads would shout "STOP" at max volume at you. As a newbie you'd freeze thinking you'd fecked something up, they'd then continue "...in the name of love" ....

In my workshop when you were trying to move a car into a tight spot someone would shout "WHOA!!!"

when you have just done an emergency stop
they continue with "I’m going to Barbados"

For me that is in the "fun/very mild banter"... though WinstonWolf would probably finish with a staple gun to the temple.

I did have the sleeves of my overalls locked in a vice once.
problem was, I was in them at the time.

[Zetec-S]

Vaud said:

Jazzy Jag said:

wsurfa said:

In the past I worked in site for a while and you'd expect an amount of pisstaking, however I never saw anything approaching what happened at that Audi garage.

For the most part it was harmless chat, as an example, you'd be in the middle of something often for the first time and a couple of lads would shout "STOP" at max volume at you. As a newbie you'd freeze thinking you'd fecked something up, they'd then continue "...in the name of love" ....

In my workshop when you were trying to move a car into a tight spot someone would shout "WHOA!!!"

when you have just done an emergency stop
they continue with "I’m going to Barbados"

For me that is in the "fun/very mild banter"... though WinstonWolf would probably finish with a staple nail gun to the temple.

FTFY

[vonuber]

Zetec-S said:

Vaud said:

For me that is in the "fun/very mild banter"... though WinstonWolf would probably finish with a staple nail gun to the temple whilst greasing his balls.

FTFY

FTFY

[jamiem555]

I served my time as an HGV mechanic and was put through most of the crap that's been mentioned on here. It stood me well when I joined the RAF aged 20. Most recruits were 2-4 years younger than me and I felt so much older and mature than the rest. I'm now a supervisor for a well known offshore helicopter company and if anybody even tried treating our apprentices like that their feet wouldn't touch the floor. I thought these things were well in the past and even garages had moved with the times.
My time in the military was tame compared to that 4 year apprenticeship. To be fair I did bring some of it on myself by being gobby. I even got away with swinging a rather large torque wrench at the foreman. They thought it was a laugh. I wanted to kill him. Oh to be 18 again....

[dandarez]

Disastrous said:

dandarez said:

Hi, Mr Dindoit - FYFI, I'm a Tory.
Yeah, Kipper for quite a while - why? it was to achieve an aim. Leave the gravy train. Aim achieved. All over now, as it is for majority of other Kippers.
The ones you and other trolls threw racist and bigot cards still remain Kippers. Not many are there?

Back to your graph.
I know. Prat!
As I intimated, I was here! Were you?

VAST Majority of the previous was NOT here on the mainland.
Show me the concert hall where the single aim of targeting of (maiming, killing) kids on the mainland 'back in the day'.

Incoherent nonsense. Too much time on the tools and not enough in the books?

That graph shows up your assertions as bks yet you claim because 'you were there' you know better??

Hang on Dindoit, why not just answer the questi....

Oh, hang on a mo.
It's an intervention by none other than Disastrous! The PH'r with the apt name!

Where on the graph does it show my assertions are bks?
Of those (political) terrorist atrocities listed, back in the day, which were the ones here on the mainland where they targeted specifically and deliberately 'children'?
And how many of those (political) terrorists were not just bds, but suicidal bds, who didn't give f if they blew themselves up at the same time?
Unlike the f nutjobs of today. Never mind, don't answer.

Now to your 'incoherent nonsense' dig.
Pots and kettles, eh?

You infer, but are not sure, as you pose it as a question, that I'm spending too much time on the tools
For one, I had up until this thread never ever heard the term 'on the tools'.
However, spotting a 'tool' now that is different. Spot a 'tool' I can!
Similarly, spotting a 'troll'. Not difficult. At all.

As for not enough in the books...
'IN the books'?
What is that? A fking conundrum or Mystic Meg riddle?
Or are you just ill?

Don't answer. Again. It's obvious. Pity has overcome me.

[SpeedMattersNot]

dandarez said:

Disastrous said:

dandarez said:

Hi, Mr Dindoit - FYFI, I'm a Tory.
Yeah, Kipper for quite a while - why? it was to achieve an aim. Leave the gravy train. Aim achieved. All over now, as it is for majority of other Kippers.
The ones you and other trolls threw racist and bigot cards still remain Kippers. Not many are there?

Back to your graph.
I know. Prat!
As I intimated, I was here! Were you?

VAST Majority of the previous was NOT here on the mainland.
Show me the concert hall where the single aim of targeting of (maiming, killing) kids on the mainland 'back in the day'.

Incoherent nonsense. Too much time on the tools and not enough in the books?

That graph shows up your assertions as bks yet you claim because 'you were there' you know better??

Hang on Dindoit, why not just answer the questi....

Oh, hang on a mo.
It's an intervention by none other than Disastrous! The PH'r with the apt name!

Where on the graph does it show my assertions are bks?
Of those (political) terrorist atrocities listed, back in the day, which were the ones here on the mainland where they targeted specifically and deliberately 'children'?
And how many of those (political) terrorists were not just bds, but suicidal bds, who didn't give f if they blew themselves up at the same time?
Unlike the f nutjobs of today. Never mind, don't answer.

Now to your 'incoherent nonsense' dig.
Pots and kettles, eh?

You infer, but are not sure, as you pose it as a question, that I'm spending too much time on the tools
For one, I had up until this thread never ever heard the term 'on the tools'.
However, spotting a 'tool' now that is different. Spot a 'tool' I can!
Similarly, spotting a 'troll'. Not difficult. At all.

As for not enough in the books...
'IN the books'?
What is that? A fking conundrum or Mystic Meg riddle?
Or are you just ill?

Don't answer. Again. It's obvious. Pity has overcome me.

Susan takes the last viscount vs. barrier cream balls could be the next blockbuster.

[sparks_E39]

Horrific.

Not every dealership is the same. I work for a busy main dealer 10 hours a day as an advisor (love it too) However there is no bullying, no nasty boss and a good team morale. Largely brought on by great management. Sure there is what can be called "banter" now and again, but it's all very lighthearted stuff.

Anything even slightly considered bullying would not be tolerated.

[Mr2Mike]

dandarez said:

Hang on Dindoit, why not just answer the questi....

Oh, hang on a mo.
It's an intervention by none other than Disastrous! The PH'r with the apt name!

Where on the graph does it show my assertions are bks?
Of those (political) terrorist atrocities listed, back in the day, which were the ones here on the mainland where they targeted specifically and deliberately 'children'?
And how many of those (political) terrorists were not just bds, but suicidal bds, who didn't give f if they blew themselves up at the same time?
Unlike the f nutjobs of today. Never mind, don't answer.

Now to your 'incoherent nonsense' dig.
Pots and kettles, eh?

You infer, but are not sure, as you pose it as a question, that I'm spending too much time on the tools
For one, I had up until this thread never ever heard the term 'on the tools'.
However, spotting a 'tool' now that is different. Spot a 'tool' I can!
Similarly, spotting a 'troll'. Not difficult. At all.

As for not enough in the books...
'IN the books'?
What is that? A fking conundrum or Mystic Meg riddle?
Or are you just ill?

Don't answer. Again. It's obvious. Pity has overcome me.

You have posted a semi-random collection of words, organised into random paragraphs. If Diastrous described your posts as "incoherent" then he was being polite.

[WinstonWolf]

It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife

[funkyrobot]

WinstonWolf said:

It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife

A PH ban pardon, minutes too late.

[Vaud]

WinstonWolf said:

It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT1TVSTkAXg

I'll just leave this.

[MarshPhantom]

Otispunkmeyer said:

where is the line if setting someone alight isn't it?

Car bomb?. These s want shooting.

[Disastrous]

Mr2Mike said:

dandarez said:

Hang on Dindoit, why not just answer the questi....

Oh, hang on a mo.
It's an intervention by none other than Disastrous! The PH'r with the apt name!

Where on the graph does it show my assertions are bks?
Of those (political) terrorist atrocities listed, back in the day, which were the ones here on the mainland where they targeted specifically and deliberately 'children'?
And how many of those (political) terrorists were not just bds, but suicidal bds, who didn't give f if they blew themselves up at the same time?
Unlike the f nutjobs of today. Never mind, don't answer.

Now to your 'incoherent nonsense' dig.
Pots and kettles, eh?

You infer, but are not sure, as you pose it as a question, that I'm spending too much time on the tools
For one, I had up until this thread never ever heard the term 'on the tools'.
However, spotting a 'tool' now that is different. Spot a 'tool' I can!
Similarly, spotting a 'troll'. Not difficult. At all.

As for not enough in the books...
'IN the books'?
What is that? A fking conundrum or Mystic Meg riddle?
Or are you just ill?

Don't answer. Again. It's obvious. Pity has overcome me.

You have posted a semi-random collection of words, organised into random paragraphs. If Diastrous described your posts as "incoherent" then he was being polite.

Yup. Vintage dandarez.

[stitched]

In a vain attempt to explain an environment outside of the office contains I will attempt to elaborate.
I work in industrial factories, to warm stuff up we use steam, low pressure is 4bar, medium is 6 and high is 29.
A pipe breach in an enclosed space will poach you like an egg.
To clean the pipes (product pipes not steam) we use caustic soda, initially neat then diluted to around 6% and heated to 75 deg. If this st hits you it will get to the epidermis in about two seconds, if it gets your eyes you are blind. Instantly.
To remove the caustic which adheres to the pipes we then clean with nitric acid, again initially neat then diluted. Nitric is funny stuff when warm, if it is too warm it becomes a mist which dissolves your lungs quite quickly.
Into this environment we put apprentices, we are expected to teach them the job, some realise the importance of listening to their mentor at all times, and these generally get by.
Some are too precious to realise we are trying to stop them injuring themselves or others, carry phones which they use to keep up on facebook etc and quote their rights every 5 minutes.
There is a choice with these idiots. Get them out of the environment before they harm themself or me, or deal with the aftermath.
You generally find they gravitate into an office environment and call me and others neanderthals.
My work environment has no room for children who refuse to take responsibility.
If someone tried to bully one of my third year apprentices it would not go well, they are all grown up.

[limpsfield]

On the pipes. Happy days.

[GloverMart]

Jazzy Jag said:

wsurfa said:

In the past I worked in site for a while and you'd expect an amount of pisstaking, however I never saw anything approaching what happened at that Audi garage.

For the most part it was harmless chat, as an example, you'd be in the middle of something often for the first time and a couple of lads would shout "STOP" at max volume at you. As a newbie you'd freeze thinking you'd fecked something up, they'd then continue "...in the name of love" ....

In my workshop when you were trying to move a car into a tight spot someone would shout "WHOA!!!"

when you have just done an emergency stop
they continue with "I’m going to Barbados"

Here, have a for both of those...

[Rich_W]

stitched said:

...
Into this environment we put apprentices, we are expected to teach them the job, some realise the importance of listening to their mentor at all times, and these generally get by.
..

If someone tried to bully one of my third year apprentices it would not go well, they are all grown up

.

I've re-arranged your quote slightly.


Therein lies the point. You're third year apprentices aren't dheads by the sound of it. So they wont get bullied/harrassed because there's no reason to.

IME In any engineering/workshop environment. Doing the work first and having a laugh second doesn't get you singled out. Doing nothing and complaining the whole time will bring it to you. Hence why the story about the kid refusing to mop a floor is not a surprising insight.

[West17]

I served my time in the motor trade in the late 80's/early 90's. Long since out of the trade.

Experienced all the traditional japes such as the long stand and box of sparks for the grinder etc. I even got tricked into phoning the local police station to enquire about Brian Tilsleys tools as I was told he had left the trade and these would be up for sale*. Needless to say I did not watch the soaps. It gave the rest of the guys and gals a great laugh as they hid behind the office wall listening in!

All harmless enough and I never saw anything malicious.

I was in the company of a mechanic recently and the topic of workplace tricks came up. He told me there was nothing that his foreman found funnier than crapping in an oil filter box and putting it in the apprentices tool chest. This is in a higher end main dealer.

Have to admit I was surprised that sort of behaviour would be tolerated in a 2017 workplace but it seems that and much worse goes on.



(*for the younger viewers - apparently Brian was a mechanic in Coronation Street who was murdered outside a nightclub.)