Fruit grower voted Leave - sorry now!

[rs1952]

jshell said:

Another shyte Brexit thread fails to go the way the OP/whingers expected/wanted. I wish these remoaners would just shut up, get on board and help instead of grabbing every excuse to weep their eyes out!

Have you got anything worthwhile to say or are you just going to keep repeating year-old mantras that were pretty silly back then and look ludicrous now.

It strikes me that this thread has, so far, gone pretty well because people from both sides of the argument have argued their case well and nobody has yet sunk down into insults (well, except for Alfie who called me a silly old fool and I called him a dope back, but we're both thick-skinned enough to take it )

[jshell]

rs1952 said:

jshell said:

Another shyte Brexit thread fails to go the way the OP/whingers expected/wanted. I wish these remoaners would just shut up, get on board and help instead of grabbing every excuse to weep their eyes out!

Have you got anything worthwhile to say or are you just going to keep repeating year-old mantras that were pretty silly back then and look ludicrous now.

It strikes me that this thread has, so far, gone pretty well because people from both sides of the argument have argued their case well and nobody has yet sunk down into insults (well, except for Alfie who called me a silly old fool and I called him a dope back, but we're both thick-skinned enough to take it )

Neither silly or ludicrous, each whinge seems to have been pretty well dealt with by other posters...yours and the OP's. You and the other moaners just keep battering on with the perceived negatives. Sorry, like it or not, it's happening. Lead, follow or GTF out of the way.

I didn't start this Groundhog day of a thread.

[anonymous-user]

I honestly think people will be in for a shock if they really belive that millions of British people will rush out to pick fruit, work on farms, clean hotel toilets, work in kitchens and fast food restaurants, clean hospitals, work shifts in food factories and all sorts of other jobs that society generally classes as undesirable.

Even if you stated giving people £10 an hour or whatever instead of minimum wage there still won't be a stampede.

[Saleen836]

NinjaPower said:

I honestly think people will be in for a shock if they really belive that millions of British people will rush out to pick fruit, work on farms, clean hotel toilets, work in kitchens and fast food restaurants, clean hospitals, work shifts in food factories and all sorts of other jobs that society generally classes as undesirable.

Even if you stated giving people £10 an hour or whatever instead of minimum wage there still won't be a stampede.

Correct, as sadly even paying £10 an hour the feckless will do the math and realise they have to work 5/6 days a week 7-9 hours a day for little more (after deductions) than they receive on benefits

[alfie2244]

Saleen836 said:

NinjaPower said:

I honestly think people will be in for a shock if they really belive that millions of British people will rush out to pick fruit, work on farms, clean hotel toilets, work in kitchens and fast food restaurants, clean hospitals, work shifts in food factories and all sorts of other jobs that society generally classes as undesirable.

Even if you stated giving people £10 an hour or whatever instead of minimum wage there still won't be a stampede.

Correct, as sadly even paying £10 an hour the feckless will do the math and realise they have to work 5/6 days a week 7-9 hours a day for little more (after deductions) than they receive on benefits

I have a funny feeling this won't go down well but I am going to post it anyway and then hang on to my hat.

Would / should the feckless, note feckless, still be receiving benefits? Combination of carrot and stick required perhaps?

32hrs doing paid work regardless + 8hrs doing compulsory paid, genuinely work related education / training.
40Hrs @ £10 = £400p.w. and the opportunity to better themselves....what is not to like?

Failure to comply results in all financial support withdrawn. all associated living costs, housing food etc paid either direct and / or with vouchers bit like post war ration books..may sound harsh but I stress this must only be used to motivate the feckless and absolutely not used against those genuinely unable to work.

I should add I would not expect anyone to do anything I haven't done myself.I have never claimed benefits but in order to raise a young family I have worked as a refuse collector, taxi driver, cleared blocked drains/sewers, night security guard and laboured on building sites...in effect did anything and everything to keep the wolf from my door.

Ok now do your worst

[Zod]

Then what? A wave of rioting and burglary, most likely.

[alfie2244]

Zod said:

Then what? A wave of rioting and burglary, most likely.

Employ more policeman with the benefit monies saved..........only £3 pw FFS.

[crankedup]

markcoznottz said:

mike74 said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

TBH it was a bit of a rhetorical question, as far as I'm concerned the main reason that governments for the last 2 decades have been allowing uncontrolled immigration is because it makes the GDP figures look healthy... more people = higher GDP, it's that simple

The government also get a few added bonuses such as it inflates property prices and depresses wages, which is always handy when you want a nation full of poorly paid obedient little workers and mortgage debt slaves.

Definitely keeps wages down. Remember the early 90's? Loads of jobs many very well paid and no minimum wage either, just supply and demand.

20% reduction in the value of the £ is enough to begin a reduction of Romanian and Bulgarian workers into the UK so far as seasonal work is concerned. The employers in the UK have not responded to this reduction in value and wonder why they can't recruit enough overseas labour. Used cheap labour for so long and now it's going to cost us all more money for the products. Our taxes being used to top up under paid workers has been long overdue the chop.

[Jockman]

crankedup said:

20% reduction in the value of the £ is enough to begin a reduction of Romanian and Bulgarian workers into the UK so far as seasonal work is concerned. The employers in the UK have not responded to this reduction in value and wonder why they can't recruit enough overseas labour. Used cheap labour for so long and now it's going to cost us all more money for the products. Our taxes being used to top up under paid workers has been long overdue the chop.

This is the angle I'm trying to get my peanut brain around.

How much of the reduction in immigration is due to a feeling of not being welcome post brexit or the currency devaluation post brexit?

If that latter, are NHS staffing levels correlated to the currency markets?

If so, again, is that a sustainable / reliable way to run such a large and important organisation ?

[hairyben]

alfie2244 said:

I have a funny feeling this won't go down well but I am going to post it anyway and then hang on to my hat.

Would / should the feckless, note feckless, still be receiving benefits? Combination of carrot and stick required perhaps?

32hrs doing paid work regardless + 8hrs doing compulsory paid, genuinely work related education / training.
40Hrs @ £10 = £400p.w. and the opportunity to better themselves....what is not to like?

Failure to comply results in all financial support withdrawn. all associated living costs, housing food etc paid either direct and / or with vouchers bit like post war ration books..may sound harsh but I stress this must only be used to motivate the feckless and absolutely not used against those genuinely unable to work.

I should add I would not expect anyone to do anything I haven't done myself.I have never claimed benefits but in order to raise a young family I have worked as a refuse collector, taxi driver, cleared blocked drains/sewers, night security guard and laboured on building sites...in effect did anything and everything to keep the wolf from my door.

Ok now do your worst

Cameron tried to do something like that didnt he - work experience training to help people on benefits and apparently unable to find work. The entitled indignant feckless and threw a huge hissy and declared it equivalent to "slavery"

[anonymous-user]

footnote said:

I haven't heard the evidence with my own fine ears but apparently this chap was on R4 Today, saying he'd voted Leave but his business would go bust if he couldn't get migrant workers...

I know'll I'll be sorry when there's no great British strawberries - but you can only laugh.

Actually it's pretty amusing. Everyone knew the consequences, but someone from one of the most affected sectors voted himself out of a job ! Hard to have any sympathy

[anonymous-user]

hairyben said:

alfie2244 said:

I have a funny feeling this won't go down well but I am going to post it anyway and then hang on to my hat.

Would / should the feckless, note feckless, still be receiving benefits? Combination of carrot and stick required perhaps?

32hrs doing paid work regardless + 8hrs doing compulsory paid, genuinely work related education / training.
40Hrs @ £10 = £400p.w. and the opportunity to better themselves....what is not to like?

Failure to comply results in all financial support withdrawn. all associated living costs, housing food etc paid either direct and / or with vouchers bit like post war ration books..may sound harsh but I stress this must only be used to motivate the feckless and absolutely not used against those genuinely unable to work.

I should add I would not expect anyone to do anything I haven't done myself.I have never claimed benefits but in order to raise a young family I have worked as a refuse collector, taxi driver, cleared blocked drains/sewers, night security guard and laboured on building sites...in effect did anything and everything to keep the wolf from my door.

Ok now do your worst

Cameron tried to do something like that didnt he - work experience training to help people on benefits and apparently unable to find work. The entitled indignant feckless and threw a huge hissy and declared it equivalent to "slavery"

I remember it well.

The unemployed were absolutely furious at such a blatant attempt to get them into work.

But Alfie2244 thinks these same people will run towards unskilled work opportunities with open arms once no one 'foreign' is available to do it.

[jshell]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

The point you seem to miss is that we're at a point of no return. The EU is a stunningly corrupt organisation based on communist principles - like it or not. If we backtrack or go for a soft Brexit, they will murder us. We'll be out with the begging bowl looking for the scraps off the German and French tables.

It'll be like a wronged spouse who never forgets....

[PotatoSalad]

vonuber said:

rxe said:

A business model founded on poles coming over to work for buttons is never a long term thing. Regardless of Brexit, what happens when there is an economic boom in Easter Europe and people no longer want to come over.

Agreed; we just need to pay more for food.

Not really, (real) food in Britain is already quite expensive. You can have four microwave meals full of fat, sugar and carbs for the price of small box of strawberries.

No wonder there are so many whales in this country and the vast majority is at least somewhat overweight.

[alfie2244]

NinjaPower said:

hairyben said:

alfie2244 said:

I have a funny feeling this won't go down well but I am going to post it anyway and then hang on to my hat.

Would / should the feckless, note feckless, still be receiving benefits? Combination of carrot and stick required perhaps?

32hrs doing paid work regardless + 8hrs doing compulsory paid, genuinely work related education / training.
40Hrs @ £10 = £400p.w. and the opportunity to better themselves....what is not to like?

Failure to comply results in all financial support withdrawn. all associated living costs, housing food etc paid either direct and / or with vouchers bit like post war ration books..may sound harsh but I stress this must only be used to motivate the feckless and absolutely not used against those genuinely unable to work.

I should add I would not expect anyone to do anything I haven't done myself.I have never claimed benefits but in order to raise a young family I have worked as a refuse collector, taxi driver, cleared blocked drains/sewers, night security guard and laboured on building sites...in effect did anything and everything to keep the wolf from my door.

Ok now do your worst

Cameron tried to do something like that didnt he - work experience training to help people on benefits and apparently unable to find work. The entitled indignant feckless and threw a huge hissy and declared it equivalent to "slavery"

I remember it well.

The unemployed were absolutely furious at such a blatant attempt to get them into work.

But Alfie2244 thinks these same people will run towards unskilled work opportunities with open arms once no one 'foreign' is available to do it.

I don't care how furious the "feckless" get.

As for your 2nd sentence - I never mentioned "running or foreign" but like many others on here I doubt it will stop making things up.....as you were.

[Zod]

jshell said:

The point you seem to miss is that we're at a point of no return. The EU is a stunningly corrupt organisation based on communist principles - like it or not. If we backtrack or go for a soft Brexit, they will murder us. We'll be out with the begging bowl looking for the scraps off the German and French tables.

It'll be like a wronged spouse who never forgets....

"Communist"? How?

It's funny that the loons on the right call the EU Communist, while the loons on the left see it as part of a great global capitalist plan.

[Lance Catamaran]

NinjaPower said:

hairyben said:

alfie2244 said:

I have a funny feeling this won't go down well but I am going to post it anyway and then hang on to my hat.

Would / should the feckless, note feckless, still be receiving benefits? Combination of carrot and stick required perhaps?

32hrs doing paid work regardless + 8hrs doing compulsory paid, genuinely work related education / training.
40Hrs @ £10 = £400p.w. and the opportunity to better themselves....what is not to like?

Failure to comply results in all financial support withdrawn. all associated living costs, housing food etc paid either direct and / or with vouchers bit like post war ration books..may sound harsh but I stress this must only be used to motivate the feckless and absolutely not used against those genuinely unable to work.

I should add I would not expect anyone to do anything I haven't done myself.I have never claimed benefits but in order to raise a young family I have worked as a refuse collector, taxi driver, cleared blocked drains/sewers, night security guard and laboured on building sites...in effect did anything and everything to keep the wolf from my door.

Ok now do your worst

Cameron tried to do something like that didnt he - work experience training to help people on benefits and apparently unable to find work. The entitled indignant feckless and threw a huge hissy and declared it equivalent to "slavery"

I remember it well.

The unemployed were absolutely furious at such a blatant attempt to get them into work.

But Alfie2244 thinks these same people will run towards unskilled work opportunities with open arms once no one 'foreign' is available to do it.

Except under that scheme the employers did just use them as discount labour, all the responsibilities of full time staff for a fraction of the pay and none of the perks. Plus if an employer could get unemployed people to do the work, why would they ever hire full time staff?

[crankedup]

Just the thought of the great club that is the EU, never signed off the accounts, why?

[jshell]

Zod said:

jshell said:

The point you seem to miss is that we're at a point of no return. The EU is a stunningly corrupt organisation based on communist principles - like it or not. If we backtrack or go for a soft Brexit, they will murder us. We'll be out with the begging bowl looking for the scraps off the German and French tables.

It'll be like a wronged spouse who never forgets....

"Communist"? How?

It's funny that the loons on the right call the EU Communist, while the loons on the left see it as part of a great global capitalist plan.

Really? The collectivism that seems to be their Utopia, centralised banking, info transfer, removal of Sovereignty, lack of accountability... It's a perfect model of Communism. I can thank an old colleague of mine who escaped from the Ukraine under Communist rule to point this out to me and the mist cleared. She reckoned if you scratch the surface, the EU verges on being worse.

We haven't seen the scale of change that they would like to impose. Brexit has upset the cart. The Euro being a failed currency has upset it too.

[PotatoSalad]

anonymous said:

[redacted]