PC censorship vs debate and free speech, worrying trends.

[Cobnapint]

Eric Mc said:

And she can still do it - if she wants to. Nobody has arrested her or thrown her in jail.

To be honest, I'd be quite proud to have ben sacked by Jeremy Corbyn.

[Otispunkmeyer]

Funkycoldribena said:

citizensm1th said:

the only way you will have a place to voice what ever you feel you need to say with out someone else holding the editorial power is your own web site.

it might be a bit of a echo chamber though

Bit like the Trump thread then.

Unless your website is hosted by squarespace maybe

http://offtheblocks.info/registration/activate/c1a...

yeah its only for white nationalists, which to be true, are unpleasant people.... but there are equally unpleasant people on the other side of the coin and I don't see them banning those (perhaps because none exist... but when or if they do, you'd hope they'd be subjected to the same treatment).

And I know a square space website isn't really your own website, but most people will need some kind of provider to host their crap these days.

[Oakey]

I see the Spain terrorism thread has been closed down despite the fact it was all very civilised up until the end.

[Colonial]

Oakey said:

I see the Spain terrorism thread has been closed down despite the fact it was all very civilised up until the end.

I was actually surprised about that.

[Tankrizzo]

I didn't even think it was that bad. Seems a bit heavy-handed.

[SeeFive]

Oakey said:

I see the Spain terrorism thread has been closed down despite the fact it was all very civilised up until the end.

I wondered who would raise their head above the parapet. I was also tempted but didn't hit submit.

There was a perceived issue early on which was snuffed out by mods. It continued with civilised, non offensive and relevant ongoing discussion around the cause behind the atrocity IMO.

A shame because most of the other threads on such matters have deteriorated into pointless argument, and are hardly worth joining.

[Yipper]

There is a worrying trend in Western countries toward extremist Leftwing groupthink, censorship, and virtue-signaling.

The tolerant are intolerant.

There is an unofficial competition between Lefties and liberals to see who can call out the most "isms" and feel the most self-important.

Having said that, the Left have long been naive egomaniacs. Whether it was supporting extremist communism in the 20th century or supporting extremist religions in the 21st century, there is always a Lefty egomaniac somewhere looking to stir the pot to make themselves feel better.

[DAVEVO9]

Tankrizzo said:

I didn't even think it was that bad. Seems a bit heavy-handed.

Me too. seems to be the trend on here lately when discussing sky fairy topics

[Rude-boy]

SeeFive said:

A shame because most of the other threads on such matters have deteriorated into pointless argument, and are hardly worth joining.

Not looked at that thread since about 19:30 last night.

The problem is that there are a lot of old farts about here like you and I who remember the days when we could turn to PH for up to date news and informed comment together with logical and sensible speculation and consideration.

If people wanted to go off on an ideological tangent there would usually be a few comments and then people would, rightly, either leave the issue to one side or start a different thread to discuss it there so as not to sully the 'news' thread with 'opinion'.

Now there are people from both extremes of the coin who just see every thread as an opportunity to sprout their overly dogmatic and myopic views on things.

[Thorodin]

voyds9 said:

Thorodin said:

In the current news the resignation of Sarah Champion, an excellent MP, wasn't a resignation. It was a constructive dismissal because of, in her words, '...the offence caused by the extremely poor choice of words..' (in my view they were extremely accurate words and long overdue). The great leader Corbyn demanded her resignation because he feared the party might lose thousands of votes in her Labour constituency. So PC culture is in fact political expediency which from an alleged democrat is disgusting. But you won't hear that on our national favourite TV channel.

Edited by Thorodin on Thursday 17th August 20:07

You would have thought that after being elected in 2012 and waiting until 2017 to speak out that she would have had enough time to get the words correct.

I can only assume you are not familiar with Sarah Champion's record. Since achieving public office as an MP she has consistently campaigned on this subject and has used similar language on various occasions. The difference on this occasion, and I use her circumstances in reply to the OP, is the advent of Corbyn and the influence of Momentum (pressure group) having malign effect on open debate with the tacit agreement of Corbyn. She has been the victim of phoney PC dogma in an effort to use alleged racism as an attack dog because the Labour party now has a leader of dubious intent.

Open and honest debate is stifled by the insistence on demonising subjects as a result of disproportionate influence of tiny minorities with huge lobbying of selected sympathisers in influential positions. They are destroying what was once a political party of high ideals and turning it into something entirely different. This, having achieved it's own momentum (sic), now controls what can be said in public without fear of being arrested. Since coming into the leadership role Corbyn has had 80 changes of the PLP. That's an even worse record than Trump.

[roachcoach]

It's because most online debates around anything remotely contentious end up like little children screeching, slowly but surely each one gets louder than the last until the parent needs to make them chill out.

Both sides antagonise the other in an escalating, emotional spiral. It's sadly very rare to see people actually un-emotionally interested in facts and willing to debate without resorting to the usual name calling. Far too often the man is played over the ball. Usually by page 2 here.

[andy_s]

SeeFive said:

Oakey said:

I see the Spain terrorism thread has been closed down despite the fact it was all very civilised up until the end.

I wondered who would raise their head above the parapet. I was also tempted but didn't hit submit.

There was a perceived issue early on which was snuffed out by mods. It continued with civilised, non offensive and relevant ongoing discussion around the cause behind the atrocity IMO.

A shame because most of the other threads on such matters have deteriorated into pointless argument, and are hardly worth joining.

Agreed.

I don't think you can get away without touching on religion in these instances and once the more extreme were sent to bed it was completely civilised.

Can only think the moderator got out of bed the wrong side or only read the first few pages.

I'm the first to say 'it's their train set', but it seemed heavy handed and unnecessary to me.

[ATG]

Einion Yrth said:

Ali G said:

Freedom of speech is not absolute.

Freedom is indivisible; if there are any limits on speech it is no longer free; you may agree with such limitations, that's fine, but it also means that, by definition, speech is not free,

Category error; limits and divisibility are different things.

[rscott]

andy_s said:

SeeFive said:

Oakey said:

I see the Spain terrorism thread has been closed down despite the fact it was all very civilised up until the end.

I wondered who would raise their head above the parapet. I was also tempted but didn't hit submit.

There was a perceived issue early on which was snuffed out by mods. It continued with civilised, non offensive and relevant ongoing discussion around the cause behind the atrocity IMO.

A shame because most of the other threads on such matters have deteriorated into pointless argument, and are hardly worth joining.

Agreed.

I don't think you can get away without touching on religion in these instances and once the more extreme were sent to bed it was completely civilised.

Can only think the moderator got out of bed the wrong side or only read the first few pages.

I'm the first to say 'it's their train set', but it seemed heavy handed and unnecessary to me.

Yep, It's a shame. There were very differing views in the last few pages of it, but it was civilised and polite.

[Cobnapint]

The reason for it being closed was stated as being because it became all about religion.

Erm, well........oh never mind.

[princealbert23]

Cobnapint said:

The reason for it being closed was stated as being because it became all about religion.

Erm, well........oh never mind.

I can sympathise with the mod for that thread. Even though a lot of the shouty types left the resulting conversation forgot the victims.

[Mr. White]

Stumbled across this on the youtubes last night, from 6:10:

https://youtu.be/eJQHakkViPo

Steven Fry getting it spot on again, and no one can accuse him of being far right.

[del mar]

When did "hate speech" become a thing ?

The words were always there but when did it officially become a thing ?

[Wait Here Until Green Light Shows]

Sadly for a lot of people, being the most extreme (and often rude for the sake of it) is the only way they can get any attention.
These people used to just stew in their own little worlds, but now they have a platform.

The problem is of course, you can easily find like minded groups. Hence the worrying rise once again of fascist, racist, alt-this, alt-that etc groups. Humans are descending into a mass divide and conquer ideology, and it's a worry really.

[WCZ]

We've had less productive threads that haven't been banned but meh, there's not even anything more to really discuss - it's the same conversations over and over again after terrorist attacks.