45th President of the United States, Donald Trump. Vol 3
Discussion
By referencing the kneeling protest Trump in his "rally" speech at Alabama has again sought to divide the nation into "the good" and "the bad", I believe he considers those that peacefully protest as "the bad". Certainly his supporters have been calling for firings, boycotts etc for the "ungrateful millionaires".
The vitriol with which the "son of b
h" lines were delivered (watch the video) is telling.
The vitriol with which the "son of b
h" lines were delivered (watch the video) is telling. arfursleep said:
By referencing the kneeling protest Trump in his "rally" speech at Alabama has again sought to divide the nation into "the good" and "the bad", I believe he considers those that peacefully protest as "the bad". Certainly his supporters have been calling for firings, boycotts etc for the "ungrateful millionaires".
The vitriol with which the "son of bh" lines were delivered (watch the video) is telling.
Your mention of "the good" and "the bad" got me thinking, but even Tuco had a certain dignity that Trump lacks.The vitriol with which the "son of b
h" lines were delivered (watch the video) is telling. Eddie Strohacker said:
Correct me by all means, but isn't it the case that 'son of a bh' is much more pejorative in the States than it is here & let's face it, not in particularly common use in the UK?
Not entirely on topic, sorry; just after a feel for the language being used.
Referring to the mother of an African American man as a bh' is much more pejorative in the States than it is here & let's face it, not in particularly common use in the UK?Not entirely on topic, sorry; just after a feel for the language being used.
h? 
Yes, fairly pejorative.Trump doesn't even try to hide his inherent racism because most of his base share it.
Eric Mc said:
That may be so, but it will be seen as an "Anti-Trump" demonstration now.
Black American sportsmen have used major sporting events to make protest before -
They did and at huge personal cost to all three men on that podium, including the white-man. What happened after is truly tragic.Black American sportsmen have used major sporting events to make protest before -
The NFL players are literally playing with fire on this issue and it I think they have mis-judged the mood. You even have non-Trump supporters on TV and Radio having a pop at them for doing this.
Trump has absolutely played a blinder on this topic.
Carl_Manchester said:
They did and at huge personal cost to all three men on that podium, including the white-man. What happened after is truly tragic.
The NFL players are literally playing with fire on this issue and it I think they have mis-judged the mood. You even have non-Trump supporters on TV and Radio having a pop at them for doing this.
Trump has absolutely played a blinder on this topic.
s ever, we shall see. Trump "playing a blinder" sounds an oxymoron to me.The NFL players are literally playing with fire on this issue and it I think they have mis-judged the mood. You even have non-Trump supporters on TV and Radio having a pop at them for doing this.
Trump has absolutely played a blinder on this topic.
I get the impression that in the US, the national anthem and flag are really taken seriously. Alistair Cook, "Letter from America" covers some of this in his excellent monologues. They are still on the BBC. Not one episode, there are several, I used to listen to them a lot.
Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Nanook said:
jmorgan said:
I get the impression that in the US, the national anthem and flag are really taken seriously. Alistair Cook, "Letter from America" covers some of this in his excellent monologues. They are still on the BBC. Not one episode, there are several, I used to listen to them a lot.
Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Ever read any of the flag code?Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00yjfyt
Think Mr Cooke says it is too long to go into on the radio show.
Nanook said:
jmorgan said:
I get the impression that in the US, the national anthem and flag are really taken seriously. Alistair Cook, "Letter from America" covers some of this in his excellent monologues. They are still on the BBC. Not one episode, there are several, I used to listen to them a lot.
Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Ever read any of the flag code?Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
(c) Inclement weather
The flag should not be displayed on days when the weather is inclement, except when an all weather flag is displayed.
§175. Position and manner of display
The flag, when carried in a procession with another flag or flags, should be either on the marching right; that is, the flag's own right, or, if there is a line of other flags, in front of the center of that line.
(a) The flag should not be displayed on a float in a parade except from a staff, or as provided in subsection (i) of this section.
(b) The flag should not be draped over the hood, top, sides, or back of a vehicle or of a railroad train or a boat. When the flag is displayed on a motorcar, the staff shall be fixed firmly to the chassis or clamped to the right fender.
(c) No other flag or pennant should be placed above or, if on the same level, to the right of the flag of the United States of America, except during church services conducted by naval chaplains at sea, when the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for the personnel of the Navy. No person shall display the flag of the United Nations or any other national or international flag equal, above, or in a position of superior prominence or honor to, or in place of, the flag of the United States at any place within the United States or any Territory or possession thereof: Provided, That nothing in this section shall make unlawful the continuance of the practice heretofore followed of displaying the flag of the United Nations in a position of superior prominence or honor, and other national flags in positions of equal prominence or honor, with that of the flag of the United States at the headquarters of the United Nations.
(d) The flag of the United States of America, when it is displayed with another flag against a wall from crossed staffs, should be on the right, the flag's own right, and its staff should be in front of the staff of the other flag.
(e) The flag of the United States of America should be at the center and at the highest point of the group when a number of flags of States or localities or pennants of societies are grouped and displayed from staffs.
(f) When flags of States, cities, or localities, or pennants of societies are flown on the same halyard with the flag of the United States, the latter should always be at the peak. When the flags are flown from adjacent staffs, the flag of the United States should be hoisted first and lowered last. No such flag or pennant may be placed above the flag of the United States or to the United States flag's right.
(g) When flags of two or more nations are displayed, they are to be flown from separate staffs of the same height. The flags should be of approximately equal size. International usage forbids the display of the flag of one nation above that of another nation in time of peace.
(h) When the flag of the United States is displayed from a staff projecting horizontally or at an angle from the window sill, balcony, or front of a building, the union of the flag should be placed at the peak of the staff unless the flag is at half staff. When the flag is suspended over a sidewalk from a rope extending from a house to a pole at the edge of the sidewalk, the flag should be hoisted out, union first, from the building.
(i) When displayed either horizontally or vertically against a wall, the union should be uppermost and to the flag's own right, that is, to the observer's left. When displayed in a window, the flag should be displayed in the same way, with the union or blue field to the left of the observer in the street.
(j) When the flag is displayed over the middle of the street, it should be suspended vertically with the union to the north in an east and west street or to the east in a north and south street.
(k) When used on a speaker's platform, the flag, if displayed flat, should be displayed above and behind the speaker. When displayed from a staff in a church or public auditorium, the flag of the United States of America should hold the position of superior prominence, in advance of the audience, and in the position of honor at the clergyman's or speaker's right as he faces the audience. Any other flag so displayed should be placed on the left of the clergyman or speaker or to the right of the audience.
(l) The flag should form a distinctive feature of the ceremony of unveiling a statue or monument, but it should never be used as the covering for the statue or monument.
(m) The flag, when flown at half-staff, should be first hoisted to the peak for an instant and then lowered to the half-staff position. The flag should be again raised to the peak before it is lowered for the day. On Memorial Day the flag should be displayed at half-staff until noon only, then raised to the top of the staff. By order of the President, the flag shall be flown at half-staff upon the death of principal figures of the United States Government and the Governor of a State, territory, or possession, as a mark of respect to their memory. In the event of the death of other officials or foreign dignitaries, the flag is to be displayed at half-staff according to Presidential instructions or orders, or in accordance with recognized customs or practices not inconsistent with law. In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States, the Governor of that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be flown at half-staff. The flag shall be flown at half-staff thirty days from the death of the President or a former President; ten days from the day of death of the Vice President, the Chief Justice or a retired Chief Justice of the United States, or the Speaker of the House of Representatives; from the day of death until interment of an Associate Justice of the Supreme Court, a Secretary of an executive or military department, a former Vice President, or the Governor of a State, territory, or possession; and on the day of death and the following day for a Member of Congress. As used in this subsection -
(1) the term 'half-staff' means the position of the flag when it is one-half the distance between the top and bottom of the staff;
(2) the term 'executive or military department' means any agency listed under sections 101 and 102 of title 5; and
(3) the term 'Member of Congress' means a Senator, a Representative, a Delegate, or the Resident Commissioner from Puerto Rico.
(n) When the flag is used to cover a casket, it should be so placed that the union is at the head and over the left shoulder. The flag should not be lowered into the grave or allowed to touch the ground.
(o) When the flag is suspended across a corridor or lobby in a building with only one main entrance, it should be suspended vertically with the union of the flag to the observer's left upon entering. If the building has more than one main entrance, the flag should be suspended vertically near the center of the corridor or lobby with the union to the north, when entrances are to the east and west or to the east when entrances are to the north and south. If there are entrances in more than two directions, the union should be to the east.
(a) The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property.
(b) The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise.
(c) The flag should never be carried flat or horizontally, but always aloft and free.
(d) The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free. Bunting of blue, white, and red, always arranged with the blue above, the white in the middle, and the red below, should be used for covering a speaker's desk, draping the front of the platform, and for decoration in general.
(e) The flag should never be fastened, displayed, used, or stored in such a manner as to permit it to be easily torn, soiled, or damaged in any way.
(f) The flag should never be used as a covering for a ceiling.
(g) The flag should never have placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture, or drawing of any nature.
(h) The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.
(i) The flag should never be used for advertising purposes in any manner whatsoever. It should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions or handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use and discard. Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.
(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.
(k) The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning.
Those are just a few of the rules, but most of them are broken daily, all around the states. Using the flag in advertising, sports clothing, you have to take it inside when the weather is bad etc.
So, if they're going to get uppity about standing to attention when the anthem is being played, surely they need to deal with this lot too?
The USA also never "dips" the flag during the opening cermony of the Olympic Games (other international events may be the same but the Olympics is one I know about) for reasons of how the athletes are expected to respect the flag of their country etc etc. Nothing wrong with that at all, just another snippet of information about how they treat their flag very seriously in such circumstances.
jmorgan said:
I get the impression that in the US, the national anthem and flag are really taken seriously. Alistair Cook, "Letter from America" covers some of this in his excellent monologues. They are still on the BBC. Not one episode, there are several, I used to listen to them a lot.
Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Hugely, I recall going to a world championship boxing match at Madison Square Gardens as part of a large stag night (26 of us) some of the more drunken ones started to boo at the US Anthem, big mistake, very big mistake, the reaction from the Americans was ferocious. Something the First Lady I think also takes very seriously.
Not something to do in the US.
Shakermaker said:
You are Sheldon Cooper AICMFP.
The USA also never "dips" the flag during the opening cermony of the Olympic Games (other international events may be the same but the Olympics is one I know about) for reasons of how the athletes are expected to respect the flag of their country etc etc. Nothing wrong with that at all, just another snippet of information about how they treat their flag very seriously in such circumstances.
Some of that probably is ignored, again lauded to by the very observant Mr Cooke.The USA also never "dips" the flag during the opening cermony of the Olympic Games (other international events may be the same but the Olympics is one I know about) for reasons of how the athletes are expected to respect the flag of their country etc etc. Nothing wrong with that at all, just another snippet of information about how they treat their flag very seriously in such circumstances.
Efbe said:
"The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart."
The mind boggles. What kind of loon wrote this?
the way it is written might sound a bit loony, but the concept is sound. The mind boggles. What kind of loon wrote this?
Most symbols that we see in every day life have similarly written stuff about them to varying degrees of bizarreness. Poppies at Remembrance Day for example, much written about how the colour represents the blood of those killed on the battlefields, and the leaf should point to 11 O'Clock. Whilst I don't know how much of that is truly what is meant, or has been added in later on by others, it is a regularly accepted understanding by many people.
Shakermaker said:
Efbe said:
"The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart."
The mind boggles. What kind of loon wrote this?
the way it is written might sound a bit loony, but the concept is sound. The mind boggles. What kind of loon wrote this?
Most symbols that we see in every day life have similarly written stuff about them to varying degrees of bizarreness. Poppies at Remembrance Day for example, much written about how the colour represents the blood of those killed on the battlefields, and the leaf should point to 11 O'Clock. Whilst I don't know how much of that is truly what is meant, or has been added in later on by others, it is a regularly accepted understanding by many people.
I did find those rules quite hard to follow. Seems like it was saying the flag can only be as a flag on it's own not touching anything, as a lapel badge, or as a badge worn my military
Efbe said:
good point.
I did find those rules quite hard to follow. Seems like it was saying the flag can only be as a flag on it's own not touching anything, as a lapel badge, or as a badge worn my military
Pretty much, yes. Essentially it boils down to them not wanting the flag to be trivial, it is representative of the nation as a whole, and times when it is used are times when it is meant to be proudly displayed - as is the case with all national flags. A similar discussion arose on a topic here a few months back either in Lounge or GG, a PH'er spotted a local dealer to them with a tatty Union Flag on a pole outside and thought it was rather poor form - and I was inclined to agree. If you're going to the trouble of displaying the flag it is probably worth the effort to make it look good! I did find those rules quite hard to follow. Seems like it was saying the flag can only be as a flag on it's own not touching anything, as a lapel badge, or as a badge worn my military
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