Priti Patel

[ATG]

Digga said:

Blackpuddin said:

S600BSB said:

cgt2 said:

The extreme divides are largely on the fringes, right and left.

The vast majority of voters are maybe just a tad bit right of centre but this far right dog-whistle extremist rhetoric the present government is dominated by is far more unpalatable to most people than anything from Labour hence why for many the next election will be a case of voting for the least worst.

I mean when you have the Archbishop of Canterbury on your case over basic decency and morality and yet still think you're on the right track, in a nutshell that shows how out of touch the Tory Party is today.

Agree completely

This Archbishop of Canterbury?
https://leadership.ng/archbishop-of-canterbury-jus...

Church of England, with all the wealth God begged of the country, could end poverty singlehandedly.

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

[ATG]

bhstewie said:

lrdisco said:

I should be a natural for the conservatives.
Family background of small business owners from construction, small retail to farming.
I have had my own business from 25 years old, home owner from 21.
But the conservatives really are the nasty party.
Braverman, Patel, JRM, Hunt, Dorries, Boris. The whole lot of ERG nutcases.

I’m not a natural labour supporter either and will be looking at the Libs come election time.
Wasted vote though as you could put a blue rosette on a turd and it would win in my part of East Yorkshire.

There will be a lot of people in a similar position.

I think some of the responses highlight that rather than ask themselves whether the Conservatives have turned into a vile party that's no longer represent Conservative values and are basically impossible for many decent people to vote for some people will persuade themselves anyone who doesn't vote for them has moved to the left.

This

[crankedup5]

Representation of the electoral mandate 2019, you may not like or agree with but it what it is.

[ATG]

crankedup5 said:

Representation of the electoral mandate 2019, you may not like or agree with but it what it is.

At some stage you have to take on board that Boris did not win the last election. Corbyn lost it. The last GE was not some rapturous endorsement of the Conservative manifesto. It was the choice between the two weakest front benches of my adult life.

[crankedup5]

ATG said:

crankedup5 said:

Representation of the electoral mandate 2019, you may not like or agree with but it what it is.

At some stage you have to take on board that Boris did not win the last election. Corbyn lost it. The last GE was not some rapturous endorsement of the Conservative manifesto. It was the choice between the two weakest front benches of my adult life.

Seemed like a big majority to me that the Tories won, still if you want to somehow dress it up as something else feel free. Also it was won on one big promise ‘get brexit done’. Lots of other stuff not yet delivered.

[ATG]

crankedup5 said:

ATG said:

crankedup5 said:

Representation of the electoral mandate 2019, you may not like or agree with but it what it is.

At some stage you have to take on board that Boris did not win the last election. Corbyn lost it. The last GE was not some rapturous endorsement of the Conservative manifesto. It was the choice between the two weakest front benches of my adult life.

Seemed like a big majority to me that the Tories won, still if you want to somehow dress it up as something else feel free. Also it was won on one big promise ‘get brexit done’. Lots of other stuff not yet delivered.

I have pieces of garden furniture that could have beaten Corbyn. For the sake of the Conservative Party it is really important that they reject this crazy notion being peddled by JRM, Patel and others that they need Boris back and their associated utterly daft and undeliverable non-policies. Boris is NOT the great campaigner and electoral asset they pretend he is. He was less awful than Corbyn. That is not much of an achievment. The very last thing they need to do is to listen and pander to the wingnuts who elected Liz Truss of all people to replace Boris. There's a time and a place for listening to the grassroots and there's also a time and a place for telling them some hard truths. It's currently time for the latter. They need to ignore Boris's useless clique, make a very public show of supporting the current PM and Chancellor, and find some face-saving way of bringing Home Office policies back from la la land into the real world. That way they might begin to look like a competent, sane party once more.

[Escort3500]

ATG said:

crankedup5 said:

ATG said:

crankedup5 said:

Representation of the electoral mandate 2019, you may not like or agree with but it what it is.

At some stage you have to take on board that Boris did not win the last election. Corbyn lost it. The last GE was not some rapturous endorsement of the Conservative manifesto. It was the choice between the two weakest front benches of my adult life.

Seemed like a big majority to me that the Tories won, still if you want to somehow dress it up as something else feel free. Also it was won on one big promise ‘get brexit done’. Lots of other stuff not yet delivered.

I have pieces of garden furniture that could have beaten Corbyn. For the sake of the Conservative Party it is really important that they reject this crazy notion being peddled by JRM, Patel and others that they need Boris back and their associated utterly daft and undeliverable non-policies. Boris is NOT the great campaigner and electoral asset they pretend he is. He was less awful than Corbyn. That is not much of an achievment. The very last thing they need to do is to listen and pander to the wingnuts who elected Liz Truss of all people to replace Boris. There's a time and a place for listening to the grassroots and there's also a time and a place for telling them some hard truths. It's currently time for the latter. They need to ignore Boris's useless clique, make a very public show of supporting the current PM and Chancellor, and find some face-saving way of bringing Home Office policies back from la la land into the real world. That way they might begin to look like a competent, sane party once more.

Well said

[Digga]

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

[turbobloke]

Digga said:

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

Inside CofE churches and other buildings there's many an artefact made of precious metal.

During lockdown the CofE safeguarded relics valued at multi £millions in the Tower of London due to fears of them being stolen.

[cgt2]

Boris did his best to give the Queen covid according to Anthony Seldon. Boris had covid symptoms on 25 March 2020 a day before he tested positive but he insisted on meeting the Queen in person for their weekly appointment. He was eventually talked down by the Palace and Cummings.

For all the destruction he unleashed it could have been even worse.

He does not deserve and will not ever be near power again. Many of his sycophants are well aware how terrible he was and I suspect their interest is selfish as he was apparently so easily manipulable for their own ends.

[DeejRC]

Crikey we got a bit weird in here in the last day.
First the Tombola garden fete party born of divorce and burnings could bring world peace and end hunger in a cpl of day and then Boris allegedly couldn’t win an election against a a wet paper bag.
Boris wins an election against the vast vast VAST majority of candidates. At any level. He just does, its his political history. He still would. People naturally gravitate to the man of optimism, of vision, bonhomie, good will. His political skill IS his personality. His weaknesses are everything else. Such a person is an election winning asset par excellence. Unless he has a very strong political operation around him after he has won said election - then he becomes a naff governing asset. Welcome to C’est la vie 101.
Rishi doesnt need to “deal” with Priti or Mogg, they aren’t going to do anything. Talk a bit, blah blah but they aren’t going to do anything, nor can they. Nor are they going to affect any votes for the TP at the next GE, ppl don’t choose who they are voting for on Westminster blah blah. So let them waffle on at some fringe thing, Labour has been doing that for yrs, some fringe part of Conference gets 1min on the evening news and everybody carries on.
And the CofE is never going to do anything that affects anybody or rocks any boat too much. I think I’d fall over in shock if anybody at the CofE ever attempted to do anything vaguely more ambitious than host the worlds largest cake sale.

[ATG]

Digga said:

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

Look at their accounts before you start making baseless accusations. Data, not prejudice.

[Murph7355]

ATG said:

Digga said:

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

Look at their accounts before you start making baseless accusations. Data, not prejudice.

The property assets they do own would typically cost a fortune in upkeep I suspect.

They could sell chunks of it off, along with trinkets, I guess. But I've yet to see a church conversion that looks any good or see many people wanting to live next to a graveyard. And once the trinkets are gone, they're gone.

There is much at fault with the church/religion and its part in our governance etc, but there are elements of it that do good too.

[turbobloke]

Murph7355 said:

ATG said:

Digga said:

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

Look at their accounts before you start making baseless accusations. Data, not prejudice.

The property assets they do own would typically cost a fortune in upkeep I suspect.

They could sell chunks of it off, along with trinkets, I guess. But I've yet to see a church conversion that looks any good or see many people wanting to live next to a graveyard. And once the trinkets are gone, they're gone.

There is much at fault with the church/religion and its part in our governance etc, but there are elements of it that do good too.

The accusations clearly aren't baseless.

Link said:

The Church Commissioners – who own a 105,000-acre land and property portfolio worth some £2billion – are notoriously tight-lipped about their landholdings.

Click

[Killboy]

ATG said:

I have pieces of garden furniture that could have beaten Corbyn. For the sake of the Conservative Party it is really important that they reject this crazy notion being peddled by JRM, Patel and others that they need Boris back and their associated utterly daft and undeliverable non-policies. Boris is NOT the great campaigner and electoral asset they pretend he is. He was less awful than Corbyn. That is not much of an achievment. The very last thing they need to do is to listen and pander to the wingnuts who elected Liz Truss of all people to replace Boris. There's a time and a place for listening to the grassroots and there's also a time and a place for telling them some hard truths. It's currently time for the latter. They need to ignore Boris's useless clique, make a very public show of supporting the current PM and Chancellor, and find some face-saving way of bringing Home Office policies back from la la land into the real world. That way they might begin to look like a competent, sane party once more.

Well actually I think Boris represents a lot of the conservative side and they want him back.

[ATG]

turbobloke said:

Murph7355 said:

ATG said:

Digga said:

ATG said:

C of E is permanently cash-strapped and it already spends tons of money on stuff to help prop up the poor

How sad.

Except for the fact they own several billion pounds worth of real estate.

Look at their accounts before you start making baseless accusations. Data, not prejudice.

The property assets they do own would typically cost a fortune in upkeep I suspect.

They could sell chunks of it off, along with trinkets, I guess. But I've yet to see a church conversion that looks any good or see many people wanting to live next to a graveyard. And once the trinkets are gone, they're gone.

There is much at fault with the church/religion and its part in our governance etc, but there are elements of it that do good too.

The accusations clearly aren't baseless.

Link said:

The Church Commissioners – who own a 105,000-acre land and property portfolio worth some £2billion – are notoriously tight-lipped about their landholdings.

Click

The accusations are baseless if you bring your brain to the table. Is £2 billion quid's worth of assets large or small compared to the turnover and liabilities of the C of E? Look at their accounts ...

[cgt2]

DeejRC said:

Crikey we got a bit weird in here in the last day.
First the Tombola garden fete party born of divorce and burnings could bring world peace and end hunger in a cpl of day and then Boris allegedly couldn’t win an election against a a wet paper bag.
Boris wins an election against the vast vast VAST majority of candidates. At any level. He just does, its his political history. He still would. People naturally gravitate to the man of optimism, of vision, bonhomie, good will. His political skill IS his personality. His weaknesses are everything else. Such a person is an election winning asset par excellence. Unless he has a very strong political operation around him after he has won said election - then he becomes a naff governing asset. Welcome to C’est la vie 101.
Rishi doesnt need to “deal” with Priti or Mogg, they aren’t going to do anything. Talk a bit, blah blah but they aren’t going to do anything, nor can they. Nor are they going to affect any votes for the TP at the next GE, ppl don’t choose who they are voting for on Westminster blah blah. So let them waffle on at some fringe thing, Labour has been doing that for yrs, some fringe part of Conference gets 1min on the evening news and everybody carries on.
And the CofE is never going to do anything that affects anybody or rocks any boat too much. I think I’d fall over in shock if anybody at the CofE ever attempted to do anything vaguely more ambitious than host the worlds largest cake sale.

He won a landslide when most of the country fell for his bluster and bullst without knowing much about him (although things like the Guppy affair had been known for decades, he got a lot of help from the likes of Murdoch killing stories)

He would not have been reelected London Mayor as Londoners knew him too well by 2015.

With all the widely publicised cronyism, greed and inability to actually lead rather than be liked and please powerful allies, added to massive unpopularity, I struggle to see him ever regaining real power again.

If he holds on to Uxbridge that will be a massive uphill task in itself.

His ego wants power but his comfortable life and earning opportunities out of the spotlight (he has gone from constant debts to buying several million pound houses after leaving office) will probably lead him to think it's not so bad after all without the constant scrutiny of his private life and his obvious chaotic inability to manage a small cafe let alone a country.

[Murph7355]

cgt2 said:

He won a landslide when most of the country fell for his bluster and bullst without knowing much about him (although things like the Guppy affair had been known for decades, he got a lot of help from the likes of Murdoch killing stories)

He would not have been reelected London Mayor as Londoners knew him too well by 2015.

....

He won a landslide because the rest of Parliament had its collective head stuck up its arse. Boris is nothing if not an opportunist.

And he was mayor from 08-16 wasn't he?

As with many people and things, their biggest strengths often become severe weaknesses, however.

It would have been interesting to see what might have happened without Covid. That sort of event needed order, structure and heads down. Which is exactly not what the disrupting set up that won the landslide was any use for (ironically I think the likes of May, Hammond and Hunt would have been reasonably ideal through Covid).

Much as I am not a massive fan of him personally, I think Cummings might have ultimately been a force for some good in our governing structures. We'll never know now.

[sugerbear]

Killboy said:

ATG said:

I have pieces of garden furniture that could have beaten Corbyn. For the sake of the Conservative Party it is really important that they reject this crazy notion being peddled by JRM, Patel and others that they need Boris back and their associated utterly daft and undeliverable non-policies. Boris is NOT the great campaigner and electoral asset they pretend he is. He was less awful than Corbyn. That is not much of an achievment. The very last thing they need to do is to listen and pander to the wingnuts who elected Liz Truss of all people to replace Boris. There's a time and a place for listening to the grassroots and there's also a time and a place for telling them some hard truths. It's currently time for the latter. They need to ignore Boris's useless clique, make a very public show of supporting the current PM and Chancellor, and find some face-saving way of bringing Home Office policies back from la la land into the real world. That way they might begin to look like a competent, sane party once more.

Well actually I think Boris represents a lot of the conservative side and they want him back.

Maybe he can get brexit done this time ?

[eldar]

Killboy said:

Well actually I think Boris represents a lot of the conservative side and they want him back.

I've no doubt you are correct. A lot of the labour side want Corbyn back. One side wants a crook back, another an out of touch extremist.

Tragic we have a clown shoed government and a cats-in-a-sack opposition, both equally useless.