The U.S.A. Mass Shootings Thread

[98elise]

Last Visit said:

I agree they should have taken more proactive decisons, but it must also be awful to he a police officer there, knowing that every level of the state political system is 'guns' through and through and that the chances of legislation being passed to make your job a little safer is never coming.

You're facing a society that lets Joe public purchase deadly assault weapons and yet also one that will do sweet f'all to prevent it.

They aren't assault weapons, they are just semi automatic rifles. Not that I think anyone should have easy access to any fire arms though.

[F1GTRUeno]

gotoPzero said:

Gweeds said:

So a Kevlar vest is less than useless against an AR15?

In what sane world is that sort of weapon allowed for citizens?

Its not designed to stop rifle rounds. You would have to ban every centrefire rifle because I cant think of any centre fire rifle that will be defeated by a level 3 kevlar vest.
.
Kevlar is designed to stop most handgun rounds. The police use soft Kevlar because in the vast majority of cases its better for their duties.
Thats it.

Okay, let's do that.

[Talksteer]

deadtom said:

croyde said:

The paper says that the bullets from a .226 calibre rifle would punch straight through the officer's body armour like a hole punch through paper.

I'm in no way an expert but that Sky News reporter that was ambushed by Russian troops in Ukraine, later found 6 bullets lodged in his body armour.

I presume the Russians were using AK military rifles of the same 'punch' as an AR.

Easy to say from the safety of my phone but I think those US cops were all pussies.

If kids were in danger I would hope that I'd be happy to take a big risk in helping them.

Maybe they were only wearing pretend cardboard body armour.

The standard round used by Russia (5.45 x 39 mm) has approx 75% of the muzzle energy of the NATO (5.56 x 45 mm) round, so it is significantly less powerful.

The way it was explained to us in phase 1 was that body armour is designed to give decent protection against fragmentation, ricochet, pistol rounds and to hold your insides inside if you do get hit by something big. Reading up on it now suggests that the NATO round should be stopped by body armour (and therefore the less powerful Russian version definitely should), but I am sure that we were told to assume that the armour would not protect us from a direct hit from a rifle.

Something like 75% of battle casualties in peer on peer wars are caused by fragments from artillery/mortars. Which given that soldiers tend to take cover is why helmets are particularly effective. Vietnam showed that casualty/KIA rates were halved by wearing nylon flak jackets hence why most NATO forces adopted basic ballistic vests in the 70's. Helmets and ballistic vests also make substantial differences to the survivability of vehicle crews.

However in counter insurgency the other side doesn't often possess artillery so firearms injuries become much more prevalent and given the desire for low casualties forces began to buy small quantities of ballistic vests with ceramic plates which could stop 7.62 ball. In the case of the British Army Northern Ireland was the catalyst for this, note the vastly reduced amount of casualties through the 80's (and the lower inclination of the IRA to engage in gunfights).

In the 90's most NATO forces started generally fielding ballistic vests with ceramic plates to front line forces in operations. These would have been rated to something equivalent to Level 3 body armour so the plates would have been resistant to NATO 7.62. Since the GWOT in 2001 most forces have moved to more tailored systems which have plates resistant to AP round in 7.62 which approximately equates to level 4 protection.

There is still plenty of places on the vests which have only fragmentation protection hence the guidance to avoid being shot (duh).

[Byker28i]

Interesting
Michigan school shooter’s parents will stand trial on involuntary manslaughter charges, with the state appeals court said the murders wouldn’t have happened had the parents not bought a gun for their son or if they had taken him home school on the day of the shooting.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oxford-michig...

[MKnight702]

Byker28i said:

Interesting
Michigan school shooter’s parents will stand trial on involuntary manslaughter charges, with the state appeals court said the murders wouldn’t have happened had the parents not bought a gun for their son or if they had taken him home school on the day of the shooting.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oxford-michig...

Jeez, where does this merry-go-round stop, please let me off. Do they now start to prosecute the car dealer that sold the drunk driver the car or the farmer that sold the grain to the brewery?

[QJumper]

MKnight702 said:

Byker28i said:

Interesting
Michigan school shooter’s parents will stand trial on involuntary manslaughter charges, with the state appeals court said the murders wouldn’t have happened had the parents not bought a gun for their son or if they had taken him home school on the day of the shooting.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oxford-michig...

Jeez, where does this merry-go-round stop, please let me off. Do they now start to prosecute the car dealer that sold the drunk driver the car or the farmer that sold the grain to the brewery?

It's mind boggling. The rest of the world can see that ownership of guns is the problem, and yet they appear blind to that possibility, and deperately keep looking at other targets to point the finger at.

[captain_cynic]

MKnight702 said:

Byker28i said:

Interesting
Michigan school shooter’s parents will stand trial on involuntary manslaughter charges, with the state appeals court said the murders wouldn’t have happened had the parents not bought a gun for their son or if they had taken him home school on the day of the shooting.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oxford-michig...

Jeez, where does this merry-go-round stop, please let me off. Do they now start to prosecute the car dealer that sold the drunk driver the car or the farmer that sold the grain to the brewery?

Yes, how dare they suggest that parents are in any way responsible for the actions of the children trhey raise


Preposterous, harrumph. Gone to the dogs, et al.

[Rivenink]

MKnight702 said:

Byker28i said:

Interesting
Michigan school shooter’s parents will stand trial on involuntary manslaughter charges, with the state appeals court said the murders wouldn’t have happened had the parents not bought a gun for their son or if they had taken him home school on the day of the shooting.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/oxford-michig...

Jeez, where does this merry-go-round stop, please let me off. Do they now start to prosecute the car dealer that sold the drunk driver the car or the farmer that sold the grain to the brewery?

There is a slight difference between the parewnts and a car dealer in this situation.

Given the parents spawned the dude and 'raised' him.

[durbster]

At least they're doing something about it in Utah, a state in which firearms are apparently the biggest single cause of death. They've just signed a bill designed to protect children, which brings in a load of restrictions and monitoring around the purchasing and usage of firearms. It just goes to show that these big industries can be challenged when there is a real will to do so.

Oh hang on... did I say firearms?

Sorry, I meant social media.

Salt Lake Tribune said:

Utah first state to pass social media regulations aimed at protecting minors

Utah is the first state in the nation to begin restricting how minors can use social media apps. Gov. Spencer Cox signed a pair of bills on Thursday that will regulate when and how minors in Utah can use of social media and aims to stop those companies from designing addicting features.

Source (paywalled)

Silly me.

[Byker28i]

Florida just passed permitless carry legislation through the Florida House
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-governme...

[Cold]

It's Monday, so that means Nashville. At time of writing, three students at the Covenant School reported shot, gunman now dead.

https://www.newschannel5.com/news/police-respondin...

[croyde]

If I was a Yank I'd be as embarrassed as fek!

[bitchstewie]

Female shooter which is pretty rare isn't it?

Pretty sure I can't recall that happening before.

[Blib]

It's good to see that women are now stepping up to the plate.

[FourWheelDrift]

Gun violence is an equal opportunities employer.

[Cold]

Nashville toll now up to six. Three children, three adults. Still unclear whether this total includes the teenage female shooter.

[Blib]

Cold said:

Nashville toll now up to six. Three children, three adults. Still unclear whether this total includes the teenage female shooter.

I'm on tenterhooks.

[MissChief]

More dead children. Oh well, never mind.

[s1962a]

129th shooting this year.. and it's March

[FourWheelDrift]

s1962a said:

129th shooting this year.. and it's March

129 in 86 days, it's almost as if they are rushing for a reason.