BBC Womens pay gap

[leef44]

OddCat said:

The whole gender pay gap issue is becoming farcical.

Easyjet was touted as the worst overall last week.....but that is surely because most of the pilots are blokes and most of the cabin staff are girls. So not comparing apples with apples...

This is probably the same for phase eight (which I would not have known was a women's clothes store if it wasn't because of my OH buying dresses there). The assistants there are normally young attractive girls. I wonder whether the only blokes that are employed by them are the top few jobs. This leaves them with a very skewed gender gap.

[Pesty]

I do find it interesting she turned down a £45k pay rise.

I wonder how many people in full time employment in the uk don’t even get 45k for working all year.

[bloomen]

There's a lot of BBC pay I don't get. Clare Balding who's probably on 3 hours of radio and TV per day was on £150,000-£200,000. Some tub of lard DJ in Northern Ireland I've never heard of was on £450,000.

I know who delivers more value overall.

[Moonhawk]

leef44 said:

OddCat said:

The whole gender pay gap issue is becoming farcical.

Easyjet was touted as the worst overall last week.....but that is surely because most of the pilots are blokes and most of the cabin staff are girls. So not comparing apples with apples...

This is probably the same for phase eight (which I would not have known was a women's clothes store if it wasn't because of my OH buying dresses there). The assistants there are normally young attractive girls. I wonder whether the only blokes that are employed by them are the top few jobs. This leaves them with a very skewed gender gap.

It's just getting silly. It's like the Birmingham council workers case. Dinner ladies complained that 'bin men' were getting paid more - and claimed gender discrimination. Why didn't they just apply to be refuse collectors?

I guess it was much easier to continue dishing slop in a nice warm school and employ a no-win no-fee lawyer screaming "discrimination" that it was to apply for the higher paying (but arguably sttier and more dangerous) job of trekking round, emptying bins in all weathers.

The only studies which show a gender pay gap - are those that treat salary at a very high level and average across a diverse range of people and jobs. These studies fail to correct for things like career breaks, hours worked, experience, danger, work/life balance priorities etc yet are held up as proof that there is a gender bias in favour of men.

Edited by Moonhawk on Tuesday 9th January 21:09

[Brave Fart]

Can any of the esteemed posters of PH offer a genuine example (i.e. from their own experience) where a female is paid less for doing an identical job to a male colleague of the same experience, competence and qualifications? Serious question, not rhetorical.

[SpeedMattersNot]

Brave Fart said:

Can any of the esteemed posters of PH offer a genuine example (i.e. from their own experience) where a female is paid less for doing an identical job to a male colleague of the same experience, competence and qualifications? Serious question, not rhetorical.

No, but worked with an abundance of men who believe women can't do a job as well as men, theoretically and also applied to women currently in high up positions, questioning 'I wonder if a bloke was in charge etc'.

It's certainly not as bad as people make out, but it definitely exists. I'm not for one minute suggesting it doesn't work the opposite way round too - heard plenty of women bad mouthing men for being useless, slack, lazy around the house yet expect certain jobs to be carried out by men.

For me the biggest problem is regarding children. I know of several women who chose to have children and carry on with their careers and they've been left behind big time.

[Moonhawk]

SpeedMattersNot said:

For me the biggest problem is regarding children. I know of several women who chose to have children and carry on with their careers and they've been left behind big time.

Is there an answer to that though. If you take time out of a job for any reason, including having kids, you are likely to start lagging behind those that have not.

Is it any coincidence that recent studies show women out earning men 'on average' up until the age of ~35, which is also around the time that women are having kids?

[amgmcqueen]

Pesty said:

I do find it interesting she turned down a £45k pay rise.

I wonder how many people in full time employment in the uk don’t even get 45k for working all year.

£45k of taxpayers money....absolutely sickening the tv license is allowed to continue in 2018!

[Moonhawk]

Pesty said:

I do find it interesting she turned down a £45k pay rise.

I wonder how many people in full time employment in the uk don’t even get 45k for working all year.

Average pay in the UK is currently sitting around £29,000 mark.

Even with just a salary of £45k (let alone a pay rise of that amount) would mean earning more than around 85% of the UK population and her actual salary (before being offered the pay rise) would see her comfortably in the 99th percentile.

Edited by Moonhawk on Tuesday 9th January 21:32

[SpeedMattersNot]

Moonhawk said:

SpeedMattersNot said:

For me the biggest problem is regarding children. I know of several women who chose to have children and carry on with their careers and they've been left behind big time.

Is there an answer to that though. If you take time out of a job for any reason, including having kids, you are likely to start lagging behind those that have not.

Is it any coincidence that recent studies show women out earning men 'on average' up until the age of ~35, which is also around the time that women are having kids?

Just a shame though, don't you think. They seldom grow up in families where the woman is the bread winner. I've had parents at parents evening say that they want their daughter to become a teacher because it's a good part-time career for when she has children. He's not wrong, but being a teacher is hardly an inspiring decision for the calibre of this particular student!

I believe I know women who have applied for positions and lost out because they are openly trying for children. One mate even said a lady shouldn't have applied for a particular job because she knew she was pregnant. And this is an educated young man.

[Ayahuasca]

Never heard of her before.

Some people get paid more than you, love. Get over it.

[MG CHRIS]

Moonhawk said:

leef44 said:

OddCat said:

The whole gender pay gap issue is becoming farcical.

Easyjet was touted as the worst overall last week.....but that is surely because most of the pilots are blokes and most of the cabin staff are girls. So not comparing apples with apples...

This is probably the same for phase eight (which I would not have known was a women's clothes store if it wasn't because of my OH buying dresses there). The assistants there are normally young attractive girls. I wonder whether the only blokes that are employed by them are the top few jobs. This leaves them with a very skewed gender gap.

It's just getting silly. It's like the Birmingham council workers case. Dinner ladies complained that 'bin men' were getting paid more - and claimed gender discrimination. Why didn't they just apply to be refuse collectors?

I guess it was much easier to continue dishing slop in a nice warm school and employ a no-win no-fee lawyer screaming "discrimination" that it was to apply for the higher paying (but arguably sttier and more dangerous) job of trekking round, emptying bins in all weathers.

The only studies which show a gender pay gap - are those that treat salary at a very high level and average across a diverse range of people and jobs. These studies fail to correct for things like career breaks, hours worked, experience, danger, work/life balance priorities etc yet are held up as proof that there is a gender bias in favour of men.

Edited by Moonhawk on Tuesday 9th January 21:09

You are wrong on that. Council work on pay grades and both bin men and dinner laddies were on the same pay grade which meant they should of been on the same money per hour but they weren't. That was a valid case which should of happened ages ago before it actually did get resolved. Do some fact checking before talking crap.

I do agree with you that the gender pay gap is a load of bks though these days its more a earnings gap over life time of each gender which can be explained quiet easily.

[Moonhawk]

MG CHRIS said:

You are wrong on that. Council work on pay grades and both bin men and dinner laddies were on the same pay grade which meant they should of been on the same money per hour but they weren't. That was a valid case which should of happened ages ago before it actually did get resolved. Do some fact checking before talking crap.

Even if what you say is true and it was a legitimate case of pay equalisation across job functions - I still don't see it as a case of gender discrimination, unless the council actively denied the women access to the higher paying refuse collection jobs - or tried to pay them less if they did apply.

Also - many companies employ grading systems - but the pay for a particular grade forms a band. Where you find yourself on that band is a function of the role, the qualifications and experience required, the responsibilities etc.

For example I worked for a company that had job grades from band E up to band A. The pay for each band could be quite wide, around £15k-£20k for the lower bands - even more for the higher bands.

So you could have two people in grade C roles with one earning £20k more than the other simply due to the requirements and demands of the actual role they were performing within that grade.

[Willy Nilly]

Couldn't the Chinese just make a cheap, knock off Carrie Gracie?

[MG CHRIS]

Moonhawk said:

MG CHRIS said:

You are wrong on that. Council work on pay grades and both bin men and dinner laddies were on the same pay grade which meant they should of been on the same money per hour but they weren't. That was a valid case which should of happened ages ago before it actually did get resolved. Do some fact checking before talking crap.

Even if what you say is true and it was a legitimate case of pay equalisation across job functions - I still don't see it as a case of gender discrimination, unless the council actively denied the women access to the higher paying refuse collection jobs - or tried to pay them less if they did apply.

Also - many companies employ grading systems - but the pay for a particular grade forms a band. Where you find yourself on that band is a function of the role, the qualifications and experience required, the responsibilities etc.

For example I worked for a company that had job grades from band E up to band A. The pay for each band could be quite wide, around £15k-£20k for the lower bands - even more for the higher bands.

So you could have two people in grade C roles with one earning £20k more than the other simply due to the requirements and demands of the actual role they were performing within that grade.

Its true as my mother was a part of it at the time abit in south wales doesn't matter on job if they are on the same pay grade they should have been paid the same hourly rate which wasnt the case hence the court case which proved them right. It wasnt fought on gender discrimination though at the time it was about being paid the same on the same pay grid its just the media made it out to be just that.

[Cupramax]

Willy Nilly said:

Couldn't the Chinese just make a cheap, knock off Carrie Gracie?

And call her Callie Glacie... ahso, I thank you

[oyster]

Ayahuasca said:

Never heard of her before.

Some people get paid more than you, love. Get over it.

I see the infants are back in PH again.

Do you really think it's ok to pay someone less because they are a woman, or they're black, or they're gay?

[V41LEY]

Irrespective of the pay discrimination - I find the pay these journos are getting as immoral. This Glacie is probably living free of charge in a licence fee paying safe house, expenses, 2 or 3 flights a year home, pension. Wrong !

[Pesty]

MG CHRIS said:

You are wrong on that. Council work on pay grades and both bin men and dinner laddies were on the same pay grade which meant they should of been on the same money per hour but they weren't. That was a valid case which should of happened ages ago before it actually did get resolved. Do some fact checking before talking crap.

I do agree with you that the gender pay gap is a load of bks though these days its more a earnings gap over life time of each gender which can be explained quiet easily.

Then they shouldn’t have been on the same pay grade. Those jobs are in no way commensurable

[voyds9]

Pesty said:

Then they shouldn’t have been on the same pay grade. Those jobs are in no way commensurable

Probably a lack of relevant pay grades.

All the council/NHS/etc pay scales I've seen have a between bracket ie pay between £19k and £22k