Where is the dark web, and what's on it?
Discussion
Never you mind said:
to be truly anonymous on the net it's best to use some kind of Anonymous Unix based OS. These are loaded off a USB rather than on your hard drive as it's easier, should the fuzz be closing in, to get rid of a usb stick rather than your laptop. I had a play a while ago with these things and it's encrypted up to stupid levels and passwords have to be at least 32 characters long. There is zero to no chance of anyone getting info out it.
There has also been cases where the people that run TOR routers/bridges have been forced, probably to save themselves from prosecution, to hand over all the information they have i.e. logs to enforcement agencies. I imagine this is how most people get caught.
I wouldn't use a USB unless you are confident that it can be hardware set to read only (something like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kanguru-Flash-Physical-Pr... as you risk something being cached otherwise. In the UK they can and will detain you indefinitely if you won't hand over the decryption key/password for a USB drive/PC so it is vital you don't store anything. Personally I'd go for one of the variants that'll boot of a CD in a laptop without a writable CD drive and no internal storage, that way nothing can be written. Stuff can still be retrieved from the RAM if they are quick enough and prepared to mess about cooling the RAM and you are high enough profile to warrant that.There has also been cases where the people that run TOR routers/bridges have been forced, probably to save themselves from prosecution, to hand over all the information they have i.e. logs to enforcement agencies. I imagine this is how most people get caught.
Disk level encryption is only protection when the disk isn't mounted. Once it is mounted (and thus encrypted) anything or anybody with interactive access to the device (local or remote) can read anything even on a boot CD. Good hygiene around where and what you do still needs to be practiced as a remote attack is most likely, face to face from enforcement you have very little options other than destruction.
I use Qubes on my personal laptop, doesn't protect from being forced to decrypt it but every application, every web page, is all loaded in a separate, isolated, temporary (if I choose) container. Tor and VPN is built in, although I prefer running VPN on the router as it means everything I choose goes through the VPN on any device (including mobiles), and I'm only managing one connection not multiple installs.
Compromising nodes or market places is easy once they locate them, and thanks to the Ozzies they can run them as a honeypot for as long as they want. Once it is compromised additional logging, usually via a hacked version of the routing software will be implemented. They will try to create a digital fingerprint to track you back to your real identity.
Anybody using google and expecting anonymity is an idiot, check out: https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity for just some of the crap they log about you, Facebook is worse. This can be requested by UK.Gov any time they want without you knowing.
fblm said:
rxe said:
....
If you use a VPN, your service provider (and hence the U.K. gov) has no idea what you are doing. You could be watching Peppa Pig all day...
You joke but Peppa Pig and Ben and Holly definitely make up the majority of the traffic over our vpn!If you use a VPN, your service provider (and hence the U.K. gov) has no idea what you are doing. You could be watching Peppa Pig all day...
With my VPN I cannot even access Netflix or the BBC iPlayer from aboard, never mind the Dark Web, because Netflix or the BBC spots it!
foxbody-87 said:
It blew my mind when reading about that recent paedo that got caught, that there are forums on the dark web where people openly & freely discuss their interest in child abuse. As kids we are told about the ‘bogeyman’, makes you realise that the reality is far worse.
With over a million users on it!! People are f
ked up.
Ayahuasca said:
Does not your VPN provider know what you are doing?
With my VPN I cannot even access Netflix or the BBC iPlayer from aboard, never mind the Dark Web, because Netflix or the BBC spots it!
After a lot of trial and error I found a great vpn that is fast and solid and works with all the usual suspects. PM me... My ISP here in the Caribbean also sells cable TV so they throttle streaming services, the vpn fools them too.With my VPN I cannot even access Netflix or the BBC iPlayer from aboard, never mind the Dark Web, because Netflix or the BBC spots it!
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 20th February 19:30
Japveesix said:
I'm not sure if you've had your question answered yet but you've probably been given a lot of wrong information.
As far as i know the 'Dark web' is directly referring to Mumsnet and all of the horrors it holds.
Well it’s certainly encrypted with enough weird acronyms to make it unreadable for me.As far as i know the 'Dark web' is directly referring to Mumsnet and all of the horrors it holds.
Pleased to see that people have picked up on the difference between Dark Web and Deep Web.
Some good posts too.
In short I like to think of surface web as the part of the web where people want to be found in order to sell you things, be that commercially sell you stuff for money, or sell you information or ideas / thoughts e.g. blogs etc. In order to be found they have hooks on the website which search engines latch onto, the skill is in making these hooks efficient so you are high up in the results.
The deep web is where people don't want to be found, principally because they are up to something dodgy and access to them is via specialist software and invitation only with complicated urls.
Nobody knows how big the deep web is, and of course the press sensationalises that.
What's in the deep web. Criminals mainly, you can buy anything, credit card numbers, information about people, illegal substances firearms obviously, you can get a quote from a hit man to deal with your wife or that prick who keeps blocking your drive if that's what you want. Secondly porn, obviously, thirdly very specialist discussion sites on taboo subjects, e.g. suicide and all it entails. Fourth organisations that want their activities to be secret, e.g. government intelligence agencies use it, in fact as pointed out in one of the posts one such did the development that led to it's existence, equally terrorist organisations too. Fortunately many of the latter are too dim and make mistakes.
Dark Web I tend to think of as the part of the web that no longer works properly, the information is still there just not easily accessible, but not specifically deliberately hidden, that's a personal view obviously, but it pisses me off when media talk about dark web when really they should be referring to deep web.
Some good posts too.
In short I like to think of surface web as the part of the web where people want to be found in order to sell you things, be that commercially sell you stuff for money, or sell you information or ideas / thoughts e.g. blogs etc. In order to be found they have hooks on the website which search engines latch onto, the skill is in making these hooks efficient so you are high up in the results.
The deep web is where people don't want to be found, principally because they are up to something dodgy and access to them is via specialist software and invitation only with complicated urls.
Nobody knows how big the deep web is, and of course the press sensationalises that.
What's in the deep web. Criminals mainly, you can buy anything, credit card numbers, information about people, illegal substances firearms obviously, you can get a quote from a hit man to deal with your wife or that prick who keeps blocking your drive if that's what you want. Secondly porn, obviously, thirdly very specialist discussion sites on taboo subjects, e.g. suicide and all it entails. Fourth organisations that want their activities to be secret, e.g. government intelligence agencies use it, in fact as pointed out in one of the posts one such did the development that led to it's existence, equally terrorist organisations too. Fortunately many of the latter are too dim and make mistakes.
Dark Web I tend to think of as the part of the web that no longer works properly, the information is still there just not easily accessible, but not specifically deliberately hidden, that's a personal view obviously, but it pisses me off when media talk about dark web when really they should be referring to deep web.
Edited by FiF on Tuesday 20th February 20:05
FiF said:
Lots of stuff
I’d always thought of Dark/Deep as being the other way round to the way you have it - Deep web being stuff that just isn’t ‘hooked’ into search engines, with Dark web being the stuff that’s actively hidden through use of TOR etc...Edited by FiF on Tuesday 20th February 20:05
tankplanker said:
Never you mind said:
to be truly anonymous on the net it's best to use some kind of Anonymous Unix based OS. These are loaded off a USB rather than on your hard drive as it's easier, should the fuzz be closing in, to get rid of a usb stick rather than your laptop. I had a play a while ago with these things and it's encrypted up to stupid levels and passwords have to be at least 32 characters long. There is zero to no chance of anyone getting info out it.
There has also been cases where the people that run TOR routers/bridges have been forced, probably to save themselves from prosecution, to hand over all the information they have i.e. logs to enforcement agencies. I imagine this is how most people get caught.
I wouldn't use a USB unless you are confident that it can be hardware set to read only (something like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kanguru-Flash-Physical-Pr... as you risk something being cached otherwise. In the UK they can and will detain you indefinitely if you won't hand over the decryption key/password for a USB drive/PC so it is vital you don't store anything. Personally I'd go for one of the variants that'll boot of a CD in a laptop without a writable CD drive and no internal storage, that way nothing can be written. Stuff can still be retrieved from the RAM if they are quick enough and prepared to mess about cooling the RAM and you are high enough profile to warrant that.There has also been cases where the people that run TOR routers/bridges have been forced, probably to save themselves from prosecution, to hand over all the information they have i.e. logs to enforcement agencies. I imagine this is how most people get caught.
Disk level encryption is only protection when the disk isn't mounted. Once it is mounted (and thus encrypted) anything or anybody with interactive access to the device (local or remote) can read anything even on a boot CD. Good hygiene around where and what you do still needs to be practiced as a remote attack is most likely, face to face from enforcement you have very little options other than destruction.
I use Qubes on my personal laptop, doesn't protect from being forced to decrypt it but every application, every web page, is all loaded in a separate, isolated, temporary (if I choose) container. Tor and VPN is built in, although I prefer running VPN on the router as it means everything I choose goes through the VPN on any device (including mobiles), and I'm only managing one connection not multiple installs.
Compromising nodes or market places is easy once they locate them, and thanks to the Ozzies they can run them as a honeypot for as long as they want. Once it is compromised additional logging, usually via a hacked version of the routing software will be implemented. They will try to create a digital fingerprint to track you back to your real identity.
Anybody using google and expecting anonymity is an idiot, check out: https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity for just some of the crap they log about you, Facebook is worse. This can be requested by UK.Gov any time they want without you knowing.
General Price said:
Is that the one where Yipper is the head moderator?Something which puzzles me with this scumbag who was in the news yesterday... I understand him using the Dark Web to share all the scummy things he blackmailed people into doing, but presumably he didn't meet or communicate with his victims on the Dark Web, so why wouldn't he be caught doing that sort of stuff in the open? And if there's a good reason for him not to be caught on the normal web, why use the Dark one in the first place?
LaurasOtherHalf said:
If you want an enjoyable introduction to the dark web (and obviously without ever going anywhere near it) and enjoy podcasts/spoken word/audiobooks etc...
http://casefilepodcast.com/case-76-silk-road-part-...
Casefile podcast is available on the above link or iTunes or anywhere else you like to listen to online content. It's a true crime podcast but this weeks (and last and next-it's a three part'r) is all about the Silk Road.
Basically, Silk Road was one of the biggest things on the dark web and made it known to a lot of people, many due to being reported on by Gawker as it sought to make buying and selling illegal drugs easy on the 'net. All the while using some crypto-currency called bitcoin.
http://gawker.com/the-underground-website-where-yo...
Give it a listen, it's incredibly interesting.
Just started part 2, great listening http://casefilepodcast.com/case-76-silk-road-part-...
Casefile podcast is available on the above link or iTunes or anywhere else you like to listen to online content. It's a true crime podcast but this weeks (and last and next-it's a three part'r) is all about the Silk Road.
Basically, Silk Road was one of the biggest things on the dark web and made it known to a lot of people, many due to being reported on by Gawker as it sought to make buying and selling illegal drugs easy on the 'net. All the while using some crypto-currency called bitcoin.
http://gawker.com/the-underground-website-where-yo...
Give it a listen, it's incredibly interesting.
Ari said:
Do you just Google it?
It is literally a subsection of the opposite. It's part of the 'deep web', which is anything that is connected but not indexed by search engines, and requires nonstandard software, configuration or authorisation to access.It's a broad term. I expect Amber Rudd to be throwing it around shortly going "think of the kids".
The TOR network is one example of the dark net, incidentally it's blocked by the great firewall of China.
Edited by wst on Tuesday 20th February 21:04
Ayahuasca said:
Does not your VPN provider know what you are doing?
With my VPN I cannot even access Netflix or the BBC iPlayer from aboard, never mind the Dark Web, because Netflix or the BBC spots it!
Your VPN provider knows what you are doing, but decent ones are unlikely to keep logs (and are not compelled to keep logs because they are outside the EU), and you pick an endpoint in the country of your choice. My default endpoint is in Moscow, which is unlikely to be helpful in respect of any requests for data.With my VPN I cannot even access Netflix or the BBC iPlayer from aboard, never mind the Dark Web, because Netflix or the BBC spots it!
Again, it goes back to the level of anonymity you need.
No anonymity - post your life on Facebook.
Step 1 - don't post your life on Facebook, but don't use any security. Your ISP knows what you are doing and that is easily accessible.
Step 2 - use a VPN. Your ISP has no idea what you are doing, your VPN provider does. It is hard to get data from the VPN provider, but it is possible.
Step 3 - use a VPN and Tor. You ISP doesn't know what you are doing, nor does the VPN provider, nor do the first 3 nodes of the Tor network. Bloody hard to track you, you've got to slip up in the real word in order to be caught.
The problem is that Step 3 is good for oppressed whistleblowers, and it is also good for kiddie fiddlers swapping images. Getting digital data to and from a dark web site is very difficult to track. You're more likely to be caught by leaving the EXIF data in the images.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff