Tommy Robinson attacked at McDonald’s
Discussion
del mar said:
Come on you aren’t buying all the peace and love nonsense are you ?
This misappropriation is written in the book, and Muslims appear to have been misappropriating it since it was written.
Even alpine and countdown have accepted that some chapters are less than savoury and are no longer acceptable in today’s world.
Pretty much the same for every religion and every religious text. What those who side with TR etc refuse to accept is that the majority of Muslims want no part in the atrocities for which they are being blamed. It would be like TR being blamed for the sex crimes against children commuted by his fellow EDL cohorts. This misappropriation is written in the book, and Muslims appear to have been misappropriating it since it was written.
Even alpine and countdown have accepted that some chapters are less than savoury and are no longer acceptable in today’s world.
e30m3Mark said:
del mar said:
Come on you aren’t buying all the peace and love nonsense are you ?
This misappropriation is written in the book, and Muslims appear to have been misappropriating it since it was written.
Even alpine and countdown have accepted that some chapters are less than savoury and are no longer acceptable in today’s world.
Pretty much the same for every religion and every religious text. What those who side with TR etc refuse to accept is that the majority of Muslims want no part in the atrocities for which they are being blamed. It would be like TR being blamed for the sex crimes against children commuted by his fellow EDL cohorts. This misappropriation is written in the book, and Muslims appear to have been misappropriating it since it was written.
Even alpine and countdown have accepted that some chapters are less than savoury and are no longer acceptable in today’s world.
All religions have outdated sections, but only one seems to be in the news every week.
I Agree, but it is the constant refusal by Muslims to accept that what is being carried out has its basis in their religious texts, that gives reason to people like tr.
The idea that Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with Islam is incorrect.
Only if the edl constitution made reference to sex crimes and or it could be construed to support it.
Edited by del mar on Thursday 18th October 14:00
del mar said:
All religions have outdated sections, but only one seems to be in the news every week.
When it comes to f
king kids the christians love bit of that - you must have missed that in the newspapers you read.There are many more interesting, challenging and engaging critics of Islam and the actions of muslims in this country than Tommy Robinson.
del mar said:
When there are Hindu and Sikh terrorism in the UK and Sikh grooming gangs then people willl be happy to take issue with their religious texts.
All religions have outdated sections, but only one seems to be in the news every week.
I Agree, but it is the constant refusal by Muslims to accept that what is being carried out has its basis in their religious texts, that gives reason to people like tr.
The idea that Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with Islam is incorrect.
Only if the edl constitution made reference to sex crimes and or it could be construed to support it.
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.All religions have outdated sections, but only one seems to be in the news every week.
I Agree, but it is the constant refusal by Muslims to accept that what is being carried out has its basis in their religious texts, that gives reason to people like tr.
The idea that Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with Islam is incorrect.
Only if the edl constitution made reference to sex crimes and or it could be construed to support it.
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 18th October 14:00
Have you ?
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 18th October 14:49
JuanCarlosFandango said:
I don't find the "what about other forms of child abuse" argument very convincing. Clearly Robinson believes there is a problem with Islam and Muslim integration of which grooming gangs are a part. Is that not a legitimate view to hold or case to argue?
And by the same token I wonder are those antifa thugs as concerned about antisemitism is the Labour party?
People tend to pick their causes and find sub-causes to support them.
It’s a legitimate concern. But to focus on only one demographic is disingenuous about the crime. And by the same token I wonder are those antifa thugs as concerned about antisemitism is the Labour party?
People tend to pick their causes and find sub-causes to support them.
If he were bringing it to the attention of the authorities, I might have more sympathy. But he has a clear agenda against a demographic. Not against child rape.
I assume TR was at court for this and will be publicising it.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45900116
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45900116
Brooking10 said:
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
Of course you have never knowingly met one because it is not as if they would tell you. Google Taqiyya and Kitman if you are not aware of the terms.Have you ?
Edited by Brooking10 on Thursday 18th October 14:49
JuanCarlosFandango said:
I don't find the "what about other forms of child abuse" argument very convincing. Clearly Robinson believes there is a problem with Islam and Muslim integration of which grooming gangs are a part. Is that not a legitimate view to hold or case to argue?
I don’t think it is because the “problem with Islam and Muslim integration” and “grooming gangs” are two separate, unrelated issues. They’ve been conflated deliberately by the likes of TR and his ilk to suggest some kind of cause/effect correlation.You only need to look at the basics of “Islam” and it’s views in relation to alcohol, drugs, and sex outside of marriage. These are all things which are considered massively taboo in Islam and yet they were all present in the abuse. Surely anybody with a rational mind would ask “How can this be related to islam and it involves so many factors that are prohibited by islam?
It’s the same as suggesting that Roman catholic priests abused Choirboys because of Roman Catholicism, or that Scoutmasters abused scouts because of Baden Powell. It’s nonsensical and doesn’t stand up to any critical thinking.
With regards to “integration” the people that carried out the abuse were arguably well integrated given that they mixed with the indigenous people pretty much all the time and had no problem with alcohol.
colin_p said:
Brooking10 said:
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
Of course you have never knowingly met one because it is not as if they would tell you. Google Taqiyya and Kitman if you are not aware of the terms.Have you ?
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 18th October 14:49
Brooking10 said:
colin_p said:
Brooking10 said:
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
Of course you have never knowingly met one because it is not as if they would tell you. Google Taqiyya and Kitman if you are not aware of the terms.Have you ?
Edited by Brooking10 on Thursday 18th October 14:49
Nobody, except happy-clapping types, ever mention "all" or "100%" of muslims because that would be stupid.
Did you go away and do a bit of research on those terms? Or do you already know them 100%?
colin_p said:
Wrong.
Nobody, except happy-clapping types, ever mention "all" or "100%" of muslims because that would be stupid.
Did you go away and do a bit of research on those terms? Or do you already know them 100%?
I know what they mean.Nobody, except happy-clapping types, ever mention "all" or "100%" of muslims because that would be stupid.
Did you go away and do a bit of research on those terms? Or do you already know them 100%?
What percentage of Muslims do you believe are falsely denying their core beliefs when it comes to condemning atrocities perpetuated in the name of their religion ?
Brooking10 said:
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
100% of the Muslims I know deny that there is any basis in their scriptures for Islamic terrorism etc.Have you ?
Edited by Brooking10 on Thursday 18th October 14:49
And yet 100% of the adults in my house believe that there is a link.
Edited by del mar on Thursday 18th October 18:26
colin_p said:
Brooking10 said:
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
Of course you have never knowingly met one because it is not as if they would tell you. Google Taqiyya and Kitman if you are not aware of the terms.Have you ?
Edited by Brooking10 on Thursday 18th October 14:49
del mar said:
100% of the Muslims I know deny that there is any basis in their scriptures for Islamic terrorism etc.
And yet 100% of the adults in my house believe that there is a link.
How many Muslims do you and the adults know, and how many of them are terrorists?And yet 100% of the adults in my house believe that there is a link.
Edited by del mar on Thursday 18th October 18:26
[quote=Brooking10]
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
You must be visiting the wrong mosque!
Why then have various well-known mosques invited hate preachers from such places as The Middle East & Asia to lecture the locals- 'sheep that is' only later to be banned and kicked out of the UK.
Finsbury Park & the East London Mosques come to mind.
I have not yet met a single Muslim who agrees with what is perpetrated, in terms of what is being discussed here, in their religion’s name as being anything as vile.
Have you ?
You must be visiting the wrong mosque!
Why then have various well-known mosques invited hate preachers from such places as The Middle East & Asia to lecture the locals- 'sheep that is' only later to be banned and kicked out of the UK.
Finsbury Park & the East London Mosques come to mind.
Brooking10 said:
What percentage of Muslims do you believe are falsely denying their core beliefs when it comes to condemning atrocities perpetuated in the name of their religion ?
A bit of lazy searching brought this Guardian (so it is therefore must be beyond doubt and question) article up,https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/11/br...
In that it mentions
4% sympathise with islamic terrorism (pro-rated 4% of 5m = 0.2m)
and
23% want sharia law (pro-rated 23% of 5m = 1.15m)
So I'd say the answer is quite simply 23% less 4% plus an allowance for those who are telling fibs (which is religiously mandated or they simply didn't want to disclose their views to the interviewers) which is unquantifiable, but lets say 10%, giving a guestimated total of 29%. I'd actually give a range between 25% and 35%. (1.25m to 1.75m of the 5m total).
Alpinestars said:
How do you distinguish the “good” guys from the “bad” ones in your world?
You can't.Alpinestars
It may be disingenuous about the crime but what if it is right about the demographic?
If Muslims are disproportionately involved in grooming gangs, and terrorism, and other criminality then is it not reasonable to flag up Muslim integration as a problem in its own right?
Countdown
Are they entirely unrelated?
It seems pretty well documented that there were gangs of almost entirely Muslim men abusing children in quite a systematic way. Just from looking at the Wikipedia page about the Rotherham trials.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_se...
Is that purely coincidence? Or perhaps only relates to certain demographics from Pakistan who just happen to be culturally Muslim?
I like to think I have a rational mind and yes, I do ask how it can be related to a religion which as you rightly point out appears to be defined by a sort of puritanical fear of sex, drugs and alcohol. So far it seems that it is unacceptable to even ask that question, meaning Tommy Robinson has the monopoly on answering.
Regarding Catholics, it seems fairly well established that there have been some serious failings in the Catholic church at an institutional level. I don't think anyone has been called racist for raising this. And besides our glorious imperial history of oppressing brown folks we have a bit of form with Catholics too, especially the Irish.
As a Christian I don't see anything in the scripture or tradition, and I don't claim to be an expert, which makes this behaviour acceptable. Rather I suspect it's a failure of institutions.
Perhaps there are certain institutions or traditons within Islam or within the Pakistani community which makes this sort of thing more likely?
The idea that getting drunk and raping underage girls is a mark of integration into British culture is certainly an interesting take on British culture. One which many might find pretty offensive. Myself included.
It may be disingenuous about the crime but what if it is right about the demographic?
If Muslims are disproportionately involved in grooming gangs, and terrorism, and other criminality then is it not reasonable to flag up Muslim integration as a problem in its own right?
Countdown
Are they entirely unrelated?
It seems pretty well documented that there were gangs of almost entirely Muslim men abusing children in quite a systematic way. Just from looking at the Wikipedia page about the Rotherham trials.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_se...
Is that purely coincidence? Or perhaps only relates to certain demographics from Pakistan who just happen to be culturally Muslim?
I like to think I have a rational mind and yes, I do ask how it can be related to a religion which as you rightly point out appears to be defined by a sort of puritanical fear of sex, drugs and alcohol. So far it seems that it is unacceptable to even ask that question, meaning Tommy Robinson has the monopoly on answering.
Regarding Catholics, it seems fairly well established that there have been some serious failings in the Catholic church at an institutional level. I don't think anyone has been called racist for raising this. And besides our glorious imperial history of oppressing brown folks we have a bit of form with Catholics too, especially the Irish.
As a Christian I don't see anything in the scripture or tradition, and I don't claim to be an expert, which makes this behaviour acceptable. Rather I suspect it's a failure of institutions.
Perhaps there are certain institutions or traditons within Islam or within the Pakistani community which makes this sort of thing more likely?
The idea that getting drunk and raping underage girls is a mark of integration into British culture is certainly an interesting take on British culture. One which many might find pretty offensive. Myself included.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
Regarding Catholics, it seems fairly well established that there have been some serious failings in the Catholic church at an institutional level. I don't think anyone has been called racist for raising this. And besides our glorious imperial history of oppressing brown folks we have a bit of form with Catholics too, especially the Irish.
As a Christian I don't see anything in the scripture or tradition, and I don't claim to be an expert, which makes this behaviour acceptable. Rather I suspect it's a failure of institutions.
Perhaps there are certain institutions or traditons within Islam or within the Pakistani community which makes this sort of thing more likely?
The idea that getting drunk and raping underage girls is a mark of integration into British culture is certainly an interesting take on British culture. One which many might find pretty offensive. Myself included.
There is an argurment that covering up the sexual abuse of minors is a cultural trait of the British. The Muslim gangs didn't get any special treatment, they got treated the same as all the other nonces. As a society we have been brushing this under the carpet for years.As a Christian I don't see anything in the scripture or tradition, and I don't claim to be an expert, which makes this behaviour acceptable. Rather I suspect it's a failure of institutions.
Perhaps there are certain institutions or traditons within Islam or within the Pakistani community which makes this sort of thing more likely?
The idea that getting drunk and raping underage girls is a mark of integration into British culture is certainly an interesting take on British culture. One which many might find pretty offensive. Myself included.
The reason Christians got mentioned again was not to deflect it was in response to Del Mar's assertion that it was only one religion that was in the news. When it comes to news about f
king kids that's just arrant nonsense.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff