Tommy Robinson attacked at McDonald’s

[Dindoit]

NoNeed said:

We bot know he is no l9nger a member and his intentions when founding the groups may very well have been good

No

But to humour you let’s pretend for a moment that his intentions are good. Why is it do you think that literally everything he gets involved with attracts the support of violent racist thugs?

Is it him? Is it the way he does things? Is it the causes he chooses? Why do people with swastika tattoos align with the character Tommy Robinson?

[liam1986]

Countdown said:

Are you suggesting that a former BNP member founding a group which is a basically coalition of football hooligan gangs could have motives which weren't good? Tut, never have I seen such blatant cynicism on NP&E.

In response NoNeed's suggestion that Tommy left the EDL because he didn't want to associate with extreme right wing groups......Tommy used to be in the BNP, he was/is a leading light in both the EDL and PEGIDA UK. Anybody thinking Tommy doesn't like the far right is naive at best.

Please watch his Oxford union speach. It will enlighten you.

[chrispmartha]

liam1986 said:

Countdown said:

Are you suggesting that a former BNP member founding a group which is a basically coalition of football hooligan gangs could have motives which weren't good? Tut, never have I seen such blatant cynicism on NP&E.

In response NoNeed's suggestion that Tommy left the EDL because he didn't want to associate with extreme right wing groups......Tommy used to be in the BNP, he was/is a leading light in both the EDL and PEGIDA UK. Anybody thinking Tommy doesn't like the far right is naive at best.

Please watch his Oxford union speach. It will enlighten you.

I've seen it, it didn't.

[graylag]

NoNeed said:

o he didn't start the EDL to combat extremism and child grooming?


Did he leave these groups because they had attracted extreme right wing groups that he did not want to associate with?

We bot know he is no l9nger a member and his intentions when founding the groups may very well have been good

I know others have ripped this apart, but just how naive are you?

The EDL is formed of ex BNP members and football hooligans. There was one issue that they focussed on and that’s Islam, not extreme, just the religion as a whole and anyone who follows that faith.

There was no paedophile agenda. That’s come later and even then he never ever shows any interest in court cases involving white paedos.

[e30m3Mark]

ReverendCounter said:

e30m3Mark said:

Didn't he sucker punch an immigrant in Italy earlier this year after accusing him of touching his camera?

No, but if you don't listen to the death threats from the immigrant and ignore the lunging body language, and pretend he only wanted a chat rather than the multiple attempts to grab the camera equipment, then yes.

You can watch the unedited original video on youtube yourself - you might even find it on a pro immigrant channel listed something like 'TR sucker punches an immigrant in Italy'. That'd save you from increasing TRs viewing count and you wouldn't have to ask stupid questions.

I watched TR's version of events (1 more view isn't going to make much difference when his followers lap up every word he says) and it definitely sounds as if someone touched the camera. Obviously we don't know whether that was a deliberate attempt to damage it, push it away from being pointed in the guys face or somewhere in between? I assume it wasn't switched on though, by the lack of footage? As for 'lunging body language' though, it was TR (and his pals) who were first to put their hands on the guy and repeatedly shove him back. Bottom line is TR went there looking for confrontation.

Edited by e30m3Mark on Thursday 15th November 10:22

[e30m3Mark]

graylag said:

NoNeed said:

o he didn't start the EDL to combat extremism and child grooming?


Did he leave these groups because they had attracted extreme right wing groups that he did not want to associate with?

We bot know he is no l9nger a member and his intentions when founding the groups may very well have been good

I know others have ripped this apart, but just how naive are you?

The EDL is formed of ex BNP members and football hooligans. There was one issue that they focussed on and that’s Islam, not extreme, just the religion as a whole and anyone who follows that faith.

There was no paedophile agenda. That’s come later and even then he never ever shows any interest in court cases involving white paedos.

Or any interest in their own members committing offences against children.

[Alpinestars]

e30m3Mark said:

Or any interest in their own members committing offences against children.

That’s unfair. He had an interest, he was supportive.

[Countdown]

liam1986 said:

Countdown said:

Are you suggesting that a former BNP member founding a group which is a basically coalition of football hooligan gangs could have motives which weren't good? Tut, never have I seen such blatant cynicism on NP&E.

In response NoNeed's suggestion that Tommy left the EDL because he didn't want to associate with extreme right wing groups......Tommy used to be in the BNP, he was/is a leading light in both the EDL and PEGIDA UK. Anybody thinking Tommy doesn't like the far right is naive at best.

Please watch his Oxford union speach. It will enlighten you.

I have - it didn't. What it does confirm is that TR is a smart cookie who can tailor his message for his audience in order to generate the maximum benefit for himself personally.

In very simple terms he's monetised the anti-muslim hatred that he enjoyed creating (be it as part of the BNP, the EDL, or PEGIDA UK). He's realised that there are a LOT of people who are prepared to provide financial support for his hate speeches (Rebel Media, the MEF). What he needs to do is to keep his footsoldiers marching and chanting through areas with a high muslim population, keep pretending to manstream people that his anti-muslim message is somehow justified ("not ALL muslims blah blah blah") and basically just keep the hatred pot bubbling while he creams off as much as he can financially.

On the one hand is behaviour is quite vile and despicable. On the other hand if he wants to milk his gullible supporters for every penny he can then he can crack on. At some point he will go the same way as John Tyndall, Nick Griffin and all the others.

[Digga]

People seem to get very confused when evaluating the merits of political or media figures. They have a very binary view; if they are right about something important, they 'must' be right in general.

TR did highlight some issues with the CSA gangs, but that hardly makes him a pillar of truth and reason. Him being right about that is barely more relevant to the overall picture than admitting the Nazis built some damned good autobahns.

I can remember coming face to face with an EDL 'march' - a rabble wearing face masks (ironic, given their stand on religious face-covering) - and not exactly knowing a lot about them, other than the act I knew I didn't like them. I was in town with my wife, on the way into one of my parent's favourite, local curry houses, founded in the 1970's by a Muslim immigrant. I felt bad that they might have been intimidated. Anyone that rouses a rabble like that is dangerous, no matter the reason it is done.

[Countdown]

Digga

I mentioned this earlier - it's not the fact that TR is right about "one thing". Nobody disagrees with his purported views about grooming gangs. However TR doesn't care about grooming gangs or their victims, he's simply using that as a way of trying to legitimise his hatred towards muslims. It wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a football hooligan, it wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a member of the BNP, or lead to him being a founding member of the EDL. There's a long list of indicators showing that he was a racist tt long before grooming gangs became an issue. That hasn't suddenly stopped - the main thing that's changed is that he's realised he can make a lot of money off it as well.

The grooming gangs are just a figleaf so that ordinary decent people will flock around his "banner" and give his vile racism a veneer to hide behind. If anything he does more damage than benefit to the fight against grooming gangs because people suspect or realise that he's just using them as an excuse.

[Digga]

Countdown said:

Digga

I mentioned this earlier - it's not the fact that TR is right about "one thing". Nobody disagrees with his purported views about grooming gangs. However TR doesn't care about grooming gangs or their victims, he's simply using that as a way of trying to legitimise his hatred towards muslims. It wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a football hooligan, it wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a member of the BNP, or lead to him being a founding member of the EDL. There's a long list of indicators showing that he was a racist tt long before grooming gangs became an issue. That hasn't suddenly stopped - the main thing that's changed is that he's realised he can make a lot of money off it as well.

The grooming gangs are just a figleaf so that ordinary decent people will flock around his "banner" and give his vile racism a veneer to hide behind. If anything he does more damage than benefit to the fight against grooming gangs because people suspect or realise that he's just using them as an excuse.

I do agree - my point was that people 'latch' on to characters like this because they are 'right' about one particular topic (which they too feel strongly about).

In TR's case, this was aided by the (since changed) media embargo on frank discussion of the subject.

To be clear, he was a stopped clock - right once.

[The Dangerous Elk]

Countdown said:

Digga

I mentioned this earlier - it's not the fact that TR is right about "one thing". Nobody disagrees with his purported views about grooming gangs. However TR doesn't care about grooming gangs or their victims, he's simply using that as a way of trying to legitimise his hatred towards muslims. It wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a football hooligan, it wasn't muslim grooming gangs that made him a member of the BNP, or lead to him being a founding member of the EDL. There's a long list of indicators showing that he was a racist tt long before grooming gangs became an issue. That hasn't suddenly stopped - the main thing that's changed is that he's realised he can make a lot of money off it as well.

The grooming gangs are just a figleaf so that ordinary decent people will flock around his "banner" and give his vile racism a veneer to hide behind. If anything he does more damage than benefit to the fight against grooming gangs because people suspect or realise that he's just using them as an excuse.

So.....\(because you agree with him on a couple of points) you must be a racist fascist thug who fully supports TR, the rest of your stuff is just a cover to pretend you don't like him.

[Countdown]

The Dangerous Elk said:

So.....\(because you agree with him on a couple of points) and pretend not to realise what a he is, and keep repeatedly acting as an apologist for him, then you must be a racist fascist thug who fully supports TR, the rest of your stuff is just a cover to pretend you don't like him.

FTFY

Remind you of anybody?

[The Dangerous Elk]

Countdown said:

FTFY

Remind you of anybody?

No. I know not one person who is an apologist for any of TR's wide ranging objectionable thoughts.

[NoNeed]

Countdown said:

FN2TypeR said:

NoNeed said:

o he didn't start the EDL to combat extremism and child grooming?


Did he leave these groups because they had attracted extreme right wing groups that he did not want to associate with?

We bot know he is no l9nger a member and his intentions when founding the groups may very well have been good

fk me sideways

Are you suggesting that a former BNP member founding a group which is a basically coalition of football hooligan gangs could have motives which weren't good? Tut, never have I seen such blatant cynicism on NP&E.

In response NoNeed's suggestion that Tommy left the EDL because he didn't want to associate with extreme right wing groups......Tommy used to be in the BNP, he was/is a leading light in both the EDL and PEGIDA UK. Anybody thinking Tommy doesn't like the far right is naive at best.

Didn't he say he was young and stupid when joining the BNP one of his biggest regrets.

[graylag]

The Dangerous Elk said:

No. I know not one person who is an apologist for any of TR's wide ranging objectionable thoughts.

Here’s one, although you’ll probably claim not to know him personally, so it doesn’t count.

liam1986 said:

Please watch his Oxford union speach. It will enlighten you.

[Countdown]

NoNeed said:

Didn't he say he was young and stupid when joining the BNP one of his biggest regrets.

Call me cynical, his actions since then (including the setting up of organisations that are twisted mirrors of the BNP) make me think he may have been less than completely genuine.

TR is smart. he is monetising his racism. That means he will tailor his message for his audience.

[anonymous-user]

The Dangerous Elk said:

Countdown said:

FTFY

Remind you of anybody?

No. I know not one person who is an apologist for any of TR's wide ranging objectionable thoughts.

Ah, those objectionable thoughts that you're incapable of defining. Understood.

You're an apologist for SYL. Pretending that you think he has "abhorrent views" or "objectionable thoughts" isn't a very good disguise.

[graylag]

NoNeed said:

Didn't he say he was young and stupid when joining the BNP one of his biggest regrets.

That could only be because they weren’t racist enough for him. Forming the EDL and Pegida UK was probably more down his street.

[The Dangerous Elk]

Roman Rhodes said:

Ah, those objectionable thoughts that you're incapable of defining. Understood.

You're an apologist for SYL. Pretending that you think he has "abhorrent views" or "objectionable thoughts" isn't a very good disguise.

Quote me making such a statement in defence of any of his "abhorrent views" or "objectionable thoughts" or be seen as a liar and a troll.