How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 3)
Discussion
I cannot even begin to understand how twisted a view you have to hold before you can conclude that the UK is ‘appeasing’ the EU. The UK’s position has been borderline insane throughout and has, at times, also been insulting and pointlessly antagonising. It could not have been handled any worse.
ORD said:
I cannot even begin to understand how twisted a view you have to hold before you can conclude that the UK is ‘appeasing’ the EU. The UK’s position has been borderline insane throughout and has, at times, also been insulting and pointlessly antagonising. It could not have been handled any worse.
Other opinions are available.ORD said:
I cannot even begin to understand how twisted a view you have to hold before you can conclude that the UK is ‘appeasing’ the EU. The UK’s position has been borderline insane throughout and has, at times, also been insulting and pointlessly antagonising. It could not have been handled any worse.
I think of it more as incompetence more than anything overt/deliberate. The UK position has been incoherent incompetence. Negotiations can't actually happen when one side is like that.
Mrr T said:
Last response because you are not listening. The EU refers to the Korea agreement as a FTA because it covers everything. The EU also has 30 other FTA which they refer to as trade agreements. They cover many but not all products.
Australia refer to 10 FTA but are they FTA or just Trade Agreements?
So in a few pages we have gone from "the EU have amazing negotiators look at all their FTAs" to "it is really difficult to negotiate FTAs but look at all the association agreements we have" Australia refer to 10 FTA but are they FTA or just Trade Agreements?
On a side note this came to my attention which rather flies in the face of Remainers that say services have no place in FTAs....
http://dfat.gov.au/trade/agreements/negotiations/t...
DeejRC said:
Until everyone round the table stops being utter plonkers and talks from a position of reality bugger all will actually get done. HMG needs to stop being an incoherent shower of donkey poop and the EU need to stop trying to demand the moon on a stick.
The EU clearly laid out their position right at the very start, and have barely changed it since. It's us that have all the daft ideas of what we want the post-Brexit relationship to look like.The EU aren't asking for the moon on the stick.
They are merely ensuring that whatever position he UK ends up in, it is no better than what we have now.
The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
Lord Marylebone said:
The EU clearly laid out their position right at the very start, and have barely changed it since. It's us that have all the daft ideas of what we want the post-Brexit relationship to look like.
The EU aren't asking for the moon on the stick.
They are merely ensuring that whatever position he UK ends up in, it is no better than what we have now.
The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
It would also be 'stupid' for the EU to propose a deal that makes their members much worse off than the current situation, purely to protect their (political) project.The EU aren't asking for the moon on the stick.
They are merely ensuring that whatever position he UK ends up in, it is no better than what we have now.
The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
Lord Marylebone said:
DeejRC said:
Until everyone round the table stops being utter plonkers and talks from a position of reality bugger all will actually get done. HMG needs to stop being an incoherent shower of donkey poop and the EU need to stop trying to demand the moon on a stick.
The EU clearly laid out their position right at the very start, and have barely changed it since. It's us that have all the daft ideas of what we want the post-Brexit relationship to look like.The EU aren't asking for the moon on the stick.
They are merely ensuring that whatever position he UK ends up in, it is no better than what we have now.
The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
Please, leave the rhetoric aside - what "benefits of EU membership" have we asked for?
Lord Marylebone said:
They are merely ensuring that whatever position he UK ends up in, it is no better than what we have now.
The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
It would certainly do nothing to discourage other unhappy campers and can be seen as unhelpful to Das Projekt regardless of what happens to real people in nation states. Status quo for the EU.The EU will obviously never agree to a deal that magically leaves us with benefits of EU membership, plus the alleged benefits of being out of the EU.
That would be stupid.
However it's a short-term issue. Longer-term the EU will be unable to exert the malign influence you refer to (making our position worse than it could be, as you point out) and the UK will certainly prosper just as it has after previous short-term malignancy. In this case we're excising the problem.
Lord Marylebone said:
The EU aren't asking for the moon on the stick.
More like having cake and eating it.Lord Marylebone also said:
The EU clearly laid out their position right at the very start, and have barely changed it since. It's us that have all the daft ideas of what we want the post-Brexit relationship to look like.
They have, as you also point out accurately above, taken negotiation to involve the EU adopting a position at the outset, while expecting the UK to move to it. Which as you will know isn't negotiation but reasonably close to dictatorial behaviour.Ghibli said:
sidicks said:
It would also be 'stupid' for the EU to propose a deal that makes their members much worse off than the current situation, purely to protect their (political) project.
How would it work if the UK were to do what you are describing?Jockman said:
Ghibli said:
sidicks said:
It would also be 'stupid' for the EU to propose a deal that makes their members much worse off than the current situation, purely to protect their (political) project.
How would it work if the UK were to do what you are describing?
Jimboka said:
That’ll show them, the least well off in the UK will suffer most.
You can bet that establishment figures like Farage/Boris won’t be the ones who pay the price!
What gives you that ridiculous notion ?? the most likely victims would be the pen pushing middle classes in pointless red tape generating jobs .... You can bet that establishment figures like Farage/Boris won’t be the ones who pay the price!
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