Multiculturalsim

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

No most migrant groups are, it is only white people who are under represented.

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

[del mar]

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

(ex)Services.

[Alpinestars]

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

In your blind spot.

[s1962a]

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

No most migrant groups are, it is only white people who are under represented.

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

statistics said:

Foreign nationals from Europe accounted for the greatest proportion of all foreign nationals within the prison population (51%), those from
Africa (19%) and Asia (16%) contributed the second and third largest proportion respectively.
At the end of 2016, foreign nationals originating from the EU (excluding the UK) accounted for 43% of all foreign nationals in prison and just under 5% of the total prison population. Men accounted for 96% of all FNPs within the prison population

http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/docum...

[del mar]

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

(ex)Services.

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

[Alpinestars]

del mar said:

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

Whilst I don't know the answer and wouldn't defend anyone in prison, do you think this has anything to do with people declaring religion rather than following it? In some ways, one could argue that anyone who is religious shouldn't be in prison, or certainly not in relation to most crimes. Therefore is the religion stat a swallow tattoo?

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

(ex)Services.

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

I thought it pertinent to the issue of 'contributions'. Most people would acknowledge the contributions that services personell make and yet, per head, they are much more likely to commit crime/go to prison than the average citizen.

Should we conflate these facts or treat them as entirely unconnected?

[NickCQ]

bhstewie said:

grumbledoak said:

That is exactly what multiculturalism is - immigrant groups living separate lives, keeping all aspects of their prior lives unchanged. You are, seemingly without irony, attempting to redefine the spin word for ghettos.

I think if you go and ask 10 random people if that's "multiculturalism" the majority would disagree.
What you've just described isn't multiculturalism.

I understood 'multiculturalism' to mean the idea that we shouldn't make people from diverse places to discard all of their own cultural heritage when they come to the UK. Rather we should accept that people may want to live differently based on what they are familiar with. So 'multiculturalism' means the acceptance of multiple parallel cultures in a society, and members of the dominant cultural/racial group should be tolerant and non-discriminatory.

Naturally, from this springs a two-way process of integration, particularly in the second and third generations. Hence chicken tikka masala, tea, the word bungalow etc etc etc.

[ape x]

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

(ex)Services.

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

It still doesn't mean that there are not a big percentage of Pakistani Muslims who are not in Prison....

Because they are 'over represented' what does that even mean for the rest of them getting on with a normal life not to mention the ones who save lives like the Doctors...

[del mar]

Alpinestars said:

del mar said:

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

Whilst I don't know the answer and wouldn't defend anyone in prison, do you think this has anything to do with people declaring religion rather than following it? In some ways, one could argue that anyone who is religious shouldn't be in prison, or certainly not in relation to most crimes. Therefore is the religion stat a swallow tattoo?

Prison Guard / Judge
"What Religion are you ?"

"No idea"

"We'll just put down Muslim then ?"

"Sure".

Whilst this could happen, I would suggest it is unlikely.

This logic wouldn't work for the over represented Black population though, it is difficult to get somebody's colour wrong. Although in this day and age you are free to identify as you see fit.

Edited by del mar on Monday 23 April 16:14

[Alpinestars]

del mar said:

Alpinestars said:

del mar said:

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

Whilst I don't know the answer and wouldn't defend anyone in prison, do you think this has anything to do with people declaring religion rather than following it? In some ways, one could argue that anyone who is religious shouldn't be in prison, or certainly not in relation to most crimes. Therefore is the religion stat a swallow tattoo?

Prison Guard / Judge
"What Religion are you ?"

"No idea"

"We'll just put down Muslim then ?"

"Sure".

Whilst this could happen, I would suggest it is unlikely.

This logic wouldn't work for the over represented Black population though, it is difficult to get somebody's colour wrong. Although in this day and age you are free to identify as you see fit.

Edited by del mar on Monday 23 April 16:14

What's being black got to do with anything?

[del mar]

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

Not strictly true. There's another group who are generally over-represented.

??

(ex)Services.

You could probably say people with swallow tattoos, but that is breaking things down a minuscule levels to try and prove a point.

Ethnicity - all groups bar "white" are over represented.

Religion - only muslims are significantly over represented, other religions are over represented but the amounts are miniscule.
Christian and No religion are under represented.

I thought it pertinent to the issue of 'contributions'. Most people would acknowledge the contributions that services personell make and yet, per head, they are much more likely to commit crime/go to prison than the average citizen.

Should we conflate these facts or treat them as entirely unconnected?

Quick look a white person committing a crime......

On a thread about Multiculturalism and the benefits or lack of, I am not sure what Service men and women have to do with it.

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

Quick look a white person committing a crime......

On a thread about Multiculturalism and the benefits or lack of, I am not sure what Service men and women have to do with it.

if you're going to introduce prison population stats as a way of demonstrating that multiculturalism 'doesn't work', I'll offer up another stat that suggests military service 'doesn't work'.

[del mar]

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

Quick look a white person committing a crime......

On a thread about Multiculturalism and the benefits or lack of, I am not sure what Service men and women have to do with it.

if you're going to introduce prison population stats as a way of demonstrating that multiculturalism 'doesn't work', I'll offer up another stat that suggests military service 'doesn't work'.

I can post up stats showing cheap water pumps don't work in Astras, by all means start a thread on Military Service, and the failings when people leave.

I will head back to the Vauxhall section and talk about water pumps.

[Alpinestars]

del mar said:

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

Quick look a white person committing a crime......

On a thread about Multiculturalism and the benefits or lack of, I am not sure what Service men and women have to do with it.

if you're going to introduce prison population stats as a way of demonstrating that multiculturalism 'doesn't work', I'll offer up another stat that suggests military service 'doesn't work'.

I can post up stats showing cheap water pumps don't work in Astras, by all means start a thread on Military Service, and the failings when people leave.

I will head back to the Vauxhall section and talk about water pumps.

How many times have I heard you complain when every thread is turned into a Muslim/anti immigrant thread?

How about engaging instead now that you're here?

Drink culture Friday nights - is that good or bad culture?

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

I can post up stats showing cheap water pumps don't work in Astras, by all means start a thread on Military Service, and the failings when people leave.

I will head back to the Vauxhall section and talk about water pumps.

Are those pumps over-represented in the prison system? Because if not it's irrelevant, unlike my stat.

[del mar]

Alpinestars said:

How many times have I heard you complain when every thread is turned into a Muslim/anti immigrant thread?

How about engaging instead now that you're here?

Drink culture Friday nights - is that good or bad culture?

I think I have been more open and honest in answering questions than most on here.

Drink Culture.

It too me a few minutes to find the answer;

"It doesn't matter to me whether it is good or bad"

[del mar]

TTwiggy said:

del mar said:

I can post up stats showing cheap water pumps don't work in Astras, by all means start a thread on Military Service, and the failings when people leave.

I will head back to the Vauxhall section and talk about water pumps.

Are those pumps over-represented in the prison system? Because if not it's irrelevant, unlike my stat.

They are both irrelevant.

How does the over representation in the prison population of Ex services personnel give any clues as to whether Multiculturalism and immigration has worked ? Prison stats, crime, Chinese restaurants and financial contribution will form part of the argument as to whether it has worked.

Ex service men and water pumps wont.

[TTwiggy]

del mar said:

They are both irrelevant.

How does the over representation in the prison population of Ex services personnel give any clues as to whether Multiculturalism and immigration has worked ? Prison stats, crime, Chinese restaurants and financial contribution will form part of the argument as to whether it has worked.

Ex service men and water pumps wont.

You brought Muslim prison stats into a discussion about multiculturalism. Because you have a problem with Muslims. The whole premise was spurious at best, so any stat relating to the prison population is as relevant as any other.