How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 4)

[Mrr T]

Digga said:

TTwiggy said:

Mrr T said:

Err you do understand these are rules imposed by your company not the EU or the UK government.

99% of Brexit in a nutshell.

Oh really?

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2006/mar/16/work...

"rolled-up holiday pay" is different to paying people for holiday they have chosen not to take holiday.

[Jockman]

Mrr T said:

"rolled-up holiday pay" is different to paying people for holiday they have chosen not to take holiday.

Is it? How so?

[Digga]

Jockman said:

If there were to be a mop up option inserted into this regulation then, as is human nature, many workers would opt to take the money instead. It's just human nature.

The EU rules ignore the fact that there are many people for whom work is a welcome escape from home and, also that for some, spending time with family/on holiday is one of the most stressful things. (Talk to any police officer about domestics over Christmas, or airline staff about arguments and feuds between relatives.)

Jockman said:

MrrT has highlighted the word 'forced' and this is the point upon which he is disagreeing with you. Edit to add you yourself have highlighted the word.

How about us agreeing that "EU interjection has caused a direct change and created uncertainty?

[Ridgemont]

Sway said:

Rather, there's a solution that meets the GFA. The EU believe the only option is to slice off NI.

Unfortunately, in trying to promote that option, they've pointed out that modern customs processing means exceptionally limited 'friction'. Difficult for them to then say that this approach is appropriate for the Irish channel, but wouldn't work on the existing border...

• cough*sea*cough*

It’s not much but let’s call it by its slightly more impressive and correct name

But otherwise you are correct. I still haven’t seen any explanation from Barnier why one solution abides by the principles of The GFA and the other doesn’t.

Edited by Ridgemont on Wednesday 26th September 14:23

[Sway]

confused_buyer said:

Sway said:

Rather, there's a solution that meets the GFA. The EU believe the only option is to slice off NI.

.

Virtually every proposed solution meets the GFA. The GFA actually says very little about the mechanics of the border at all.

I know. I've asked repeatedly upon what basis are the claims that customs processing of goods breaches the GFA made.

Zero response...

[Mrr T]

Jockman said:

Digga said:

Jockman said:

Digga said:

TTwiggy said:

Mrr T said:

Err you do understand these are rules imposed by your company not the EU or the UK government.

99% of Brexit in a nutshell.

Oh really?

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2006/mar/16/work...

Might be a bit of misunderstanding, Digga. You are both correct but for different reasons.

It depends how the people who insure/indemnify your HR risk interpret the rules. There is still an argument to treat this particular area in a belt and braces manner, which did not exist, prior to EU rules.

The trouble is that, as you say, there is no mechanism for mopping up unused holiday via a payment route - we used to do this too.

The theory is that workers should be permitted sufficient time to rest which could in turn lead to increased productivity. That's the theory.

If there were to be a mop up option inserted into this regulation then, as is human nature, many workers would opt to take the money instead. It's just human nature.

MrrT has highlighted the word 'forced' and this is the point upon which he is disagreeing with you. Edit to add you yourself have highlighted the word.

Edited by Jockman on Wednesday 26th September 14:14

I was pointing out that the case related to the “rolled up holiday” concept. Which is very different to compensating an employee for choosing to give up holiday.

More details here:
https://www.qcs.co.uk/can-an-employer-pay-rolled-u...

[Digga]

Mrr T said:

I was pointing out that the case related to the “rolled up holiday” concept. Which is very different to compensating an employee for choosing to give up holiday.

Yep. Totally different altogether, other than it too has more recently been complicated or influenced by EU.

[KrissKross]

TTwiggy said:

Mrr T said:

Err you do understand these are rules imposed by your company not the EU or the UK government.

99% of Brexit in a nutshell.

So what benefits are we paying the EU for if we don't need them?

[B'stard Child]

KrissKross said:

TTwiggy said:

Mrr T said:

Err you do understand these are rules imposed by your company not the EU or the UK government.

99% of Brexit in a nutshell.

So what benefits are we paying the EU for if we don't need them?

Lots of benefits

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/sep/25/mep-...

[PurpleMoonlight]

KrissKross said:

So what benefits are we paying the EU for if we don't need them?

We get to absolve ourselves from any responsibilities and blame the EU for everything?

[KrissKross]

Ok, so none then?

[don'tbesilly]

PurpleMoonlight said:

KrissKross said:

So what benefits are we paying the EU for if we don't need them?

We get to absolve ourselves from any responsibilities and blame the EU for everything?

We?

You had zero interest either way, the rest of the sentence is b*llocks as well.

[B'stard Child]

PurpleMoonlight said:

KrissKross said:

So what benefits are we paying the EU for if we don't need them?

We get to absolve ourselves from any responsibilities and blame the EU for everything?

Good job they aren't gonna have that excuse much longer

[PurpleMoonlight]

B'stard Child said:

Good job they aren't gonna have that excuse much longer

We shall see.

[B'stard Child]

PurpleMoonlight said:

B'stard Child said:

Good job they aren't gonna have that excuse much longer

We shall see.

Good point - well made - we shall indeed see

[anonymous-user]

Helicopter123 said:

That would be a matter for the UK government of the day BUT some of the ideas being put forward in cabinet as part of a 'shock and awe' deregulation plan to deal with the aftermath of a hard brexit are

...including sweeping tax cuts and deregulation on workers’ rights, scrapping automatic enrolment into pension schemes and ditching environmental regulations.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/brexit-bat...

Hardly the progressive response to brexit I think many would be expecting.

Vote brexit, lose your pension (for starters).

compulsory pensions have only just been introduced, by the Tories. Why would they scrap that now when the idea is to reduce the burden on the state in the future by having people build up their own funds?

If you are looking for anti-pension policies, look to Labour, Brown royaly fooked mine.

[Helicopter123]

jsf said:

Helicopter123 said:

That would be a matter for the UK government of the day BUT some of the ideas being put forward in cabinet as part of a 'shock and awe' deregulation plan to deal with the aftermath of a hard brexit are

...including sweeping tax cuts and deregulation on workers’ rights, scrapping automatic enrolment into pension schemes and ditching environmental regulations.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/brexit-bat...

Hardly the progressive response to brexit I think many would be expecting.

Vote brexit, lose your pension (for starters).

compulsory pensions have only just been introduced, by the Tories. Why would they scrap that now when the idea is to reduce the burden on the state in the future by having people build up their own funds?

If you are looking for anti-pension policies, look to Labour, Brown royaly fooked mine.

I don't know why any sane government would, but it's being discussed in Cabinet.

[anonymous-user]

Helicopter123 said:

I don't know why any sane government would, but it's being discussed in Cabinet.

Cabinets discuss lots of things that don't happen, it can often be a good idea to go through an exercise that can end with, well that's a load of bks, lets not do that.

Do you never do that sort of thinking or discussion? I do it all the time when working through a technical challenge.

[Helicopter123]

jsf said:

Cabinets discuss lots of things that don't happen, it can often be a good idea to go through an exercise that can end with, well that's a load of bks, lets not do that.

.

Let’s hope that’s the conclusion they come to, we must protect workers rights in the unlikely event of an unintended no deal Brexit.

[confused_buyer]

Helicopter123 said:

I don't know why any sane government would, but it's being discussed in Cabinet.

How do you know? Can you point me towards a copy of the agenda?