Are labour antisemitic?

[otolith]

TooMany2cvs said:

Sorry, what? It's "problematic" to vote for the founder of Momentum, Jon Lansman, because he suggested Willsman's rant was beyond the pale? Not only is Willsman clearly beyond reproach, but have a read of that denouncement of a "right-winger"...

Fertheloveofgawd.

Monty Python took the piss out of it in The Life of Brian, and it remains true - the left are most vicious when they're falling out with each other.

[TooMany2cvs]

The Surveyor said:

Do people really care in enough numbers for it to matter?

The hard-line Corbyn supporters won't be swayed by the 'right wing press stirring things up', those who wouldn't vote for a Corbyn Labour still won't, and those in between will be swayed more by each parties economic policy than this issue.

It shows a lack of leadership, it shows a lack of integrity, but that isn't a Labour only problem.

It brings the inevitable break-up of the Labour party closer.

If the "JC9" clean up at the NEC election, it won't be long.

[essayer]

I'm looking forward to "Margaret Hodge v The Labour Party" in the High Court featuring JC as a witness. She's not backing down, and neither is Jennie Formby

https://twitter.com/margarethodge/status/102536168... for juicy Mishcon de Reya snarky lawyer letters

[Russian Troll Bot]

Countdown said:

franki68 said:

Gary C said:

Hum

A while back, I saw footage of an old Palestinian woman being rescued from her home after the Israeli army had bombed the town for weeks.

I remember thinking she looked like someone rescued from Belsen and how proud the Jews from that camp would be to see a Jewish state causing such suffering.

Is that antisemitic ?

Now I know it's not that simple, but suppressing outcries of outrage for a state behind what happend isn't just.

Religion !, we would be better off without it.

Do you make the same comparison for example when you see say an old Syrian woman being pulled out of a bombed town in Syria ?

That's an excellent comparison. Assad is generally recognised as a butcher for what he's done in Syria. However Netanyahu does the same thing in Gaza but it's OK because he's only defending israel's inalienable right to exist. It's hypocrisy of the highest order.

Assad has also killed thousands of Palestinians, but oddly enough no one cares about that.

[Octoposse]

essayer said:

I'm looking forward to "Margaret Hodge v The Labour Party" in the High Court featuring JC as a witness. She's not backing down, and neither is Jennie Formby

https://twitter.com/margarethodge/status/102536168... for juicy Mishcon de Reya snarky lawyer letters

Wow - "we can't yet tell you what you have been accused of, but if you apologise for whatever it is, then that's the end of the matter"?

[bitchstewie]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug...

The words "sorry" or "apologise" don't appear once, other than the linked article where Margaret Hodge has been asked to apologise.

[James_B]

The Dangerous Elk said:

JezzaNacht

Paint Pounds symbols on their windows, make them sew on Dollar badges (in yellow ?) to their jackets ?

I can’t think of any politician in recent times making such overt threats against a section of the population. He has a lot of hate in him.

[irocfan]

James_B said:

The Dangerous Elk said:

JezzaNacht

Paint Pounds symbols on their windows, make them sew on Dollar badges (in yellow ?) to their jackets ?

I can’t think of any politician in recent times making such overt threats against a section of the population. He has a lot of hate in him.

nonono you don't understand

1. WeAreCorbyn still trending at no. 2. What an amazing result. Corbyn is here to stay. Has a politician ever received such an outpouring of love? @jeremycorbyn

this is what you're looking at - he's virtually become a messianic figure. Bloody terrifying

[TooMany2cvs]

irocfan said:

nonono you don't understand

1. WeAreCorbyn still trending at no. 2. What an amazing result. Corbyn is here to stay. Has a politician ever received such an outpouring of love? @jeremycorbyn

this is what you're looking at - he's virtually become a messianic figure. Bloody terrifying

A very small, but vocal, minority.

[Octoposse]

bhstewie said:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug...

The words "sorry" or "apologise" don't appear once, other than the linked article where Margaret Hodge has been asked to apologise.

The bit that leapt out at me from a quick read was "And we would not be socialists if we were not prepared to go the extra mile and beyond to address Jewish concerns." .

From my rather simplistic perspective, it's treating antisemitism differently (in terms of process, tolerance, and psychology) to other forms of racism that's got them in this hole to start with. Well that, and actually having a sprinkling of rabid antisemite conspiracy theorists in the membership.

[anonymous-user]

Octoposse said:

...treating antisemitism differently (in terms of process, tolerance, and psychology) to other forms of racism that's got them in this hole to start with...

In their haste to be seen embracing every 'oppressed' minority and cause they have ended up sharing a platform with lots of people with pretty odious views about lots of things. I forget who described it as a snake eating it's own tail but it's spot on. Christ how many of them proudly admit to being marxists or 'revolutionaries'. Politics has gone mad.

[kurt535]

I have been very anti-israel since i went there in @2003 to put a wreath on my uncle's grave who died out there whilst serving in Airborne forces in 1946. I arrived at the airport - pulled out of line at customs due to the RBL wreath I carried in its box and held in a room for 6 hours with my other former army mate was held in another room. Questions mainly centred round why had I flown from England to see my uncles grave who they obviously saw as an oppressor, etc.

i then spent a week in and around Israel plus visiting Palestine and seeing the carnage the wall was having on Palestinian communities. I also experienced first had trigger happy Israeli soldiers who took pot shots as us with their SFMG's whilst we walked in some Palestinian olive groves a farmer showed us to underline how the wall had killed off his only source of income.

I came home incredibly angry at what Israel gets away with. So, no, I really don't like them and get further annoyed when its assumed by default, a person is anti-Semitic if they don't like Israel.

[davepoth]

kurt535 said:

I came home incredibly angry at what Israel gets away with. So, no, I really don't like them and get further annoyed when its assumed by default, a person is anti-Semitic if they don't like Israel.

There are things that the Israeli state does that I really don't like either. But that doesn't make you or me Anti-semitic:

https://www.holocaustremembrance.com/working-defin...

IHRA said:

criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic.

What would tip it into being anti-semitic is if there was a suggestion that the behaviour was intrinsically Jewish.

[TorqueVR]

This thread is driving me nuts. As there's only one Labour Party surely the title should be "IS Labour antisemitic?", not "ARE labour antisemitic?

[avinalarf]

TorqueVR said:

This thread is driving me nuts. As there's only one Labour Party surely the title should be "IS Labour antisemitic?", not "ARE labour antisemitic?

An excellent point ....well made.
You have managed to get to the root of the problem in one short short sentence.
Now can you please tell us how you would get the Palestinians and Israelis to get together in a peaceful solution to the problem.

[TorqueVR]

It's obvious. I'd teach them correct grammar and they'd then be able to converse in a civilised manner.

[avinalarf]

TorqueVR said:

It's obvious. I'd teach them correct grammar and they'd then be able to converse in a civilised manner.

Bloomin heck .....you're a marvel......

[BlackLabel]

McCluskey seems to think that this whole anti semitism thing is the fault of the Jews and they should really be a bit more grateful for all the good deeds Jeremy Corbyn has done for their community.


“Union boss Len McCluskey accuses Jewish community of 'intransigent hostility' towards Labour”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/16/union-...

Non paywall...

https://m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/amp/entry/anti-semi...

[irocfan]

indeed len "the " mcclusky seems to think that the Jews are being oversensitive - I mean it's not like anyone tried to exterminate them within living memory...

[LoonyTunes]

irocfan said:

indeed len "the " mcclusky seems to think that the Jews are being oversensitive - I mean it's not like anyone tried to exterminate them within living memory...

Hmmm...I may be wrong...but I don't think that was the Labour party. Although I'm sure sure some on here would like to pin that on them as well.