Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. (Vol 5)
Discussion
gadgetmac said:
As I recall you wouldn’t come out with the link between TATA and the RS. But thats another argument.
Sure, some will be in it for the cash. But all of the tens of thousands of different Institutes and Scientists, not a hope in hell.
However, I’ve yet to see a link from deniers that isn’t tied to self interest and I’ve been reading this thread for a good few years.
Loonys list crystalised that in way that others hadn’t. But then he called somebody a lickspittle and Moron and somebody reported him. Can’t think who.
Long list for you of scientists:Sure, some will be in it for the cash. But all of the tens of thousands of different Institutes and Scientists, not a hope in hell.
However, I’ve yet to see a link from deniers that isn’t tied to self interest and I’ve been reading this thread for a good few years.
Loonys list crystalised that in way that others hadn’t. But then he called somebody a lickspittle and Moron and somebody reported him. Can’t think who.
Scientists questioning the accuracy of IPCC climate projections
These scientists have said that it is not possible to project global climate accurately enough to justify the ranges projected for temperature and sea-level rise over the 21st century. They may not conclude specifically that the current IPCC projections are either too high or too low, but that the projections are likely to be inaccurate due to inadequacies of current global climate modeling.
David Bellamy, botanist.[19][20][21][22]
Lennart Bengtsson, meteorologist, Reading University.[23][24]
Piers Corbyn, owner of the business WeatherAction which makes weather forecasts.[25][26]
Susan Crockford, Zoologist, adjunct professor in Anthropology at the University of Victoria. [27][28][29]
Judith Curry, professor and former chair of the School of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology.[30][31][32][33]
Joseph D'Aleo, past Chairman American Meteorological Society's Committee on Weather Analysis and Forecasting, former Professor of Meteorology, Lyndon State College.[34][35][36][37]
Freeman Dyson, professor emeritus of the School of Natural Sciences, Institute for Advanced Study; Fellow of the Royal Society.[38][39]
Ivar Giaever, Norwegian–American physicist and Nobel laureate in physics (1973).[40]
Steven E. Koonin, theoretical physicist and director of the Center for Urban Science and Progress at New York University.[41][42]
Richard Lindzen, Alfred P. Sloan emeritus professor of atmospheric science at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and member of the National Academy of Sciences.[39][43][44][45]
Craig Loehle, ecologist and chief scientist at the National Council for Air and Stream Improvement.[46][47][48][49][50][51][52]
Ross McKitrick, professor of economics and CBE chair in sustainable commerce, University of Guelph.[53][54]
Patrick Moore, former president of Greenpeace Canada.[55][56][57]
Nils-Axel Mörner, retired head of the Paleogeophysics and Geodynamics Department at Stockholm University, former chairman of the INQUA Commission on Sea Level Changes and Coastal Evolution (1999–2003).[58][59]
Garth Paltridge, retired chief research scientist, CSIRO Division of Atmospheric Research and retired director of the Institute of the Antarctic Cooperative Research Centre, visiting fellow Australian National University.[60][61]
Roger A. Pielke, Jr., professor of environmental studies at the Center for Science and Technology Policy Research at the University of Colorado at Boulder.[62][63]
Denis Rancourt, former professor of physics at University of Ottawa, research scientist in condensed matter physics, and in environmental and soil science.[64][65][66][67]
Harrison Schmitt, geologist, Apollo 17 astronaut, former US senator.[68][69]
Peter Stilbs, professor of physical chemistry at Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm.[70][71]
Philip Stott, professor emeritus of biogeography at the University of London.[72][73]
Hendrik Tennekes, retired director of research, Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute.[74][75]
Anastasios Tsonis, distinguished professor of atmospheric science at the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.[76][77]
Fritz Vahrenholt, German politician and energy executive with a doctorate in chemistry.[78][79]
Scientists arguing that global warming is primarily caused by natural processes
These scientists have said that the observed warming is more likely to be attributable to natural causes than to human activities. Their views on climate change are usually described in more detail in their biographical articles.
Khabibullo Abdusamatov, astrophysicist at Pulkovo Observatory of the Russian Academy of Sciences.[81][82]
Sallie Baliunas, retired astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics.[83][84][85]
Timothy Ball, historical climatologist, and retired professor of geography at the University of Winnipeg.[86][87][88]
Ian Clark, hydrogeologist, professor, Department of Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa.[89][90]
Vincent Courtillot, geophysicist, member of the French Academy of Sciences.[91]
Doug Edmeades, PhD., soil scientist, officer of the New Zealand Order of Merit.[92]
David Douglass, solid-state physicist, professor, Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Rochester.[93][94]
Don Easterbrook, emeritus professor of geology, Western Washington University.[95][96]
William Happer, physicist specializing in optics and spectroscopy; emeritus professor, Princeton University.[39][97]
Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, Theoretical Physicist and Researcher, Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico.[98]
Ole Humlum, professor of geology at the University of Oslo.[99][100]
Wibjörn Karlén, professor emeritus of geography and geology at the University of Stockholm.[101][102]
William Kininmonth, meteorologist, former Australian delegate to World Meteorological Organization Commission for Climatology.[103][104]
David Legates, associate professor of geography and director of the Center for Climatic Research, University of Delaware.[105][106]
Anthony Lupo, professor of atmospheric science at the University of Missouri.[107][108]
Jennifer Marohasy, an Australian biologist, former director of the Australian Environment Foundation.[109][110]
Tad Murty, oceanographer; adjunct professor, Departments of Civil Engineering and Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa.[111][112]
Tim Patterson, paleoclimatologist and professor of geology at Carleton University in Canada.[113][114]
Ian Plimer, professor emeritus of mining geology, the University of Adelaide.[115][116]
Arthur B. Robinson, American politician, biochemist and former faculty member at the University of California, San Diego.[117][118]
Murry Salby, atmospheric scientist, former professor at Macquarie University and University of Colorado.[119][120]
Nicola Scafetta, research scientist in the physics department at Duke University.[121][122][123]
Tom Segalstad, geologist; associate professor at University of Oslo.[124][125]
Nir Shaviv, professor of physics focusing on astrophysics and climate science at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.[126][127]
Fred Singer, professor emeritus of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia.[128][129][130][131]
Willie Soon, astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics.[132][133]
Roy Spencer, meteorologist; principal research scientist, University of Alabama in Huntsville.[134][135]
Henrik Svensmark, physicist, Danish National Space Center.[136][137]
George H. Taylor, retired director of the Oregon Climate Service at Oregon State University.[138][139]
Jan Veizer, environmental geochemist, professor emeritus from University of Ottawa.[140][141]
Scientists arguing that the cause of global warming is unknown
These scientists have said that no principal cause can be ascribed to the observed rising temperatures, whether man-made or natural.
Syun-Ichi Akasofu, retired professor of geophysics and founding director of the International Arctic Research Center of the University of Alaska Fairbanks.[142][143]
Claude Allègre, French politician; geochemist, emeritus professor at Institute of Geophysics (Paris).[144][145]
Robert Balling, a professor of geography at Arizona State University.[146][147]
Pål Brekke, solar astrophycisist, senior advisor Norwegian Space Centre.[148][149]
John Christy, professor of atmospheric science and director of the Earth System Science Center at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, contributor to several IPCC reports.[150][151][152]
Petr Chylek, space and remote sensing sciences researcher, Los Alamos National Laboratory.[153][154]
David Deming, geology professor at the University of Oklahoma.[155][156]
Stanley B. Goldenberg a meteorologist with NOAA/AOML's Hurricane Research Division.[157][158]
Vincent R. Gray, New Zealand physical chemist with expertise in coal ashes.[159][160]
Keith E. Idso, botanist, former adjunct professor of biology at Maricopa County Community College District and the vice president of the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.[161][162]
Kary Mullis, 1993 Nobel laureate in chemistry, inventor of the polymerase chain reaction (PCR) method.[163][164][165]
Antonino Zichichi, emeritus professor of nuclear physics at the University of Bologna and president of the World Federation of Scientists.[166][167]
Scientists arguing that global warming will have few negative consequences
These scientists have said that projected rising temperatures will be of little impact or a net positive for society or the environment.
Indur M. Goklany, electrical engineer, science and technology policy analyst for the United States Department of the Interior.[168][169][170]
Craig D. Idso, geographer, faculty researcher, Office of Climatology, Arizona State University and founder of the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.[171][172]
Sherwood B. Idso, former research physicist, USDA Water Conservation Laboratory, and adjunct professor, Arizona State University.[173][174]
Patrick Michaels, senior fellow at the Cato Institute and retired research professor of environmental science at the University of Virginia.[175][176]
Deceased scientists
These scientists published material indicating their opposition to the mainstream scientific assessment of global warming prior to their deaths.
August H. "Augie" Auer Jr. (1940–2007), retired New Zealand MetService meteorologist and past professor of atmospheric science at the University of Wyoming.[177][178]
Reid Bryson (1920–2008), emeritus professor of atmospheric and oceanic sciences, University of Wisconsin-Madison.[179][180]
Robert M. Carter (1942–2016), former head of the School of Earth Sciences at James Cook University.[181][182]
Chris de Freitas (1948–2017), associate professor, School of Geography, Geology and Environmental Science, University of Auckland.[183][184]
William M. Gray (1929–2016), professor emeritus and head of the Tropical Meteorology Project, Department of Atmospheric Science, Colorado State University.[185][186]
Yuri Izrael (1930–2014), former chairman, Committee for Hydrometeorology (USSR); former firector, Institute of Global Climate and Ecology (Russian Academy of Science); vice-chairman of IPCC, 2001-2007.[187][188][189]
Robert Jastrow (1925–2008), American astronomer, physicist, cosmologist and leading NASA scientist who, together with Fred Seitz and William Nierenberg, established the George C. Marshall Institute.[190][191][192]
Harold ("Hal") Warren Lewis (1923–2011), emeritus professor of physics and former department chairman at the University of California, Santa Barbara.[193][194]
Frederick Seitz (1911–2008), solid-state physicist, former president of the National Academy of Sciences and co-founder of the George C. Marshall Institute in 1984.[195][196][197]
TX.
robinessex said:
Climate change: COP24 fails to adopt key scientific report
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-464...
Attempts to incorporate a key scientific study into global climate talks in Poland have failed.
The IPCC report on the impacts of a temperature rise of 1.5C, had a significant impact when it was launched last October.
Scientists and many delegates in Poland were shocked as the US, Saudi Arabia, Russia and Kuwait objected to this meeting "welcoming" the report.
It was the 2015 climate conference that had commissioned the landmark study.
The report said that the world is now completely off track, heading more towards 3C this century rather than 1.5C.
Keeping to the preferred target would need "rapid, far-reaching and unprecedented changes in all aspects of society". If warming was to be kept to 1.5C this century, then emissions of carbon dioxide would have to be reduced by 45% by 2030...........continues
It appears every time they have one of their get together the weather put on a show....https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-464...
Attempts to incorporate a key scientific study into global climate talks in Poland have failed.
The IPCC report on the impacts of a temperature rise of 1.5C, had a significant impact when it was launched last October.
Scientists and many delegates in Poland were shocked as the US, Saudi Arabia, Russia and Kuwait objected to this meeting "welcoming" the report.
It was the 2015 climate conference that had commissioned the landmark study.
The report said that the world is now completely off track, heading more towards 3C this century rather than 1.5C.
Keeping to the preferred target would need "rapid, far-reaching and unprecedented changes in all aspects of society". If warming was to be kept to 1.5C this century, then emissions of carbon dioxide would have to be reduced by 45% by 2030...........continues
And this year is no different,
Southern States in America get hit with unprecedented snow,
Lubbock, Texas has had 2 inches more snow in 24 hours than it normally gets in a year.
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/08/us/winter-storm...
PRTVR said:
It appears every time they have one of their get together the weather put on a show....
And this year is no different,
Southern States in America get hit with unprecedented snow,
Lubbock, Texas has had 2 inches more snow in 24 hours than it normally gets in a year.
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/08/us/winter-storm...
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.And this year is no different,
Southern States in America get hit with unprecedented snow,
Lubbock, Texas has had 2 inches more snow in 24 hours than it normally gets in a year.
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/08/us/winter-storm...
Jasandjules said:
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.
Overall warming would lead to an increase of record cold and warm events depending on the area, was I was taught about 20 years ago. That’s what’s happening isn’t it? A constant increase in incidences of record breaking weather.El stovey said:
Jasandjules said:
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.
Overall warming would lead to an increase of record cold and warm events depending on the area, was I was taught about 20 years ago. That’s what’s happening isn’t it? A constant increase in incidences of record breaking weather.
El stovey said:
Jasandjules said:
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.
Overall warming would lead to an increase of record cold and warm events depending on the area, was I was taught about 20 years ago. That’s what’s happening isn’t it? A constant increase in incidences of record breaking weather.If we are having record breaking cold will that not negate any warming predictions.
There is an alternative, the cyclical variable output from the sun.
I have look about on climate change and I am struggling to find references to more snow.
El stovey said:
Jasandjules said:
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.
Overall warming would lead to an increase of record cold and warm events depending on the area, was I was taught about 20 years ago. That’s what’s happening isn’t it? A constant increase in incidences of record breaking weather.Do you have any refs. to the latter, please?
That is not withstanding the observation that there are as many weather records as there are cricket ones
PRTVR said:
El stovey said:
Jasandjules said:
Look, you clearly have not read the Memo. IF it is colder at any time this is weather. It is ONLY if it is warmer for any time that it is due to Global Warming.
Overall warming would lead to an increase of record cold and warm events depending on the area, was I was taught about 20 years ago. That’s what’s happening isn’t it? A constant increase in incidences of record breaking weather.If we are having record breaking cold will that not negate any warming predictions.
There is an alternative, the cyclical variable output from the sun.
I have look about on climate change and I am struggling to find references to more snow.
Article in The Independent 20 March 2000 (now taken offline but available archived in various locations).
Article said:
According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the ClimaticResearch Unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia,within a few years winter snowfall will become "a very rare and exciting event".
"Children just aren't going to know what snow is," he said.
"Children just aren't going to know what snow is," he said.
The propaganda only changed when warm winters lost any hope of being relevant or convincing for the most gullible people. There was a chance that even the mainstream media might think twice about their polly parrot role in ramping non-existent invisible entities.
Remember that the science was / is settled including the science of snow in a dangerously permanently manmadeup global warming world.
More anow AND less snow is a non-testable example of nonscience hypothesising. A double-headed coin.
Settled...until it's plainly, obviously demonstrably junk and bunk, at which point pro-agw brassnecks jut out a bit more, look the other way, and change the climat fairytale to suit the new line of patter while claiming with not a hint of shame that it's all about the science dahling.
Ho Ho Ho
robinessex said:
Dindoit said:
Volume 5 and the deniers still can't differentiate between weather and climate.
Of course, we're stupid. The Beeb shows cooling towers issuing steam, and calls it pollution. Ditto calling CO2 pollution as well.Terminator X said:
gadgetmac said:
As I recall you wouldn’t come out with the link between TATA and the RS. But thats another argument.
Sure, some will be in it for the cash. But all of the tens of thousands of different Institutes and Scientists, not a hope in hell.
However, I’ve yet to see a link from deniers that isn’t tied to self interest and I’ve been reading this thread for a good few years.
Loonys list crystalised that in way that others hadn’t. But then he called somebody a lickspittle and Moron and somebody reported him. Can’t think who.
Long list for you of scientists:Sure, some will be in it for the cash. But all of the tens of thousands of different Institutes and Scientists, not a hope in hell.
However, I’ve yet to see a link from deniers that isn’t tied to self interest and I’ve been reading this thread for a good few years.
Loonys list crystalised that in way that others hadn’t. But then he called somebody a lickspittle and Moron and somebody reported him. Can’t think who.
Scientists questioning the accuracy of IPCC climate projections
These scientists have said that it is not possible to project global climate accurately enough to justify the ranges projected for temperature and sea-level rise over the 21st century. They may not conclude specifically that the current IPCC projections are either too high or too low, but that the projections are likely to be inaccurate due to inadequacies of current global climate modeling.
David Bellamy, botanist.[19][20][21][22]
Lennart Bengtsson, meteorologist, Reading University.[23][24]
Piers Corbyn, owner of the business WeatherAction which makes weather forecasts.[25][26]
Susan Crockford, Zoologist, adjunct professor in Anthropology at the University of Victoria. [27][28][29]
Judith Curry, professor and former chair of the School of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology.[30][31][32][33]
Joseph D'Aleo, past Chairman American Meteorological Society's Committee on Weather Analysis and Forecasting, former Professor of Meteorology, Lyndon State College.[34][35][36][37]
Freeman Dyson, professor emeritus of the School of Natural Sciences, Institute for Advanced Study; Fellow of the Royal Society.[38][39]
Ivar Giaever, Norwegian–American physicist and Nobel laureate in physics (1973).[40]
Steven E. Koonin, theoretical physicist and director of the Center for Urban Science and Progress at New York University.[41][42]
Richard Lindzen, Alfred P. Sloan emeritus professor of atmospheric science at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and member of the National Academy of Sciences.[39][43][44][45]
Craig Loehle, ecologist and chief scientist at the National Council for Air and Stream Improvement.[46][47][48][49][50][51][52]
Ross McKitrick, professor of economics and CBE chair in sustainable commerce, University of Guelph.[53][54]
Patrick Moore, former president of Greenpeace Canada.[55][56][57]
Nils-Axel Mörner, retired head of the Paleogeophysics and Geodynamics Department at Stockholm University, former chairman of the INQUA Commission on Sea Level Changes and Coastal Evolution (1999–2003).[58][59]
Garth Paltridge, retired chief research scientist, CSIRO Division of Atmospheric Research and retired director of the Institute of the Antarctic Cooperative Research Centre, visiting fellow Australian National University.[60][61]
Roger A. Pielke, Jr., professor of environmental studies at the Center for Science and Technology Policy Research at the University of Colorado at Boulder.[62][63]
Denis Rancourt, former professor of physics at University of Ottawa, research scientist in condensed matter physics, and in environmental and soil science.[64][65][66][67]
Harrison Schmitt, geologist, Apollo 17 astronaut, former US senator.[68][69]
Peter Stilbs, professor of physical chemistry at Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm.[70][71]
Philip Stott, professor emeritus of biogeography at the University of London.[72][73]
Hendrik Tennekes, retired director of research, Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute.[74][75]
Anastasios Tsonis, distinguished professor of atmospheric science at the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.[76][77]
Fritz Vahrenholt, German politician and energy executive with a doctorate in chemistry.[78][79]
Scientists arguing that global warming is primarily caused by natural processes
These scientists have said that the observed warming is more likely to be attributable to natural causes than to human activities. Their views on climate change are usually described in more detail in their biographical articles.
Khabibullo Abdusamatov, astrophysicist at Pulkovo Observatory of the Russian Academy of Sciences.[81][82]
Sallie Baliunas, retired astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics.[83][84][85]
Timothy Ball, historical climatologist, and retired professor of geography at the University of Winnipeg.[86][87][88]
Ian Clark, hydrogeologist, professor, Department of Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa.[89][90]
Vincent Courtillot, geophysicist, member of the French Academy of Sciences.[91]
Doug Edmeades, PhD., soil scientist, officer of the New Zealand Order of Merit.[92]
David Douglass, solid-state physicist, professor, Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Rochester.[93][94]
Don Easterbrook, emeritus professor of geology, Western Washington University.[95][96]
William Happer, physicist specializing in optics and spectroscopy; emeritus professor, Princeton University.[39][97]
Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, Theoretical Physicist and Researcher, Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico.[98]
Ole Humlum, professor of geology at the University of Oslo.[99][100]
Wibjörn Karlén, professor emeritus of geography and geology at the University of Stockholm.[101][102]
William Kininmonth, meteorologist, former Australian delegate to World Meteorological Organization Commission for Climatology.[103][104]
David Legates, associate professor of geography and director of the Center for Climatic Research, University of Delaware.[105][106]
Anthony Lupo, professor of atmospheric science at the University of Missouri.[107][108]
Jennifer Marohasy, an Australian biologist, former director of the Australian Environment Foundation.[109][110]
Tad Murty, oceanographer; adjunct professor, Departments of Civil Engineering and Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa.[111][112]
Tim Patterson, paleoclimatologist and professor of geology at Carleton University in Canada.[113][114]
Ian Plimer, professor emeritus of mining geology, the University of Adelaide.[115][116]
Arthur B. Robinson, American politician, biochemist and former faculty member at the University of California, San Diego.[117][118]
Murry Salby, atmospheric scientist, former professor at Macquarie University and University of Colorado.[119][120]
Nicola Scafetta, research scientist in the physics department at Duke University.[121][122][123]
Tom Segalstad, geologist; associate professor at University of Oslo.[124][125]
Nir Shaviv, professor of physics focusing on astrophysics and climate science at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.[126][127]
Fred Singer, professor emeritus of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia.[128][129][130][131]
Willie Soon, astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics.[132][133]
Roy Spencer, meteorologist; principal research scientist, University of Alabama in Huntsville.[134][135]
Henrik Svensmark, physicist, Danish National Space Center.[136][137]
George H. Taylor, retired director of the Oregon Climate Service at Oregon State University.[138][139]
Jan Veizer, environmental geochemist, professor emeritus from University of Ottawa.[140][141]
Scientists arguing that the cause of global warming is unknown
These scientists have said that no principal cause can be ascribed to the observed rising temperatures, whether man-made or natural.
Syun-Ichi Akasofu, retired professor of geophysics and founding director of the International Arctic Research Center of the University of Alaska Fairbanks.[142][143]
Claude Allègre, French politician; geochemist, emeritus professor at Institute of Geophysics (Paris).[144][145]
Robert Balling, a professor of geography at Arizona State University.[146][147]
Pål Brekke, solar astrophycisist, senior advisor Norwegian Space Centre.[148][149]
John Christy, professor of atmospheric science and director of the Earth System Science Center at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, contributor to several IPCC reports.[150][151][152]
Petr Chylek, space and remote sensing sciences researcher, Los Alamos National Laboratory.[153][154]
David Deming, geology professor at the University of Oklahoma.[155][156]
Stanley B. Goldenberg a meteorologist with NOAA/AOML's Hurricane Research Division.[157][158]
Vincent R. Gray, New Zealand physical chemist with expertise in coal ashes.[159][160]
Keith E. Idso, botanist, former adjunct professor of biology at Maricopa County Community College District and the vice president of the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.[161][162]
Kary Mullis, 1993 Nobel laureate in chemistry, inventor of the polymerase chain reaction (PCR) method.[163][164][165]
Antonino Zichichi, emeritus professor of nuclear physics at the University of Bologna and president of the World Federation of Scientists.[166][167]
Scientists arguing that global warming will have few negative consequences
These scientists have said that projected rising temperatures will be of little impact or a net positive for society or the environment.
Indur M. Goklany, electrical engineer, science and technology policy analyst for the United States Department of the Interior.[168][169][170]
Craig D. Idso, geographer, faculty researcher, Office of Climatology, Arizona State University and founder of the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.[171][172]
Sherwood B. Idso, former research physicist, USDA Water Conservation Laboratory, and adjunct professor, Arizona State University.[173][174]
Patrick Michaels, senior fellow at the Cato Institute and retired research professor of environmental science at the University of Virginia.[175][176]
Deceased scientists
These scientists published material indicating their opposition to the mainstream scientific assessment of global warming prior to their deaths.
August H. "Augie" Auer Jr. (1940–2007), retired New Zealand MetService meteorologist and past professor of atmospheric science at the University of Wyoming.[177][178]
Reid Bryson (1920–2008), emeritus professor of atmospheric and oceanic sciences, University of Wisconsin-Madison.[179][180]
Robert M. Carter (1942–2016), former head of the School of Earth Sciences at James Cook University.[181][182]
Chris de Freitas (1948–2017), associate professor, School of Geography, Geology and Environmental Science, University of Auckland.[183][184]
William M. Gray (1929–2016), professor emeritus and head of the Tropical Meteorology Project, Department of Atmospheric Science, Colorado State University.[185][186]
Yuri Izrael (1930–2014), former chairman, Committee for Hydrometeorology (USSR); former firector, Institute of Global Climate and Ecology (Russian Academy of Science); vice-chairman of IPCC, 2001-2007.[187][188][189]
Robert Jastrow (1925–2008), American astronomer, physicist, cosmologist and leading NASA scientist who, together with Fred Seitz and William Nierenberg, established the George C. Marshall Institute.[190][191][192]
Harold ("Hal") Warren Lewis (1923–2011), emeritus professor of physics and former department chairman at the University of California, Santa Barbara.[193][194]
Frederick Seitz (1911–2008), solid-state physicist, former president of the National Academy of Sciences and co-founder of the George C. Marshall Institute in 1984.[195][196][197]
TX.
A few points about your list.
1) You can discount the first 35'as they aren't deniers even by your own description. They say it's not possible to predict, not that MMGW isn't happening. See Pielke for details.
2) You then quote scientists who are proven to have links to big oil. Something I was saying is all I ever see quoted.
3) Where did you get your list?
4) Like the Nasa list - a lot of people on it are not qualified in any climate science
5) You can't quote people who have been dead for a while as deniers...They did not have the data at hand that we do now. You may as well quote Napoleon.
6) You can't include those who think it's a positive thing the climate warning up...they are not deniers of MMGW
7) Even allowing for the above...is that it??? Of the thousands of climate scientists world wide you effectively come up with a handful who are deniers of MMGW and nobody has looked at their credentials or background yet as they are included in with known Big Oil lackeys...Spencer, Soon etc.
Must do better.
gadgetmac said:
Jeez.
A few points about your list.
1) You can discount the first 35'as they aren't deniers even by your own description. They say it's not possible to predict, not that MMGW isn't happening. See Pielke for details.
7) Even allowing for the above...is that it??? Of the thousands of climate scientists world wide you effectively come up with a handful who are deniers of MMGW and nobody has looked at their credentials or background yet as they are included in with known Big Oil lackeys...Spencer, Soon etc.
Just like to make a couple of points about this 'rebuttal'.A few points about your list.
1) You can discount the first 35'as they aren't deniers even by your own description. They say it's not possible to predict, not that MMGW isn't happening. See Pielke for details.
7) Even allowing for the above...is that it??? Of the thousands of climate scientists world wide you effectively come up with a handful who are deniers of MMGW and nobody has looked at their credentials or background yet as they are included in with known Big Oil lackeys...Spencer, Soon etc.
On point (1) - There is a key circular element about being able to predict (or lack of).... if the MMGW theory is boll0x, it can't predict - and if it can't predict then its boll0x.
On point (7) - "Consensus" has been something mentioned time and time again - it doesn't mean much at all in terms of the validity of a theory. (Or its failure). As a demonstration that a consensus can easily be built against MMGW, a number of scientists gathered thousands of signatures, until they ran out of postage stamps in which to send the letters. There is a youtube video of this somewhere which I'll try to dig out if you like?
robinessex said:
Dindoit said:
Volume 5 and the deniers still can't differentiate between weather and climate.
Of course, we're stupid. The Beeb shows cooling towers issuing steam, and calls it pollution. Ditto calling CO2 pollution as well.HTH.
"This month's fuel-tax riots in Paris and the defeat of a carbon-fee ballot measure in Washington state show the difficulty of getting people to support a levy on the energy sources that heat their homes and power their cars."
Politico, 9 December 2018
Especially when it's demonstrably based on climate fairytales.
Best of luck to any politician who wants/tries to do a Full Macron.
Politico, 9 December 2018
Especially when it's demonstrably based on climate fairytales.
Best of luck to any politician who wants/tries to do a Full Macron.
Atomic12C said:
On point (7) - "Consensus" has been something mentioned time and time again - it doesn't mean much at all in terms of the validity of a theory. (Or its failure). As a demonstration that a consensus can easily be built against MMGW, a number of scientists gathered thousands of signatures, until they ran out of postage stamps in which to send the letters. There is a youtube video of this somewhere which I'll try to dig out if you like?
Consensus means general agreement. The consensus among climate scientists, and scientists in general, is that the climate is changing and that elevated CO2 levels are to blame. The idea that anything other that a tiny minority of scientists thinks otherwise is nonsense. You are correct that this doesn't mean the theory is valid. Don't kid yourself that it's anything other than a fringe view that CO2 is somehow unimportant for climate.
turbobloke said:
...Dr David Viner,
Oh, it must be December. People declaring the advent of winter disproves climate change, and turbobloke churning out this tiresome b
ks again. It's a tad ironic that people who hate the concept of renewable energy are happy to recycle the same tired posts every year.
gadgetmac said:
7) Even allowing for the above...is that it??? Of the thousands of climate scientists world wide you effectively come up with a handful who are deniers of MMGW and nobody has looked at their credentials or background yet as they are included in with known Big Oil lackeys...Spencer, Soon etc.
Must do better.
I looked up of a few of these names for fun and bloody hell, what a treasure trove of lunatics somebody's managed to cobble together. I'd guess it's from some absurd propaganda site like No Tricks Zone?Must do better.
Honestly, I don't know how somebody can present a list like that and think it strengthens their position. Either they haven't checked the names, they hope nobody else does, or they're just willing to accept it at face value.
hairykrishna said:
Atomic12C said:
On point (7) - "Consensus" has been something mentioned time and time again - it doesn't mean much at all in terms of the validity of a theory. (Or its failure). As a demonstration that a consensus can easily be built against MMGW, a number of scientists gathered thousands of signatures, until they ran out of postage stamps in which to send the letters. There is a youtube video of this somewhere which I'll try to dig out if you like?
Consensus means general agreement. The consensus among climate scientists, and scientists in general, is that the climate is changing and that elevated CO2 levels are to blame. The idea that anything other that a tiny minority of scientists thinks otherwise is nonsense. You are correct that this doesn't mean the theory is valid. Don't kid yourself that it's anything other than a fringe view that CO2 is somehow unimportant for climate.
Edited by Diderot on Tuesday 11th December 00:05
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