Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. (Vol 5)
Discussion
wc98 said:
motco said:
Has this Falsification of the atmospheric CO2 greenhouse effect within the frame of physics from Cornell University website been posted before?
i think that was roundly dismissed across the spectrum back in the day, both sides of the debate were fairly critical of it. i could dig out some links if you are interested.Doesn't surprise me, nobody seems either competent or honest in this field. Thanks for the offer wc, but I probably wouldn't be bothered to read them among all the other conflicting information.
motco said:
Doesn't surprise me, nobody seems either competent or honest in this field. Thanks for the offer wc, but I probably wouldn't be bothered to read them among all the other conflicting information.
no probs, that is how i see it,many on the sceptic side seem to favour satellite data. when you look at it ,it goes through even more b
disation ,sorry processing, than the surface generated stuff. wc98 said:
motco said:
Doesn't surprise me, nobody seems either competent or honest in this field. Thanks for the offer wc, but I probably wouldn't be bothered to read them among all the other conflicting information.
no probs, that is how i see it,many on the sceptic side seem to favour satellite data. when you look at it ,it goes through even more bdisation ,sorry processing, than the surface generated stuff. 
wc98 said:
no probs, that is how i see it,many on the sceptic side seem to favour satellite data. when you look at it ,it goes through even more bdisation ,sorry processing, than the surface generated stuff.
The "mixed" sensor type and low number of measurements taken (and spatial issues) makes the ground/sea surface data much less representative of a "global" temperature than the satellite data. Irrespective of adjustments and other known issues. The historic data from the surface record was not designed for the purpose it is being put to and as such is not particularly useful. Whilst we "don't live in the lower troposphere" is often thrown out as a reason not to use the satellite data - we don't live a bucket's depth under water either.disation ,sorry processing, than the surface generated stuff. wc98 said:
motco said:
Doesn't surprise me, nobody seems either competent or honest in this field. Thanks for the offer wc, but I probably wouldn't be bothered to read them among all the other conflicting information.
no probs, that is how i see it,many on the sceptic side seem to favour satellite data. when you look at it ,it goes through even more bdisation ,sorry processing, than the surface generated stuff. Sampling is far superior. No 'Harry Read Me' cobblers. 30+ years so climate relevant, they say.
Surface substitution is a godsend for the faith. Without it the sick agw joke would be even funnier.
Jinx said:
The "mixed" sensor type and low number of measurements taken (and spatial issues) makes the ground/sea surface data much less representative of a "global" temperature than the satellite data. Irrespective of adjustments and other known issues. The historic data from the surface record was not designed for the purpose it is being put to and as such is not particularly useful. Whilst we "don't live in the lower troposphere" is often thrown out as a reason not to use the satellite data - we don't live a bucket's depth under water either.
100% agreement on that as well. there is no long time series data fit for current purpose. Some great news for the integrity of science today,peter ridd has won his case against james cook university in australia .hopefully he will be recompensed appropriately and the university now understands the importance of maintaining impartiality and academic freedom when it comes to disagreements on science.
wc98 said:
Some great news for the integrity of science today,peter ridd has won his case against james cook university in australia .hopefully he will be recompensed appropriately and the university now understands the importance of maintaining impartiality and academic freedom when it comes to disagreements on science.
Great news.Some quotes from Peter Ridd...
The coral reef recovers.
Peter Ridd: Coral Reefs recover — “the scientists make hay when it dies in a spectacular way but they are quiet when it recovers.”
On symbionts — “There is a large variety of symbionts and some allow coral to grow faster but are more sensitive to bleaching.”
All the corals on the Great Barrier Reef live and grow much faster in Papua New Guinea, Indonesia and Thailand where the water is much hotter than it is on the reef and the corals just juggle these symbionts. 4:20
Corals have a little thermometer built in them, when you take a core of them from many years ago we know what the temperature of the water was back when Captain Cook sailed up the coast, it was actually about the same temperature then. It was colder 100 years ago, but it has recovered from that. The temperatures on the reef are not even significantly warmer than average on a hundred year timescale.
Corals that bleach in one year will be less susceptible to bleaching in following years.
On the failure of modern science:
Peter Ridd: We can no longer rely on our science institutions. This is a very sad thing.
We are like a ship upon the ocean when our science fails and we need to do something about it. … This science is almost never checked.
Alan Jones: All these things [bleaching, crown of thorns] have been around for millennia, I love this line, as you write “long before scientists got hold of any scuba gear.”
Peter Ridd: These things only became a problem when scientists pop up on the scene.
Scientists are trying to close down, or affect adversely the sugar cane, the cattle, and the coal industry, and they are also telling the world the reef is dead which affects the tourist industry in Queensland.
Like a bushfire… It [bleaching] looks terrible when it happens but it grows back.
On the future:
Peter Ridd: There needs to be a properly funded group of scientists who sole job is to find fault in the science with which we are basing expensive public policy decisions ….
The judge in the Ridd case said the following...
“Intellectual freedom is so important. It allows academics to express their opinions without fear of reprisals. It allows a Charles Darwin to break free of the constraints of creationism. It allows an Albert Einstein to break free of the constraints of Newtonian physics. It allows the human race to question conventional wisdom in the never-ending search for knowledge and truth.”
“Intellectual freedom is so important. It allows academics to express their opinions without fear of reprisals. It allows a Charles Darwin to break free of the constraints of creationism. It allows an Albert Einstein to break free of the constraints of Newtonian physics. It allows the human race to question conventional wisdom in the never-ending search for knowledge and truth.”
Kawasicki said:
The judge in the Ridd case said the following...
“Intellectual freedom is so important. It allows academics to express their opinions without fear of reprisals. It allows a Charles Darwin to break free of the constraints of creationism. It allows an Albert Einstein to break free of the constraints of Newtonian physics. It allows the human race to question conventional wisdom in the never-ending search for knowledge and truth.”
thankfully at least the aussie judiciary appear to have maintained impartiality and common sense. we could do with a bit more of that attitude here.“Intellectual freedom is so important. It allows academics to express their opinions without fear of reprisals. It allows a Charles Darwin to break free of the constraints of creationism. It allows an Albert Einstein to break free of the constraints of Newtonian physics. It allows the human race to question conventional wisdom in the never-ending search for knowledge and truth.”
jshell said:
I'm a skeptic, but it's important to note the victory was only for freedom of speech, not for Ridd's views...
Sure, if a judge handed down climate doctrine then the IPCC would be out of a job!It's still a major win for Peter Ridd and a well-deserved defeat for The Climate Inquisition mob.
James Cook University has been judged to have acted unlawfully when it sacked Ridd after he openly criticised the uni and one of its Faithfui Team scientists over claims about the impact global warming supposedly had on the Great Barrier Reef. Not long after the saga began, several publications changed their tune on the GBR. The Oz government had basically written the reef's obituary due to misleading claims. Now there are headlines in various media as well as content in academic papers regarding the improving health, not the demise, of the GBR.
Misrepresenting and blaming natural phenomena such as El Nino for manmade CC and its supposed impacts just got a lot harder and intellectual freedom of thought and expression is healthier in Oz atm.
ETA quote from JM.
Jennifer Marohasy said:
James Cook University may have already spent over $1 million in legal fees attempting to silence Peter Ridd. They have assumed that sooner or later he would run out of money and courage. But not Peter, with his legal team and support of people like Spectator Australia readers has kept going. Taking this fight to the Federal Court would not have been possible were it not for Peter deciding to take a stand in defence of the truth, to not back down regardless of the consequences.
Edited by turbobloke on Tuesday 16th April 14:37
3.1416 said:
Presumably Ridd will be seeking a hefty payment from his previous employer regardless of whether his opinion is substantiated or not.
well his opinion on the barrier reef has been substantiated and it certainly looks like some of his colleagues were aholes ,so i hope he does. not to mention he did lose his job.Extinction Rebellion London protest: Arrests top 200
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-4794...
More than 120 climate change activists have been arrested for blocking roads in central London, amid protests aimed at shutting down the capital.
A second day of disruption is under way after Extinction Rebellion campaigners camped overnight at Waterloo Bridge, Parliament Square and Oxford Circus.
Police said 500,000 people had been affected by the diversion of 55 bus routes in London.......continues
Rent a protest mob. About as worried of the climate as my dog. Any old protest will do to pass the time.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-4794...
More than 120 climate change activists have been arrested for blocking roads in central London, amid protests aimed at shutting down the capital.
A second day of disruption is under way after Extinction Rebellion campaigners camped overnight at Waterloo Bridge, Parliament Square and Oxford Circus.
Police said 500,000 people had been affected by the diversion of 55 bus routes in London.......continues
Rent a protest mob. About as worried of the climate as my dog. Any old protest will do to pass the time.
UK's biggest money manager warns on climate catastrophe
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47941180
The world is facing a climate catastrophe and businesses around the world must address it urgently or face the ultimate sanction for a public company, shareholders who refuse to back them any more.
That is not a message from an environmental action group but from the largest money manager in the UK, Legal & General Investment Management, which manages £1 trillion worth of UK pension fund investments..........continues.
I suppose someone whose job is gambling with other peoples money is sufficiently qualified to talk about climate change then?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47941180
The world is facing a climate catastrophe and businesses around the world must address it urgently or face the ultimate sanction for a public company, shareholders who refuse to back them any more.
That is not a message from an environmental action group but from the largest money manager in the UK, Legal & General Investment Management, which manages £1 trillion worth of UK pension fund investments..........continues.
I suppose someone whose job is gambling with other peoples money is sufficiently qualified to talk about climate change then?
El stovey said:
Funny that on this thread, the yellow jacket french protests against macron are seen as evidence that the tide is changing against AGW and the Paris accord, (which it isn’t) but actual climate change protests are dismissed as rent a mob. 
Well chap, 200+ have been arrested in London so far. Do you support their argument that the imminent demise of humanity is nigh and there will be an extinction event due to MMGW unless something is done to stop carbon emissions by 2025 entirely or is your view a little more nuanced, as a pilot? Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff