How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 5)
Discussion
Jonesy23 said:
I think you might be confused about the various positions.
The DUP aren't the ones who want an open border inside Ireland or want to maintain the CU. They're the ones who want NI to be treated like any other part of the UK.
It's the other side and the boys in the South who want an open border etc. etc. as a pretty transparent attempt to get a united Ireland via the back door.
And that is something the DUP will never support.
But NI is already not treated like the rest of the UK. Abortion law is different, gay marriage hasn’t come in, Scotland has a different legal system, the Queen is not the head of the Church of Ireland (who are anglicans). If you are born there you can get Irish passport. Not sure why it is tariffs and customs that are now an issue, when all the above are far greater cultural/ legal differences The DUP aren't the ones who want an open border inside Ireland or want to maintain the CU. They're the ones who want NI to be treated like any other part of the UK.
It's the other side and the boys in the South who want an open border etc. etc. as a pretty transparent attempt to get a united Ireland via the back door.
And that is something the DUP will never support.
Heck, even their school year is different- 01 July not 01 September
Edited by wisbech on Monday 15th October 11:53
alfie2244 said:
jsf said:
Still stuck in Calais.
Has the FTSE100 crashed yet?
Just started Operation Stack on the M20.Has the FTSE100 crashed yet?
The M26 regulate turns into a stacking operation as a result of vehicles being unable to join the M20.
One wonders just how industry copes with 2 of the main routes in and out of Dover regularly gridlocked!
Never mind, it will all be over by March 2020.
soupdragon1 said:
I find it hard to decipher your actual points here to be honest. We can't just say screw it, we'll do things our way. It has to be done in a legally binding way, we can't just make up some new rules to fit.
Leaves do not need to follow conventional laws. It’s up to everyone else to alter their laws to suit leavers.soupdragon1 said:
I find it hard to decipher your actual points here to be honest. We can't just say screw it, we'll do things our way. It has to be done in a legally binding way, we can't just make up some new rules to fit.
We can do what we want ref our own borders. That being one of the points behind Leaving. So if we choose to have no border in NI (in essence the case since well before the EU) then we are free to do so.
If the Irish want to erect a fuller border to suit the EU's needs, then they are free to do that.
Previously WTO rules have been cited as why we cannot do this. But there are no rules other than treating trade partners equitably. If a trade party felt the NI border situation was treating them unfairly, then they could object and a lengthy arbitration process would start. But other than the EU, who else would object to NI border arrangements? It's not like we have other land borders, and if they want alternative arrangements then maybe it acts as a prompt for a trade deal? I just can't see the WTO angle being an issue at all.
Murph7355 said:
soupdragon1 said:
I find it hard to decipher your actual points here to be honest. We can't just say screw it, we'll do things our way. It has to be done in a legally binding way, we can't just make up some new rules to fit.
We can do what we want ref our own borders. That being one of the points behind Leaving. So if we choose to have no border in NI (in essence the case since well before the EU) then we are free to do so.
If the Irish want to erect a fuller border to suit the EU's needs, then they are free to do that.
Previously WTO rules have been cited as why we cannot do this. But there are no rules other than treating trade partners equitably. If a trade party felt the NI border situation was treating them unfairly, then they could object and a lengthy arbitration process would start. But other than the EU, who else would object to NI border arrangements? It's not like we have other land borders, and if they want alternative arrangements then maybe it acts as a prompt for a trade deal? I just can't see the WTO angle being an issue at all.
I think the misunderstanding is over border 'controls' rather than the actual border itself. Yes, we can take more control over the borders, but we can't just say 'we don't want them'.
Mrr T said:
Leaves do not need to follow conventional laws. It’s up to everyone else to alter their laws to suit leavers.
Which laws do we need to abide by? You noted the WTO previously... Those "laws"? Or some other "laws" that determine how many border points a country must have, who must man them etc...?
soupdragon1 said:
We can't just do what we want with our own borders - as part of Brexit negotiations, we have to agree what the border agreements will look like. Its not like cancelling your Netflix subscription - ie, I've had enough, bye bye.
I think the misunderstanding is over border 'controls' rather than the actual border itself. Yes, we can take more control over the borders, but we can't just say 'we don't want them'.
You are suggesting that the UK MUST have manned checkpoints on the actual NI border and MUST check ALL goods crossing between RoI into NI if we cannot agree a deal? I think the misunderstanding is over border 'controls' rather than the actual border itself. Yes, we can take more control over the borders, but we can't just say 'we don't want them'.
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