How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 5)

[Ron Maiden]

Ghibli said:

I'm discussing the trade deals we will be losing in a no deal situation.

Will losing those trade deals really matter to you?, spending all day moaning on PH's will still continue, you will probably
have even more to whine the day away, especially if it all really goes tits up, think of all those told you so, told you so,
told you so, told you so posts you can make then. Bless.

[soupdragon1]

desolate said:

Jonesy23 said:

Funny how some people seem to st themselves over the possible threat to the GFA and the reemergence of republican terrorism, yet are happy to promote a route that would kick off the loyalist side to a stupid degree.

A problem (and solution) from Irish nationalists (backed up by the EU) just causes a different but related set of problems.

Posturing from all sides apart would the solution of northern Ireland remaining in the CU/SM provide a really positive financial benefit?

(That is a genuine question by the way, I think it would but I am not positive)

That would remain to be seen, depending on the finer detail of any such proposal. As Jonesy quite rightly mentions, if it's no good, it won't wash. It really would have to mean best of both worlds, and even then, there will still be opposition.

What is certain though, that's it's better than a hard brexit with no deal. That would hurt NI for sure. It needs to be done in such a way that Unionists are satisfied that the Union is intact and the special arrangements net an overall benefit to NI.

While some may see that as a weakening of DUP hardline position, it could be the thing that actually protects the Union as a hard brexit could spark a referendum for NI to leave the UK. And if DUP look a gift horse in the mouth, that won't bode well in a referendum. Small concessions now by the DUP could actually strengthen the Union in the long term.

To be fair to the DUP, they are absolutely right to dismiss Barniers best of both worlds solution....because it wasn't.
T May needs to work that better and then it could actually become something acceptable. And she may very well give that a try.

[anonymous-user]

Vanden Saab said:

Please explain how anybody on any side would lose their current benefits from an agreement that pre-dates the EU, has nothing to do with the EU, is still in place and according to the UK, the RoI, the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands will not change?

If there is a border put in place "by the EU" then British people will lose their current rights.
It may not be our fault but it would be our problem.

If there was no change at all to the border then there is no issue.

[anonymous-user]

KrissKross said:

Ghibli said:

KrissKross said:

What's that got to do with anything I said?

I'm discussing the trade deals we will be losing in a no deal situation.

The tax you mention will be the tarriffs.

Can you explain a "trade deal" give any example you like? My company won't lose any trade because we know what we are doing in our sector.

Yes, tax is tariffs and other barriers, call it any name you like, it does not help with trade, it only hinders.

If our government was sensible it would remove barriers in the short term and lead the world on a new system, the EU would be worried about such an option, hence why they don't want us to go it alone and be seen to have any better ideas than them. This would be embarrassing.

Perhaps it would be better if you explain what will be in place in the event of a no deal Brexit.

Fact would be better than just an opinion if possible.

[anonymous-user]

Ron Maiden said:

Ghibli said:

I'm discussing the trade deals we will be losing in a no deal situation.

Will losing those trade deals really matter to you?, spending all day moaning on PH's will still continue, you will probably
have even more to whine the day away, especially if it all really goes tits up, think of all those told you so, told you so,
told you so, told you so posts you can make then. Bless.

It probably won't matter that much unless people can't pay their rent.

[KrissKross]

Ghibli said:

KrissKross said:

Ghibli said:

KrissKross said:

What's that got to do with anything I said?

I'm discussing the trade deals we will be losing in a no deal situation.

The tax you mention will be the tarriffs.

Can you explain a "trade deal" give any example you like? My company won't lose any trade because we know what we are doing in our sector.

Yes, tax is tariffs and other barriers, call it any name you like, it does not help with trade, it only hinders.

If our government was sensible it would remove barriers in the short term and lead the world on a new system, the EU would be worried about such an option, hence why they don't want us to go it alone and be seen to have any better ideas than them. This would be embarrassing.

Perhaps it would be better if you explain what will be in place in the event of a no deal Brexit.

Fact would be better than just an opinion if possible.

Why are you here?

[KrissKross]

Ghibli said:

It probably won't matter that much unless people can't pay their rent.

If you cannot pay your bills, you should re-train in a career/trade that is actually needed. This applies globally by the way.

I assume at the moment the EU propaganda machine is paying you to post on PH, that might well end soon.

[anonymous-user]

KrissKross said:

Ghibli said:

It probably won't matter that much unless people can't pay their rent.

If you cannot pay your bills, you should re-train in a career/trade that is actually needed. This applies globally by the way.

I assume at the moment the EU propaganda machine is paying you to post on PH, that might well end soon.

you think I can't pay my bills and the EU pays me.

Tin foil hatter.

[davey68]

I can understand why people might think that. You post on here endlessly Ghibli.

[andymadmak]

Ghibli said:

andymadmak said:

Yes it does if the EU is being unreasonably obstructive to achieving a deal that is good for both sides. Pour encourager les autres seems to be the EU mindset though -

We already have a deal that is good for both sides.

Are you hoping for better.

We had a deal that was good in some aspects, not so good in others. It was assessed by the voting public as being inadequate and the decision was made to leave.
Now a new deal must be agreed. It will not be quite as good viz a viz the relationship between the rEU and UK, but it will facilitate the UK establishing new, good deals with other global trading nations.
Why would the EU not want the best possible deal post Brexit? Are they sulking?

[anonymous-user]

davey68 said:

I can understand why people might think that. You post on here endlessly Ghibli.

It doesn't mean I can't pay my bills or work for the EU.

Tuna is upset that I didn't post for a couple of days and the EU negotiations are still going.

PH has all the answers/opinions

[Tuna]

Mrr T said:

It does seem many on the leave team have read what Barnier said and made 2 + 2 = 5. Barnier said the border in the sea can be technology and away from the ports. The EU proposal is for the sea border. What Barnier means that it up to the UK how they manage the border. If the UK can develop a technology border then it's up to the UK. However, what ever happens there will be a border if it people and clip boards or technology that's up to the UK. This does not mean he accepts a technology border on land because the UK have not presented any concrete evidence it can be produced on time and if it's not ready for 2020 there is no fall back.

I'm curious how much of a technical difference you think it makes have the border in the sea as opposed to having it on land? If checks are remote and away from the point of transport, why do you think Barnier's location is magically easier to implement than the politically less sensitive option?

As has been pointed out to you repeatedly, if you accept that a solution can be implemented (which you do as I understand it) then issues over time to implementation are not the showstopper you think. The EU is far more concerned with direction of travel than time to destination.

[anonymous-user]

andymadmak said:

We had a deal that was good in some aspects, not so good in others. It was assessed by the voting public as being inadequate and the decision was made to leave.
Now a new deal must be agreed. It will not be quite as good viz a viz the relationship between the rEU and UK, but it will facilitate the UK establishing new, good deals with other global trading nations.
Why would the EU not want the best possible deal post Brexit? Are they sulking?

What do you think that the EU should do?

[Tuna]

Ghibli said:

I'm discussing the trade deals we will be losing in a no deal situation.

That's the one thing you aren't doing. You post endlessly about what other posters want or think, but when I asked you directly what the actual 'loss of trade deals' would involve that would stop trade, and not surprisingly, that was the one post you haven't responded to.

[anonymous-user]

Tuna said:

That's the one thing you aren't doing. You post endlessly about what other posters want or think, but when I asked you directly what the actual 'loss of trade deals' would involve that would stop trade, and not surprisingly, that was the one post you haven't responded to.

You should know that the loss of our current trade deals would mean WTO.

No one is saying trade will stop, just the FTA, of course we are leaving to get better FTA if we can.

[KrissKross]

Ghibli said:

What do you think that the EU should do?

End, and give us a refund.

[Coolbanana]

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/john-...

Spot on assessment by John Major.

Those deceitful snakes will be remembered for how they conned 17 million... .

[Vanden Saab]

desolate said:

Vanden Saab said:

Please explain how anybody on any side would lose their current benefits from an agreement that pre-dates the EU, has nothing to do with the EU, is still in place and according to the UK, the RoI, the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands will not change?

If there is a border put in place "by the EU" then British people will lose their current rights.
It may not be our fault but it would be our problem.

If there was no change at all to the border then there is no issue.

You are joking.... the EU cannot put a border in place. It is up to Ireland to do that. Any changes to the CTA like the British people losing their current rights would also mean an end to the GFA..... As both the RoI and the UK have confirmed the CTA will continue in the event of a no deal as confirmed here.... https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/abroad/i... What are you suggesting the EU would or could do?

[anonymous-user]

Vanden Saab said:

You are joking.... the EU cannot put a border in place. It is up to Ireland to do that. Any changes to the CTA like the British people losing their current rights would also mean an end to the GFA..... As both the RoI and the UK have confirmed the CTA will continue in the event of a no deal as confirmed here.... https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/abroad/i... What are you suggesting the EU would or could do?

I'm suggesting my solution would be financially advantageous for Northern Ireland and for our country as a whole.

I think it could be sold to the EU as a pragmatic solution.


That's what I'm suggesting.

What's not to like?

[Earthdweller]

desolate said:

At the moment we have no border.
That's pretty clear.

Yes we do .. there had been a border along the line of the 6 counties since the founding of the free states in 1922