How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 5)
Discussion
The fact that there is even discussion about whether we have to pay the EU to leave suggests to me that it isn't clear cut in any treaty or contract, and that the amount payable will be subject to negotiation and gestures of goodwill. I've heard figures ranging from 20bn to 100bn euros. That in itself doesn't sound like any contractual obligation to me
Ghibli said:
What difference does it make what tarriffs the EU applies We currently dont have tarriffs.
Why do you think people don't want no deal?
Which bit are you struggling with ? How will it help having the average EU tarriff when it's obvious to most people that no tarriffs is better than wTO.
You appear to want to fixate on one small thing to ignore the bigger picture.
But there will be a price to be paid to achieve zero tariffs with the EU. If we don't know what the alternative tariffs are how can we determine whether it's worth it?Why do you think people don't want no deal?
Which bit are you struggling with ? How will it help having the average EU tarriff when it's obvious to most people that no tarriffs is better than wTO.
You appear to want to fixate on one small thing to ignore the bigger picture.
amusingduck said:
PurpleMoonlight said:
Vanden Saab said:
And how do you think that would go? It is a different thing to win in a court you do not control. How many other countries would want to risk signing treaties with such an organisation?
No idea who would win. Yes, if we default on the EU it doesn't look good for our world status or future trade utopia.
Crikey, some people really do need to recognise realpolitik. When we can have Trump tear up trade deals and climate change treaties, biological weapons deployed on UK soil, journalists getting dismembered, etc., and business still gets done - a spat over potential and ambiguous Treaty commitments is piffling.
Dr Jekyll said:
But there will be a price to be paid to achieve zero tariffs with the EU. If we don't know what the alternative tariffs are how can we determine whether it's worth it?
Isn't that what people voted for? All the super trade deals that we will be getting, we have been told they will be better.We know that we will get WTO with no deal. It would be nice to trade as we are in a transition period but it's looking like our Goverment wants to go straight to the super unknown trade deals and WTO.
andymadmak said:
Ghibli said:
It would be nice to trade as we are in a transition period
Why would we not be able to trade under a 'No deal, WTO' scenario?Note - Of course we have had to pay and will continue to pay in the event of a transition - clearly someone else has paid or will continue to pay for that but it doesn't have a bearing on the situation now
Ghibli said:
Isn't that what people voted for? All the super trade deals that we will be getting, we have been told they will be better.
We know that we will get WTO with no deal. It would be nice to trade as we are in a transition period but it's looking like our Goverment wants to go straight to the super unknown trade deals and WTO.
Oh look, the US has just filed notice that it's ready to start trade negotiations. The timing is such that we will be able to meet with them and formally agree something pretty much the day we leave.We know that we will get WTO with no deal. It would be nice to trade as we are in a transition period but it's looking like our Goverment wants to go straight to the super unknown trade deals and WTO.
The US and Liam Fox have already set up a working group which is "laying the groundwork for a potential future free trade agreement".
"Super unknown trade deals"? Lol.
Tuna said:
Oh look, the US has just filed notice that it's ready to start trade negotiations. The timing is such that we will be able to meet with them and formally agree something pretty much the day we leave.
The US and Liam Fox have already set up a working group which is "laying the groundwork for a potential future free trade agreement".
"Super unknown trade deals"? Lol.
Great we have been saved. A shame when people wanted WTO.The US and Liam Fox have already set up a working group which is "laying the groundwork for a potential future free trade agreement".
"Super unknown trade deals"? Lol.
Ghibli said:
Tuna said:
Oh look, the US has just filed notice that it's ready to start trade negotiations. The timing is such that we will be able to meet with them and formally agree something pretty much the day we leave.
The US and Liam Fox have already set up a working group which is "laying the groundwork for a potential future free trade agreement".
"Super unknown trade deals"? Lol.
Great we have been saved. A shame when people wanted WTO.The US and Liam Fox have already set up a working group which is "laying the groundwork for a potential future free trade agreement".
"Super unknown trade deals"? Lol.
Ghibli said:
andymadmak said:
Ghibli said:
It would be nice to trade as we are in a transition period
Why would we not be able to trade under a 'No deal, WTO' scenario?You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
Ghibli said:
Great we have been saved. A shame when people wanted WTO.
Seriously? You do understand that under WTO you can make trade deals? WTO is a backstop. We already use it - EU membership is a trade deal on top of WTO.
Actually, why bother asking. You don't understand what WTO actually involves, you don't understand the costs of trading, you don't really seem to understand anything.
andymadmak said:
OK, so we can trade under WTO. Now what costs would be involved in that trade that we currently do not have to pay?
You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
Lol. Good luck with getting an answer on that. Ghibli's entire reasoning doesn't go deeper than "It's obvious". He's not got a clue.You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
andymadmak said:
OK, so we can trade under WTO. Now what costs would be involved in that trade that we currently do not have to pay?
You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
We would have tarriffs with the EU and if we lose our trade agreements we will have tarriffs with those countries.You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
Perhaps you could look up all the agreements and tarriffs and let me know.
Ghibli said:
andymadmak said:
OK, so we can trade under WTO. Now what costs would be involved in that trade that we currently do not have to pay?
You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
We would have tarriffs with the EU and if we lose our trade agreements we will have tarriffs with those countries.You can express them as a % of the value if that makes it easier for you
Perhaps you could look up all the agreements and tarriffs and let me know.
What's the problem? The paperwork? The tariffs? Come on now Ghibli, you surely have to have a reason for objecting to a trading system that most of the world make use of?
Tuna said:
Ghibli said:
Great we have been saved. A shame when people wanted WTO.
Seriously? You do understand that under WTO you can make trade deals? WTO is a backstop. We already use it - EU membership is a trade deal on top of WTO.
Actually, why bother asking. You don't understand what WTO actually involves, you don't understand the costs of trading, you don't really seem to understand anything.
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