How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 5)
Discussion
City_boy said:
Piha said:
Brexiteers find TM's deal unacceptable.
Remainers find TM's deal unacceptable.
Every sane person finds a chaotic No Deal utterly unacceptable.
The EU state this is the only deal available.
And now the ECJ hint that Art 50 can be rescinded.......
No, given the results of the referendum, an orderly “no deal” is the obvious solution.Remainers find TM's deal unacceptable.
Every sane person finds a chaotic No Deal utterly unacceptable.
The EU state this is the only deal available.
And now the ECJ hint that Art 50 can be rescinded.......
This announcement is non binding but and a big but, if the ECJ confirm the comments then I think a Peoples Vote is inevitable.
jsf said:
If that does become the ruling of the ECJ then the top court of the UK was wrong in the gina miller case.
So you have yet again more evidence the UK is not a sovereign nation.
Are you saying that a potential ruling which puts the decision firmly back with UK parliament unilaterally makes us less sovereign? Please explain your rationale. So you have yet again more evidence the UK is not a sovereign nation.
Please explain why you consider the Uk courts view on GMs case is undermined by this potential ECJ ruling.
Edited by Nickgnome on Tuesday 4th December 09:25
https://news.sky.com/story/top-eu-law-officer-says...
Well.
That's several more nails in Brexit's coffin, right there.
It is looking very likely that the UK can remain in the EU exactly as it is, simply by 'pausing' or recalling Article 50. No loss of benefits, just cancel Brexit.
That will add impetus and renewed vigour to an already increasingly dominant Remain campaign.
Brexit is doomed unless Leaver's go with TM's Deal. I did say so.
Well.
That's several more nails in Brexit's coffin, right there.
It is looking very likely that the UK can remain in the EU exactly as it is, simply by 'pausing' or recalling Article 50. No loss of benefits, just cancel Brexit.
That will add impetus and renewed vigour to an already increasingly dominant Remain campaign.
Brexit is doomed unless Leaver's go with TM's Deal. I did say so.
Politically no deal will not happen unfortunately, mp, s are to scared of being left holding the baby if it goes wrong.
May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
Coolbanana said:
https://news.sky.com/story/top-eu-law-officer-says...
Well.
That's several more nails in Brexit's coffin, right there.
It is looking very likely that the UK can remain in the EU exactly as it is, simply by 'pausing' or recalling Article 50. No loss of benefits, just cancel Brexit.
That will add impetus and renewed vigour to an already increasingly dominant Remain campaign.
Brexit is doomed unless Leaver's go with TM's Deal. I did say so.
Well.
That's several more nails in Brexit's coffin, right there.
It is looking very likely that the UK can remain in the EU exactly as it is, simply by 'pausing' or recalling Article 50. No loss of benefits, just cancel Brexit.
That will add impetus and renewed vigour to an already increasingly dominant Remain campaign.
Brexit is doomed unless Leaver's go with TM's Deal. I did say so.
Mind you, one consequence of the ECJ decision, if decided by the court, would be that, if we are unhappy with the future arrangements, we simply revoke A50, and then submit out notice again, giving us another 24 months to come up with a decent deal or prepare for No Deal.
Essentially we can say, "May's deal is rubbish, let's try again" and, on the basis of the Advocate's view, this is entirely within our unilateral power.
citizensm1th said:
Politically no deal will not happen unfortunately, mp, s are to scared of being left holding the baby if it goes wrong.
May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
TM's Deal gets Leaver's some form of Brexit. May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
A 2nd Referendum gives them a 50/50 chance of a No Deal.
So, what'll it be? A soft Brexit or go all in for a shot at the Leave Ultimate Prize but risk no Brexit at all?
Nickgnome said:
Are you saying that a potential ruling which puts the decision firmly back with UK parliament unilaterally makes us less soverign? Please explain your rationale.
Please explain why you consider the Uk courts view on GMs case is undermined by this potential ECJ ruling.
He can't, it has been a bad 24hrs for jsfPlease explain why you consider the Uk courts view on GMs case is undermined by this potential ECJ ruling.
Cox trying to hold off on the legal advice and now the ecj hinting that we can stop bre it at anytime, you can for give him a little frothing
Polite M135 driver said:
City_boy said:
No, given the results of the referendum, an orderly “no deal” is the obvious solution.
It’s the obviously insane solution that nobody with any responsibility will condone.I don't have that much interest in which variety of establishment stich up wins the day. Except to say that May's deal is the worst of the lot.
City_boy said:
No, given the results of the referendum, an orderly “no deal” is the obvious solution.
I agree. It is interesting that the most ardent Remainers are unwilling to debate what the actual practicalities of an orderly 'no deal' exit entail. It always lapses rapidly into hysteria and henna penny sky falling in rhetoric.
As a practical matter the UK could go 'no deal'..... politically though it would be hard, given just how much effort the politicians have put into painting no deal as an unmitigated disaster in the making.
The interesting scenario for me might be this:
May's deal gets voted down (it really is THAT bad)
Parliament finds a way to go for Referendum 2
Referendum 2 gives another Brexit vote (I genuinely believe this would be the outcome)
Parliament then has to do what it has spent years saying is impossible (make a no deal exit work)
UK exits and thrives!
Coolbanana said:
citizensm1th said:
Politically no deal will not happen unfortunately, mp, s are to scared of being left holding the baby if it goes wrong.
May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
TM's Deal gets Leaver's some form of Brexit. May's deal is dead in the water if we are to believe the reports.
What's left?
The easy option being dangled by ecj a step back and reformulate a plan or a second referendum?
A 2nd Referendum gives them a 50/50 chance of a No Deal.
So, what'll it be? A soft Brexit or go all in for a shot at the Leave Ultimate Prize but risk no Brexit at all?
City_boy said:
Polite M135 driver said:
It’s the obviously insane solution that nobody with any responsibility will condone.
It’s only insane if you don’t understand what it means.Piha said:
I would like to find out more & talk about a No Deal Brexit but before I can I would like to understand the positive financial outcome of No Deal. Can you post a link to any articles nor papers that clearly demonstrate the financial benefits of a NO Deal Brexit please?
If you didn’t understand the discussions in the run up to the referendum, nor in the 2+ years since, what’s changed to mean that you will understand it now?Alternatively, why do you think that the only way that the UK can prosper is by paying the EU c. £15-20bn per annum?
Edited by City_boy on Tuesday 4th December 09:51
Piha said:
I would like to find out more & talk about a No Deal Brexit but before I can I would like to understand the positive financial outcome of No Deal. Can you post a link to any articles or papers that clearly demonstrate the financial benefits of a NO Deal Brexit please?
How are you defining positive? Over what time scale? Against what are you going to make your comparison? andymadmak said:
Piha said:
I would like to find out more & talk about a No Deal Brexit but before I can I would like to understand the positive financial outcome of No Deal. Can you post a link to any articles or papers that clearly demonstrate the financial benefits of a NO Deal Brexit please?
How are you defining positive? Over what time scale? Against what are you going to make your comparison? Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff