Yellow vests - fuel protest day of action in France

[Russian Troll Bot]

Puggit said:

Road haulage unions have announced they will go on strike from Sunday night.

This is still ratcheting up...

Indefinite strike apparently. If that includes fuel tankers, then that must be game over for Macron

[Digga]

JPJPJP said:

The legacy of the guillotine?

I've said similar a few pages back.

It's an odd combination of quasi-communist, anti-capitalist and anti-establishment ideals, which combines with a sclerotic business and political culture. French business is the last bastion of the worst sort of male-chauvinist, boys club in the western world.

In general, the people, the country (i.e. geographically) and the food and drink are wonderful, but there are collective issues that are virtually unsolvable.

[toppstuff]

Russian Troll Bot said:

Puggit said:

Road haulage unions have announced they will go on strike from Sunday night.

This is still ratcheting up...

Indefinite strike apparently. If that includes fuel tankers, then that must be game over for Macron

Reckon he’ll throw some money at them, give up a large dose of mea culpa, a group hug and everyone will get back to normal.

[zbc]

magooagain said:

garagewidow said:

Why are students protesting seeing as I expect most of them don't yet run a car and/or aren't working?

Surely macrons' measures of higher fuel taxes play right into the hands of the eco/green student movement or are they just less bothered about GW than ours are.

Or I suspect it's anarchy at any opportunity.

Social media has been showing a video of a student being badly beaten by police along with a photo of his facial injurys. The students are protesting because of this.


Today we are receiving messages from French friends on social media etc calling for a full out protest next Monday and blockades everywhere.
It's not over yet it seems.

Edited by magooagain on Tuesday 4th December 17:36

Students are actually protesting about some very poorly managed, but much needed in my opinion, changes to the Baccalaureate. The outline changes have been announced for some time and are to do with focusing the Bac onto fewer options and making some significant changes to the structure and also the subsequent entrance to university process. However the detail is still missing and many students who could be impacted are in a kind of limbo. They should be starting to make some of those choices about their options next year already but don't know what they will be able to choose yet.

[Thom]

Digga said:

I honestly believe the revolution created a void - command, control, authority - that has never since been filled.

Ever heard of Napoléon, Clémenceau or De Gaulle?
Perhaps some of them were not quite anglophile enough to make their way to your history books at school though?

[Derek Smith]

Thom said:

Digga said:

I honestly believe the revolution created a void - command, control, authority - that has never since been filled.

Ever heard of Napoléon, Clémenceau or De Gaulle?
Perhaps some of them were not quite anglophile enough to make their way to your history books at school though?

Indeed. One might suggest that the Gaullist era is what gave rise to the current, and historical, propensity to demonstrate at every opportunity. He was rather strict, wasn't he.

Clémenceau was the architect of the Second World War. I've not quite forgiven him for that.

[magooagain]

zbc said:

Students are actually protesting about some very poorly managed, but much needed in my opinion, changes to the Baccalaureate. The outline changes have been announced for some time and are to do with focusing the Bac onto fewer options and making some significant changes to the structure and also the subsequent entrance to university process. However the detail is still missing and many students who could be impacted are in a kind of limbo. They should be starting to make some of those choices about their options next year already but don't know what they will be able to choose yet.

Agreed but that's been going on a lot longer than these gilet jaune protests.

[JagLover]

Derek Smith said:

Clémenceau was the architect of the Second World War. I've not quite forgiven him for that.

Only if you believe that the Germans would have been happy to set aside their ambitions if they had been treated with more love after defeat in a devastating war they themselves had started.

While Hitler was still a nobody, Foch had this to say about the treaty of Versaille

"This is not a peace. It is an armistice for twenty years." and he said this in 1919....

[zbc]

magooagain said:

zbc said:

Students are actually protesting about some very poorly managed, but much needed in my opinion, changes to the Baccalaureate. The outline changes have been announced for some time and are to do with focusing the Bac onto fewer options and making some significant changes to the structure and also the subsequent entrance to university process. However the detail is still missing and many students who could be impacted are in a kind of limbo. They should be starting to make some of those choices about their options next year already but don't know what they will be able to choose yet.

Agreed but that's been going on a lot longer than these gilet jaune protests.

Yes but that's the official union line at least https://www.fidl.org/non-la-fidl-nest-pas-gilet-ja...

[Rovinghawk]

Thom said:

Ever heard of Napoléon, Clémenceau or De Gaulle?
Perhaps some of them were not quite anglophile enough to make their way to your history books at school though?

De Gaulle once said that if he wasn't French he'd have liked to have been English. (Churchill replied that if he wasn't English he'd really like to be English.)

Edited by Rovinghawk on Wednesday 5th December 16:17

[anonymous-user]

REALIST123 said:

...
You know, populism, that awful prospect of politicians doing what the people want, not what the politicians want.
...

Be careful what you wish for.

[WyrleyD]

Just arrived at our hotel for the night in Coquelles after the drive up from south of Limoges. Left early and only a few protesters here and there off the autoroute exits. Hotel is full and it looks like mostly Police and Gendarmes staying here as there are numerous police cars/vans in the car park and they also have a control room set up in one of the conference rooms. Whatever are they expecting?

Edit: CRS vans have just arrived too.

Edited by WyrleyD on Wednesday 5th December 16:25

[Cold]

Macron has dangled the "tax the rich again" carrot in an attempt to calm things.

[grumbledoak]

Cold said:

Macron has dangled the "tax the rich again" carrot in an attempt to calm things.

As if he will do anything of the sort.

[toppstuff]

grumbledoak said:

As if he will do anything of the sort.

Did he not bring in some property tax to hit the rich ?

[Frank7]

Rovinghawk said:

De Gualle once said that if he wasn't be French he'd have liked to be English. (Churchill replied that if he wasn't English he'd really like to be English.)

I doubt that de Gaulle said that, but I don’t know enough about him to dispute it, but that certainly sounds like something that Churchill would say.
One de Gaulle quote that I’m sure that he said, was, “Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first, Nationalism is when hate for people other than your own comes first.”
One of his more controversial speeches was in Montréal, Canada in 1967.
He declared, “Vive Montréal, Vive le Québec libre!” (Long live Montréal, long live free Québec!)
Canada’s Prime Minister, Lester Pearson condemned it, saying, “Canadians do not need to be liberated.”

[citizensm1th]

WyrleyD said:

Just arrived at our hotel for the night in Coquelles after the drive up from south of Limoges. Left early and only a few protesters here and there off the autoroute exits. Hotel is full and it looks like mostly Police and Gendarmes staying here as there are numerous police cars/vans in the car park and they also have a control room set up in one of the conference rooms. Whatever are they expecting?

Edit: CRS vans have just arrived too.

Edited by WyrleyD on Wednesday 5th December 16:25

Well the bar in your hotel should be fun tonight. just don't mention Waterloo, Agincourt or Mers-el-Kébir

[WyrleyD]

Reception bloke said eat early as it's likely to be a bit chaotic!

[Earthdweller]

One of my favourite moments re DeGaulle


Ask him about the cemeteries, Dean!"

In 1966 upon being told that President Charles DeGaulle had taken France out of NATO and that all U.S. troops must be evacuated off of French soil President Lyndon Johnson mentioned to Secretary of State Dean Rusk that he should ask DeGaulle about the Americans buried in France. Dean implied in his answer that that DeGaulle should not really be asked that in the meeting at which point President Johnson then told Secretary of State Dean Rusk:

"Ask him about the cemeteries Dean!"

That made it into a Presidential Order so he had to ask President DeGaulle.

So at end of the meeting Dean did ask DeGaulle if his order to remove all U.S. troops from French soil also included the 60,000+ soldiers buried in France from World War I and World War II.

DeGaulle, embarrassed, got up and left and never answered.

[isaldiri]

toppstuff said:

grumbledoak said:

As if he will do anything of the sort.

Did he not bring in some property tax to hit the rich ?

No. Macron amended the existing wealth tax to only include property and effectively hand a (large) tax cut to the rich.