How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 6)
Discussion
Ghibli said:
Vanden Saab said:
Blackpuddin said:
This is a very telling poll. Not only is there no obvious replacement for TM, there is no obvious 'genius' anywhere with the magical ability to renegotiate Brexit.
So true even the EU say this is the only deal, therefore if/ when the WA is voted down we will leave on the 29th and go onto WTO rules. At least we know that our Goverment is capable of negotiating all of our trade agreements at the same time whilst dealing with all of our exports to the EU backing up
Surely another referendum with all the magic thinking of how a no deal Brexit is what this country needs is needed.
Ghibli said:
TEKNOPUG said:
How I voted or what I voted for is of no relevance. I stated that I would start from the assumption of no deal being negotiated. Invent a time machine, transport me back to 2016 and install me as leader of the country and I'll answer the rest of your questions.
Why you wish to discuss what I would do, had I been PM 2 years ago seems utterly bizarre. What questions are troubling you so much that you seek these answers? Surely our time would be better discussing where we are now and the future, than an imaginary past where I was leader of the Conservative party?
No solution to the current situation? Just that the negotiations are being run by remainers and everything is their fault.Why you wish to discuss what I would do, had I been PM 2 years ago seems utterly bizarre. What questions are troubling you so much that you seek these answers? Surely our time would be better discussing where we are now and the future, than an imaginary past where I was leader of the Conservative party?
If we could take your time machine back a couple of years, we might wonder what motivates someone who is against leaving the EU, in standing to become leader of their party and therefore PM, with a mandate to Brexit in the first place? That would be a question that you could also put to all the remain supporting MPs who were happy to stand for election on a manifesto stating that they would deliver Brexit....
When you install me as Supreme Ruler of the UK in 2016, I might suggest that an emergeny goverment be formed from MPs across all parties, who had particular skills & experience that maybe desirable in navgiating the UK through the Brexit negotiations and restructuring of the UK's relationship with the EU and wider world. I expect TM probably wouldn't be involved. But until such time as you deliver me a time machine, it's all rather moot. As is most talk about what should have been done. That's not to say that lessons can't be learnt from history, if for no reason other than not to repeat them again in future.
Sway said:
Mrr T said:
TEKNOPUG said:
The people voted to leave the SM, the CU, the ECJ and FOM. It was all laid out in the £9m Government leaflet exactly what "Leave" meant. Therefore the default position should have been to leave with "no (trade) deal" and then anything negotiated would be a bonus.
As for "someone else", I'd suggest starting with someone who actually respected the outcome of the vote and attempted to carry out the will of the people from day 1 would be a good idea. Someone who says "Brexit means Brexit" and "No deal is better than a bad deal".......unless of course if they are a liar and have done everything in their power to subvert the result of the referendum - which seems even more perverse given that they voted in parliament FIVE times to hold a referendum ....
I am confused by this. At the time the pamphlet was sent leavers all said it was rubbish and all part of project fear. Now leavers say it forms the basis of the decision to leave the SM and CU. Not sure you fully understand hypocrisy.As for "someone else", I'd suggest starting with someone who actually respected the outcome of the vote and attempted to carry out the will of the people from day 1 would be a good idea. Someone who says "Brexit means Brexit" and "No deal is better than a bad deal".......unless of course if they are a liar and have done everything in their power to subvert the result of the referendum - which seems even more perverse given that they voted in parliament FIVE times to hold a referendum ....
There was talk that it would take years to agree a FTA - that was rightly called out as project fear. In reality, that took less than a fortnight.
The Government leaflet, official Remain campaign and official Leave campaign all stated a vote to leave meant leaving the Single Market, Customs Union and jurisdiction of the ECJ...
To claim the mandate for leaving the SM and CU are documents published by the remain campaign is bizarre.
Blackpuddin said:
Ghibli said:
FiF said:
In other news, from YouGov Dec 4
"Which of the following do you think would make the best Prime Minister?"
In reverse order
3rd place. Jeremy Corbyn 24%
2nd place. Theresa May 35%
And tonight's winner in 1st place
Drum roll
1st place is Not Sure 37% So now is a good time to throw your hat in the ring, whoever you are.
Perfect timing for Tommy Robinson."Which of the following do you think would make the best Prime Minister?"
In reverse order
3rd place. Jeremy Corbyn 24%
2nd place. Theresa May 35%
And tonight's winner in 1st place
Drum roll
1st place is Not Sure 37% So now is a good time to throw your hat in the ring, whoever you are.
Drag him back, install him in No10 and say “it’s all your f
king mess .. you caused it now sort the fking stty mess you left out@ Earthdweller said:
Someone should go and find that weasel Cameron wherever he is hiding
Drag him back, install him in No10 and say “it’s all your fking mess .. you caused it now sort the fking stty mess you left out@
Behave.Drag him back, install him in No10 and say “it’s all your f
king mess .. you caused it now sort the fking stty mess you left out@ Call me Dave is too busy writing a book and touring the world giving after dinner speeches to those who pay enough.
All
In
It
Together
Vanden Saab said:
Ghibli said:
Vanden Saab said:
Blackpuddin said:
This is a very telling poll. Not only is there no obvious replacement for TM, there is no obvious 'genius' anywhere with the magical ability to renegotiate Brexit.
So true even the EU say this is the only deal, therefore if/ when the WA is voted down we will leave on the 29th and go onto WTO rules. At least we know that our Goverment is capable of negotiating all of our trade agreements at the same time whilst dealing with all of our exports to the EU backing up
Surely another referendum with all the magic thinking of how a no deal Brexit is what this country needs is needed.
Apparently we are really good at making trade agreements and can complete them in 18 months.. (unlike the EU that takes years)
Red 4 said:
Earthdweller said:
Someone should go and find that weasel Cameron wherever he is hiding
Drag him back, install him in No10 and say “it’s all your fking mess .. you caused it now sort the fking stty mess you left out@
Behave.Drag him back, install him in No10 and say “it’s all your f
king mess .. you caused it now sort the fking stty mess you left out@ Call me Dave is too busy writing a book and touring the world giving after dinner speeches to those who pay enough.
All
In
It
Together
Piha said:
Leave won the referendum. This is a fact.
The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
You missed the part that TM's exit plan does not match the promises that she made during the GE (nobody won the GE).The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
Hayek said:
Piha said:
Leave won the referendum. This is a fact.
The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
You missed the part that TM's exit plan does not match the promises that she made during the GE (nobody won the GE).The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
saaby93 said:
Hayek said:
Piha said:
Leave won the referendum. This is a fact.
The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
You missed the part that TM's exit plan does not match the promises that she made during the GE (nobody won the GE).The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
Conservative Manifesto 2017 said:
As we leave the European Union, we will no longer be members of the single market or
customs union
customs union
Hayek said:
saaby93 said:
Hayek said:
Piha said:
Leave won the referendum. This is a fact.
The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
You missed the part that TM's exit plan does not match the promises that she made during the GE (nobody won the GE).The tories won the GE. The said they would deliver the referendum result. This is what TM is doing.
TM has presented the exit plan.
It is time the Leave campaign accepted the PMs offer. It is Yes or No. No if's or but's. YES or NO.
If Leave don't like TM's deal then we need a People's Vote.
Conservative Manifesto 2017 said:
As we leave the European Union, we will no longer be members of the single market or
customs union
customs union
Conservative Manifesto 2017 said:
Leaving the European Union also means we will be free to strike our own trade agreements with countries outside the EU.
Does her deal allow us to make trade deals with the rest of the world after March 2019? I don't think so, please correct if wrong.Mrr T said:
Sway said:
Mrr T said:
TEKNOPUG said:
The people voted to leave the SM, the CU, the ECJ and FOM. It was all laid out in the £9m Government leaflet exactly what "Leave" meant. Therefore the default position should have been to leave with "no (trade) deal" and then anything negotiated would be a bonus.
As for "someone else", I'd suggest starting with someone who actually respected the outcome of the vote and attempted to carry out the will of the people from day 1 would be a good idea. Someone who says "Brexit means Brexit" and "No deal is better than a bad deal".......unless of course if they are a liar and have done everything in their power to subvert the result of the referendum - which seems even more perverse given that they voted in parliament FIVE times to hold a referendum ....
I am confused by this. At the time the pamphlet was sent leavers all said it was rubbish and all part of project fear. Now leavers say it forms the basis of the decision to leave the SM and CU. Not sure you fully understand hypocrisy.As for "someone else", I'd suggest starting with someone who actually respected the outcome of the vote and attempted to carry out the will of the people from day 1 would be a good idea. Someone who says "Brexit means Brexit" and "No deal is better than a bad deal".......unless of course if they are a liar and have done everything in their power to subvert the result of the referendum - which seems even more perverse given that they voted in parliament FIVE times to hold a referendum ....
There was talk that it would take years to agree a FTA - that was rightly called out as project fear. In reality, that took less than a fortnight.
The Government leaflet, official Remain campaign and official Leave campaign all stated a vote to leave meant leaving the Single Market, Customs Union and jurisdiction of the ECJ...
To claim the mandate for leaving the SM and CU are documents published by the remain campaign is bizarre.
That's irrelevant of course - the claim you made was that any reference to leaving the SM/CU was dismissed by leavers. You then in this post claim that it was only the leaflet that made this definition of leave - yet I've given two more. Of course, after the ref we the had a GE where every party using this definition increased their vote (covering over 80%).
So it's very difficult to see the basis for your claim that somehow leaves thought they were voting to leave the EU, yet retain those agreements...
You can do better - just because it's a new volume, please let's not make fallacious claims as though there's no continuity of the debate.
Hayek said:
How about...
The TM deal achieves that. If we where members we would have votes and influence. In the TM deal we just follow the rules.Conservative Manifesto 2017 said:
As we leave the European Union, we will no longer be members of the single market or
customs union
customs union
Well done team leave you managed to turn the UK into a vassal state of the EU. Hope you are proud.
Mrr T said:
Hayek said:
How about...
The TM deal achieves that. If we where members we would have votes and influence. In the TM deal we just follow the rules.Conservative Manifesto 2017 said:
As we leave the European Union, we will no longer be members of the single market or
customs union
customs union
Well done team leave you managed to turn the UK into a vassal state of the EU. Hope you are proud.
s off trying to criticise leavers regarding the UK potentially becoming a vassal state... Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff