How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 7)

[PositronicRay]

MDMetal said:

Why's it take people so long to understand that people want out, MPs seem to be focused on the short term impacts instead of believing that a large number of people were voting with a longer term view?
.

And that me old China is the dichotomy, a straw pole of my friend's and aquintancies reveals roughly 50/50. Of those people some are okay to compromise either way, some are not.

I know leavers who would like to retain the four freedoms, and remainers who'd like to restrict FOM.

Opinion ain't as clear cut as some would have you believe.

[gooner1]

chrispmartha said:

And Tim Martin from Wetherspoons? I mean what could he possibly gain from banging on about Leaving and posting this through letterboxes?

At least he used his own ££££££££, and not 9 million of ours.

[amusingduck]

How can Airbus leave the UK because of Brexit, didn't they leave the UK because of the Euro?

[Vaud]

amusingduck said:

How can Airbus leave the UK because of Brexit, didn't they leave the UK because of the Euro?

To be fair they are not talking about removing existing investments. Just carefully considering incremental investments.

I know of many investments in the UK that have been delayed until there is clarity on Brexit. The economy is doing OK, but I think it would have performed even better without this continuing uncertainty.

[Vanden Saab]

amusingduck said:

How can Airbus leave the UK because of Brexit, didn't they leave the UK because of the Euro?

Good post

[Tuna]

bhstewie said:

More positive news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229

Airbus gets rolled out around every crunch point to helpfully suggest we do what's best for the EU. They thought we should join the Euro, thought we should vote Remain, think we should not go for 'no deal'.

Why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

[Vanden Saab]

Vaud said:

amusingduck said:

How can Airbus leave the UK because of Brexit, didn't they leave the UK because of the Euro?

To be fair they are not talking about removing existing investments. Just carefully considering incremental investments.

I know of many investments in the UK that have been delayed until there is clarity on Brexit. The economy is doing OK, but I think it would have performed even better without this continuing uncertainty.

Spot on if only we could leave at the end of March. Then everybody could get on with their lives while our politicians sort out the FTA. Remind me again who wants to extend Art 50.

[p1stonhead]

Tuna said:

bhstewie said:

More positive news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229

Airbus gets rolled out around every crunch point to helpfully suggest we do what's best for the EU. They thought we should join the Euro, thought we should vote Remain, think we should not go for 'no deal'.

Why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

They dont? They have their own and their workers interests at heart. Some are UK workers.

[Piha]

Tuna said:

bhstewie said:

More positive news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229

Airbus gets rolled out around every crunch point to helpfully suggest we do what's best for the EU. They thought we should join the Euro, thought we should vote Remain, think we should not go for 'no deal'.

Why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

When one considers Dyson demanded the UK join the Euro, then why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

[Welshbeef]

The A380 and A400 and the rampant success of the Dreamliner plus the new 747 replacement are smashing Airbus our of the park.

[Tuna]

And in other news...

The People's Vote have officially announced they aren't going to table an amendment to get a People's Vote.

I'm sure the usual suspects will be along to tell us that support for the People's Vote hasn't fizzled out, and that they definitely do have lots of support for it in Parliament, and they certainly are going to save us all from Brexit any moment now.

Maybe watching George Osborne and Tony Blair (together at last!) broadcasting live from the expensive sunny slopes of Davos finally convinced people that the People's Vote definitely wasn't the liberal elite trying to tell them what to do.

[Piha]

Welshbeef said:

The A380 and A400 and the rampant success of the Dreamliner plus the new 747 replacement are smashing Airbus our of the park.

Cool story bro

[SpeckledJim]

Vaud said:

amusingduck said:

How can Airbus leave the UK because of Brexit, didn't they leave the UK because of the Euro?

To be fair they are not talking about removing existing investments. Just carefully considering incremental investments.

I know of many investments in the UK that have been delayed until there is clarity on Brexit. The economy is doing OK, but I think it would have performed even better without this continuing uncertainty.

Once it's settled, the economy is going to go UP!?

Hell's teeth, we're going to need a lot of anti-depressants through Dover - there's a lot of people in here who have invested all of their emotional capital in being proved correct about this all being an abject disaster.

If it's not a disaster at all, they're going to need our help and support (thoughts and prayers) at this difficult time!

[amusingduck]

Tuna said:

And in other news...

The People's Vote have officially announced they aren't going to table an amendment to get a People's Vote.

I'm sure the usual suspects will be along to tell us that support for the People's Vote hasn't fizzled out, and that they definitely do have lots of support for it in Parliament, and they certainly are going to save us all from Brexit any moment now.

Maybe watching George Osborne and Tony Blair (together at last!) broadcasting live from the expensive sunny slopes of Davos finally convinced people that the People's Vote definitely wasn't the liberal elite trying to tell them what to do.

I think a lot of the blame can be apportioned to Helicopter123. If only he'd tried just that little bit harder to will a peoples vote into existance, it would have happened.

Oh well

[Sway]

Digga said:

Balmoral said:

Apparently the Airbus bloke clarified a few things he said three minutes after he said them according to SKY, not wanting brexit is a given, but his main beef is with the negotiations on both sides and the prospect of no deal, both sides need to step up.

All of which is fair comment.

It is.

It's also a tad naive.

What bilateral negotiations the EU (or pretty much anyone at that level) have been involved in have wrapped up early?

[Tuna]

Piha said:

When one considers Dyson demanded the UK join the Euro, then why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

I'm not sure I've ever claimed Dyson has our interests at heart. Nice try though.

I'm not sure when Remainers will understand that large corporates do not actually give one stuff about the well being of the country they're in, or their workers beyond having a cheap and reliable source of labour. Have you not figured out that the same people who are currently telling us that being in the EU is the best thing evah are the same people who were previously fighting globalisation - a cause that has gone curiously quiet over the last few years? You can't actually fight both, because the EU is specifically about nurturing an environment where the worst excesses of globalisation can thrive. That Airbus is rolled out as a cheerleader for Remain is particularly embarrassing.

[chrispmartha]

Tuna said:

bhstewie said:

More positive news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229

Why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

It's beyond you because no one has actually said that

They have the companies interests at heart, so they will do what's best for the company, the fact that what's best for the company could be or not be the best for the country is the actual point worth discussing isn't it?

Do you think Timmy Wetherspoon really cares about the UK interests with his pro brexit stuff, or Dyson, or any of the others.

[Robertj21a]

MDMetal said:

Why's it take people so long to understand that people want out, MPs seem to be focused on the short term impacts instead of believing that a large number of people were voting with a longer term view?

Does anyone who voted leave seriously think the day after we leave it'll be milk and honey? Remainers and mp's seem to constantly say people were lied to that this would be the case but I've yet to meet a single real world person who thought that. Things maybe bumpy but there was a move to a long term view, wasn't that the point of a referendum to ask a question which affects us long term without clouded short term political nonsense?

All of this talk of people not knowing what they voted for is just plain daft, people voted to leave, most people have a broadish view of what that means not a tight definition. Let's not forget that generally in referendums the status quo is usually more attractive as well, people rarely vote for a shot in the dark unless there's a strong feeling. All of that and yet there's still a daily list of people who believe they know better than the person voting. The question wasn't about what was better or right it was about what people want.

Nice to see a sensible post on here.

[anonymous-user]

Welshbeef said:

The A380 and A400 and the rampant success of the Dreamliner plus the new 747 replacement are smashing Airbus our of the park.

Shows how much you know when you quote two Airbus programmes that are over 15 years old when the A320 family (NEO / XLR / UXLR) and the A350 is the fastest selling A/C family ever and including the new A220 (Bombardier) we delivered over 800 a/c last year, the highest ever.

The 747 isn't being directly replaced, there is a new -8 variant, as neither Airbus nor Boeing see a market for X-Large ac.

Brexit has already cost Airbus 10's of millions, with no level of certainty, you can understand the frustration!

We have around over 10,000 eployees in the UK (direct), plus sub contractors, supply chain, external contracts, etc.

Whilst Brexit wouldn't mean the immediate closure of the plants, if we do not get the next generation wing (circa 2025) then it will be the beginning of the end for manufacturing (Airbus) in the UK.

[Pan Pan Pan]

p1stonhead said:

Tuna said:

bhstewie said:

More positive news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229

Airbus gets rolled out around every crunch point to helpfully suggest we do what's best for the EU. They thought we should join the Euro, thought we should vote Remain, think we should not go for 'no deal'.

Why anyone thinks they actually have our country's best interests at heart is beyond me.

They dont? They have their own and their workers interests at heart. Some are UK workers.

There are 800 000 UK nationals working in the EU, whereas 2.15 million EU nationals are working in the UK. A friends son was working for Airbus, and when there was the notion of a slight glitch in sales, he, plus some of his UK buddies were given the sack, so that they could hold onto less skilled but local workers What should the UK similarly do to show that it has UK workers interests at heart in this matter? It seems to be the case that the EU can do anything it likes to protect its workers interests, but it is not OK if the UK tries to do the same.