Farage's March To Leave
Discussion
captain_cynic said:
I know you're being sarcastic... but sometimes sarcasm is closer to the truth than people are comfortable with.
Outside the EU, the UK/US power balance will tilt in the favour of the US. Heavily. Brexiteer morons speak of a "dictator" in Brussels, they clearly don't know what one is, let alone have met the one from Washington.
The US will introduce it's laws into the UK by means of trade treaties. Unlike the EU, we won't get a say in their formation and parliament won't even get the opportunity to discuss them, let alone veto them. I've seen this happen to multiple countries where the US holds sway.
What is the UK so desperate to import and export with the USA that our government would sign away our independence in trade treaties for?Outside the EU, the UK/US power balance will tilt in the favour of the US. Heavily. Brexiteer morons speak of a "dictator" in Brussels, they clearly don't know what one is, let alone have met the one from Washington.
The US will introduce it's laws into the UK by means of trade treaties. Unlike the EU, we won't get a say in their formation and parliament won't even get the opportunity to discuss them, let alone veto them. I've seen this happen to multiple countries where the US holds sway.
Surely anything the USA can sell us we can make ourselves and support domestic production?
And vice versa, whatever we sold them, employ those people to make what we will no longer buy from them.
survivalist said:
Interesting, but also damaging. An alternative viewpoint would be the reason that parliament is in such turmoil is because the voting element of the electorate is so evenly split. I know that those who want to leave trumpet the ‘victory’ but the reality is it just reveals the split in the country.
In reality a repeated failing of governments to address social and economic issues, leading to a very uneven distribution of wealth. You can blame it on the EU, but in reality it’s a combination of capitalism and globalisation.
Not sure how backing Farage as an MEP will help, but sure that there will be a huge amount of vitriol and identification of a common enemy that will make certain types feel better.
i don't put the blame for any of that on the eu. trouble is without 100% accountability for our own political class in every aspect it leaves them the "because eu" excuse. In reality a repeated failing of governments to address social and economic issues, leading to a very uneven distribution of wealth. You can blame it on the EU, but in reality it’s a combination of capitalism and globalisation.
Not sure how backing Farage as an MEP will help, but sure that there will be a huge amount of vitriol and identification of a common enemy that will make certain types feel better.
i've said it before, but for me the situation has now gone way beyond the referendum.politicians all but ignoring the result of a democratic referendum is the biggest constitutional crisis in my lifetime. i have heard on several occasions the phrase "no brexit" mentioned by senior politicians including may. that is not on,at all. they have no one to blame for the current situation bar themselves and their ineptitude.
Bill said:
More like ground chop* That's £10 each from 75,000 people...
*For clarity, this is a reference to waves. Not gammon.
The Guardian is going to town: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com...
she seems very unhappy.i almost feel compelled to send her a bunch of flowers to cheer her up, almost.*For clarity, this is a reference to waves. Not gammon.
The Guardian is going to town: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com...
Thorodin said:
Well it would be but for the dirty tricks brigade out in force -bound to happen as they now have nowhere to go. Farage's new lot added to UKIP will gain more seats in a GE than Tories. It's happening all over EU (today's Spectator is, er, spectacular) insofar as France and posturing Madame Macron go. Why doesn't someone start a movement to divest them all of their 'honourable' misnomer.
i have no idea how well they will do, but given the support for ukip pre referendum announcement and what has happened since, i strongly suspect they will do a lot better than many think. i can certainly see farage in parliament next time he stands. will be plenty people feeling a bit silly after he failed the last time knowing the tories had to break the rules to beat him. i doubt they have the money in the kitty to do the same again.given the first time i have seen mention of his new party on the msm was today, it will be interesting to see how much they raise in the next ten days.Edited by Thorodin on Friday 12th April 21:25
He's being very careful as in a BBC TV interview yesterday. When asked if A. Banks had donated to the party he said a definite 'No' seven times until in desperation he said to the interviewer 'You are just not getting this are you? We can carry on like this as long as you like'. Very sensitive but not in the least defensive. Chutzpah. His presence in 2016 resulted in tables turning over, not bad for a non-elected (at home) politician. He's about to do the same again.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
No, it really is parliament versus the people.
No party has ever achieved anything like 52% or 17.4 million votes in an election. Blair achieved 43% and 11 million in his landslide 1997 victory. Even taking only Tory and Labour it was well under 60%. About 58/42.
The status quo, backed by a successful government one year into its term in times of economic growth really should have got 60% plus vote to Remain.
It's not something you will fix by subsidising rural broadband and completing the Skegness bypass. People don't want to be ruled by unelected politicians committed to a European union. They voted against it in astonishing numbers which dwarf any general election victory in modern times, and are being betrayed utterly and completely by a political class who think they know best while very publicly proving otherwise at every opportunity.
By this logic people also voted to remain in 'record numbers', hence the point about the country being split and the polititions being scared to jump one way or the other.No party has ever achieved anything like 52% or 17.4 million votes in an election. Blair achieved 43% and 11 million in his landslide 1997 victory. Even taking only Tory and Labour it was well under 60%. About 58/42.
The status quo, backed by a successful government one year into its term in times of economic growth really should have got 60% plus vote to Remain.
It's not something you will fix by subsidising rural broadband and completing the Skegness bypass. People don't want to be ruled by unelected politicians committed to a European union. They voted against it in astonishing numbers which dwarf any general election victory in modern times, and are being betrayed utterly and completely by a political class who think they know best while very publicly proving otherwise at every opportunity.
T-195 said:
Team Leave may have won last time around. More Remain voters would have voted if they hadn't been convinced by "pollsters"
that they were already going to win.
You sound just like Jawknee, Trollydolly or whatever he calls himself now...although the nutter profile kinda fits as well that they were already going to win.
alfie2244 said:
T-195 said:
Team Leave may have won last time around. More Remain voters would have voted if they hadn't been convinced by "pollsters"
that they were already going to win.
You sound just like Jawknee, Trollydolly or whatever he calls himself now...although the nutter profile kinda fits as well that they were already going to win.
to understand what the EU is and how it has treated the UK, and possibility just to spite parliament for its kick in the teeth
to the democratic vote, and the colossal constant lies. And that's also an assumption, just like the one above.
did you vote ?Pastor Of Muppets said:
alfie2244 said:
T-195 said:
Team Leave may have won last time around. More Remain voters would have voted if they hadn't been convinced by "pollsters"
that they were already going to win.
You sound just like Jawknee, Trollydolly or whatever he calls himself now...although the nutter profile kinda fits as well that they were already going to win.
to understand what the EU is and how it has treated the UK, and possibility just to spite parliament for its kick in the teeth
to the democratic vote, and the colossal constant lies. And that's also an assumption, just like the one above.
Pastor Of Muppets said:
The counter argument to that assumption is that even more people will vote to leave because many more have now come
to understand what the EU is and how it has treated the UK, and possibility just to spite parliament for its kick in the teeth
to the democratic vote, and the colossal constant lies. And that's also an assumption, just like the one above.
People able to reason for themselves know the EU is a useful construct for its Member States and you would have to be a bit retarded to believe the EU has treated the UK badly since, let's face it, any normally-functioning person can see the UK's problems are entirely internal; and entirely 1st World issues at that, since the UK has done very well overall, relatively-speaking. Obviously, as a reasonably intelligent individual, you agree. to understand what the EU is and how it has treated the UK, and possibility just to spite parliament for its kick in the teeth
to the democratic vote, and the colossal constant lies. And that's also an assumption, just like the one above.
The EU is - and always has been - just a scapegoat for many who want to find excuses for whatever they dislike in Life and those who would wish to manipulate them.
I'm sure you understand the meaning of Democracy too, and so realise why Brexit hasn't yet been delivered, why it will be Brexit 'Lite' if it ever is to appease the minority who really care about Brexit as opposed to those who were simply caught up in a pathetic self-created 'Class War' , and why it is actually more democratic to scrap it entirely.
El stovey said:
There’s some awful brexit party advert with our Nige standing by the white cliffs of Dover (to repel the invasion) and interviews with the 3 young ethnic brexiteers they’ve got.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Why 69? - not, say 67, or 68, or 73, or 76 or any other 'old' age?Usually I find 'ageists' don't target a specific age.
Not implying you are an 'ageist', just guessing! I'm sure you'll say if you're not.
Is there a special 69 year old that's f
ked up you life a tad - or was 69 just a random 'anyway up' age? 
dandarez said:
El stovey said:
There’s some awful brexit party advert with our Nige standing by the white cliffs of Dover (to repel the invasion) and interviews with the 3 young ethnic brexiteers they’ve got.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Why 69? - not, say 67, or 68, or 73, or 76 or any other 'old' age?Usually I find 'ageists' don't target a specific age.
Not implying you are an 'ageist', just guessing! I'm sure you'll say if you're not.
Is there a special 69 year old that's f
ked up you life a tad - or was 69 just a random 'anyway up' age? Showing again Farage trying to create an image of his party and supporters at odds with the reality of his supporters.
El stovey said:
dandarez said:
El stovey said:
There’s some awful brexit party advert with our Nige standing by the white cliffs of Dover (to repel the invasion) and interviews with the 3 young ethnic brexiteers they’ve got.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Then you see the Facebook advert above and the crowd are all 69 year old white people.
Why 69? - not, say 67, or 68, or 73, or 76 or any other 'old' age?Usually I find 'ageists' don't target a specific age.
Not implying you are an 'ageist', just guessing! I'm sure you'll say if you're not.
Is there a special 69 year old that's f
ked up you life a tad - or was 69 just a random 'anyway up' age? Showing again Farage trying to create an image of his party and supporters at odds with the reality of his supporters.
As 60% is enough to depict Leavers as exclusively 65+, that must also mean that Remainers must be depicted as exclusively Pro-Immigration (79%), Globalisation (62%), Green movement (62%), Feminism (60%) and Multiculturalism (71%)
Or if the Ashcroft poll isn't your bag, and you prefer crowds to make conclusions, I can quite easily post up some Remain crowds that are massively white and old.
What a load of guff, why do you place such value on individual characteristics?
Odd how people get so indignant about the age thing when the stats appear to back it up.
Incidentally I heard someone the other day, forget who but someone stats related, suggesting the stats show that among the over 85's (I think it was 85) the "Just get us out" vote drops off because you're into the demographic that lived through WWII enough to remember it.
It was an interview on the radio on the drive home so I don't have a link.
Incidentally I heard someone the other day, forget who but someone stats related, suggesting the stats show that among the over 85's (I think it was 85) the "Just get us out" vote drops off because you're into the demographic that lived through WWII enough to remember it.
It was an interview on the radio on the drive home so I don't have a link.
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: Odd how people get so indignant about the age thing when the stats appear to back it up.
Incidentally I heard someone the other day, forget who but someone stats related, suggesting the stats show that among the over 85's (I think it was 85) the "Just get us out" vote drops off because you're into the demographic that lived through WWII enough to remember it.
It was an interview on the radio on the drive home so I don't have a link.
I don't have a problem with people referencing statistics and trying to gleam some useful information from it, as you've done above.Incidentally I heard someone the other day, forget who but someone stats related, suggesting the stats show that among the over 85's (I think it was 85) the "Just get us out" vote drops off because you're into the demographic that lived through WWII enough to remember it.
It was an interview on the radio on the drive home so I don't have a link.
Often there is no useful information, just lazy stereotype smearing which achieves nothing other than pushing those that you want to convince further from your desired outcome.
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