Ethiopian plane crash
Discussion
saaby93 said:
David87 said:
saaby93 said:
How many have there been?
This is the second 737 MAX 8 to crash, both of which have killed everyone on board. In the same timeframe, there has been nothing comparable with Airbus A320neo aircraft, for example.2 isnt that big a number.
alfaman said:
It IS significant and highly unusual ...2 crashes in short succession on a newly released series of commercial jet aircraft.. especially where there seem to be no exogenous causal factors ...
hundreds of max in service though... 2 can be coincidence? 3 certainly make it a thing.alfaman said:
It IS significant and highly unusual ...2 crashes in short succession on a newly released series of commercial jet aircraft.. especially where there seem to be no exogenous causal factors ...
Depends how you do probability theory2 now and none later could be quite low
1 every few years can be higher than that.
However they'll be looking at what went wrong in each one to try to make it close to zero from now on
73
They do now - and it IS 2019. Just because something is rare doesn't mean it's impossible.
When the new generation 737s (i.e.the 300 - 400 series) were introduced, there were a couple of accidents blamed on what was called "uncommanded rudder hard-over" - something which had not been an issue with the original Series 100 and 200 737s. So yes, every so often, a change to what was a fundamentally sound design can throw up some unexpected problem.
Pommy said:
Eric Mc said:
Back in the 1960s there were spate of 727 accidents not long after they first entered service.
But in 2019 planes crashes involving brand new aircraft don't happen that often.When the new generation 737s (i.e.the 300 - 400 series) were introduced, there were a couple of accidents blamed on what was called "uncommanded rudder hard-over" - something which had not been an issue with the original Series 100 and 200 737s. So yes, every so often, a change to what was a fundamentally sound design can throw up some unexpected problem.
The lion air fault was due to the stall protection system activating and the trim gave a solid 7 seconds of down trim. Not only would the system need a lot of strength to pull back against the force, but unlike the 737 NGX (700/800) powering the trim in the opposite direction would not haunt the input. The only way of doing it is the stablisised cutout switches on the throttle pedestal - not a lot of time to establish the fault before it chucks a pilot into the ground.
None of this would be bad if a)Boeing has told airlines/pilots about the system and difference and b)the system did notcross check for sensor error.
Time will tell whether this crash is a repeat or something different.
None of this would be bad if a)Boeing has told airlines/pilots about the system and difference and b)the system did notcross check for sensor error.
Time will tell whether this crash is a repeat or something different.
surveyor said:
None of this would be bad if a)Boeing has told airlines/pilots about the system and difference and b)the system did notcross check for sensor error.
These type rating courses (for pilots going into the max) are absolutely rubbish now especially if you’ve already got a 737 rating.Boeing does tell you about the stall protection system but it’s just a little paragraph with some acronyms covering themselves legally.
The ground school is done by CBT which involves some dull robot telling you about the aircraft whilst you click the next button. It’s so inadequate and sold to get people through in the minimum time.
The computer voice in the training has even had to be slowed down so the course meets a minimum length specified by the regulator.
El stovey said:
surveyor said:
None of this would be bad if a)Boeing has told airlines/pilots about the system and difference and b)the system did notcross check for sensor error.
These type rating courses (for pilots going into the max) are absolutely rubbish now especially if you’ve already got a 737 rating.Boeing does tell you about the stall protection system but it’s just a little paragraph with some acronyms covering themselves legally.
The ground school is done by CBT which involves some dull robot telling you about the aircraft whilst you click the next button. It’s so inadequate and sold to get people through in the minimum time.
The computer voice in the training has even had to be slowed down so the course meets a minimum length specified by the regulator.
saaby93 said:
David87 said:
saaby93 said:
How many have there been?
This is the second 737 MAX 8 to crash, both of which have killed everyone on board. In the same timeframe, there has been nothing comparable with Airbus A320neo aircraft, for example.2 isnt that big a number.
ruprechtmonkeyboy said:
Statistically it's probably the worst start to a new aircraft in living memory. Plus they both appeared to have crashed at the same stage of flight. It's not good!
I dunno, aren't the comet crashes regarded as setting back British airliner production and allowing the yanks to take over the market?El stovey said:
PositronicRay said:
To those in the know.
Would you be concerned if your next trip was on one of these? Or wouldn't you give it a second thought?
I wouldn’t be concerned, anyone operating a Max will be looking at these “features” very closely. Would you be concerned if your next trip was on one of these? Or wouldn't you give it a second thought?
t going to convince me otherwise.
Teddy Lop said:
ruprechtmonkeyboy said:
Statistically it's probably the worst start to a new aircraft in living memory. Plus they both appeared to have crashed at the same stage of flight. It's not good!
I dunno, aren't the comet crashes regarded as setting back British airliner production and allowing the yanks to take over the market?Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff