Notre Dame on fire - looks pretty serious
Discussion
Ayahuasca said:
Roofless Toothless said:
Ayahuasca said:
Glad they managed to save the priceless national treasures - the crown of thorns, St Louis’ coat, the cockerel, the sacred white flag.
World War One, combined military and civilian deaths:France ... 1,397,000
U.K. ... ... 760,800
World War Two, combined military and civilian deaths:
France ... 600,000
U.K. ... ... 451,000
BTW, in WWII French military deaths were 200,000 compared to the UK’s 400,000, so whatever your point was, wasn’t.
Ayahuasca said:
Kittens dying...... lots
BTW, in WWII French military deaths were 200,000 compared to the UK’s 400,000, so whatever your point was, wasn’t.
Considering that the British were involved in the war for nearly six years, and the French were overrun six weeks after the German invasion of Western Europe started, to have lost 200,000 military personnel indicates to me that they did a fair bit of fighting before they ran up the "white flag". BTW, in WWII French military deaths were 200,000 compared to the UK’s 400,000, so whatever your point was, wasn’t.
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
Roofless Toothless said:
Ayahuasca said:
Kittens dying...... lots
BTW, in WWII French military deaths were 200,000 compared to the UK’s 400,000, so whatever your point was, wasn’t.
Considering that the British were involved in the war for nearly six years, and the French were overrun six weeks after the German invasion of Western Europe started, to have lost 200,000 military personnel indicates to me that they did a fair bit of fighting before they ran up the "white flag". BTW, in WWII French military deaths were 200,000 compared to the UK’s 400,000, so whatever your point was, wasn’t.
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
of epic proportions and I rarely hear and big fking thank you from the French.Secondly - many Brits and other allies did fight, and die, with the resistance, trained then, equipped them and took even greater risks than they did. What the SOE did was simply remarkable.
No one likes the French, even the French don't like the French.
[quote=Roofless Toothless]
Considering that the British were involved in the war for nearly six years, and the French were overrun six weeks after the German invasion of Western Europe started, to have lost 200,000 military personnel indicates to me that they did a fair bit of fighting before they ran up the "white flag".
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
Don't stress about it Roofless,
I spent 20years in the UK as a frenchman and I have heard so many of those village idiots. The most beautiful thing about it was that most of the time someone came out with such comments, there were always someone coming after and apologising for their lack of maners and so on . It never really bothered me unless if they were rude.
The most respectful people I have ever talked with about the war in the uk were ex and current military personnel. Most of them had an unbelievable knowledge of past conflicts and spoke very highly of the resistance.
I am currently working with 2 ex royal marines... best guys I have ever met.
Considering that the British were involved in the war for nearly six years, and the French were overrun six weeks after the German invasion of Western Europe started, to have lost 200,000 military personnel indicates to me that they did a fair bit of fighting before they ran up the "white flag".
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
Don't stress about it Roofless,
I spent 20years in the UK as a frenchman and I have heard so many of those village idiots. The most beautiful thing about it was that most of the time someone came out with such comments, there were always someone coming after and apologising for their lack of maners and so on . It never really bothered me unless if they were rude.
The most respectful people I have ever talked with about the war in the uk were ex and current military personnel. Most of them had an unbelievable knowledge of past conflicts and spoke very highly of the resistance.
I am currently working with 2 ex royal marines... best guys I have ever met.
Roofless Toothless said:
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance?
Exactly so.Had we shared a land border with Germany, we would have been very quickly overrun.
It's amusing (to some) to brand the French as cowards - they are very far from that. Just as one example, we were extremely lucky not to have retreating German armies rounding up villagers across our land and executing them.
mx5nut said:
I feel genuinely bad for the people posting in this thread who seem disappointed that it wasn't a terror attack they could use to further their anti muslim/immigrant agenda.
You forgot the usual anti-French rhetoric.Something oddly powerful about watching a building like that in flames.
RemyMartin81D said:
French troops faught like a bd in both wars, especially in Verdun, a truly horrific battle or the fighting for fort vaux.
Indeed, and Verdun was horrific. d in both wars, especially in Verdun, a truly horrific battle or the fighting for fort vaux.But back to Paris, and I stand to be corrected, it surrendered to the Germans without any fighting in 1940, and it was surrendered by the Germans, again without any fighting, in1945. Two surrenders, no fighting. A good thing for ancient buildings I am sure all agree - not too many cathedrals survived in Stalingrad.
Roofless Toothless said:
Considering that the British were involved in the war for nearly six years, and the French were overrun six weeks after the German invasion of Western Europe started, to have lost 200,000 military personnel indicates to me that they did a fair bit of fighting before they ran up the "white flag".
How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
As do I, on a U.S. forum that I subscribe to, an American posted that the Parisian firefighters would probably surrender rather than keep fighting the flames.How long would we have lasted were it not for the protection of the Channel? How many of us would have had the guts to fight in the Resistance? I really get irritated by these thoughtless slurs against the French.
A French-Canadian replied that the Yank would do well to remember the Marquis de Lafayette, whose troops fought side by side with the Continental Army, plus the French Navy, whose presence off Yorktown VA in 1781, prevented Cornwallis English Army from escaping, effectively ending the Revolutionary War.
Otherwise, he said, the Yank may have been living today in a land called Southern Canada.
BlackLabel said:
I see they’ve already raised over a billion euros from donations - and it’s only been a couple of days. Remarkable stuff.
One wonders if that billion should be spent on more worthy causes? Or is the historic and aesthetic significance of this building worth it to France? If it is, why doesnt the state fund it, put the jobless to work labouring, create a scheme to train craftsmen etc... Discuss....warch said:
I work in the heritage industry so I feel like I have an inside track on this sort of thing.
Old buildings often lack any kind of fire safety systems, they were never designed to incorporate them and it is often regarded as counter productive to have them installed. Unlike a modern building there isn't fire retardant cladding or insulation or any kind of design to limit the spread of a fire.
The building in question was undergoing external repairs at the time. This is normally when old buildings are rather vulnerable, you have all kinds of cutting, electrically powered installations like lights and material handling and hot works like leading on the roof.
Now, it could have been terrorists, but I wouldn't automatically assume that unless there was convincing evidence that this was the case. Deliberate fires set by people in historic buildings are much more often caused by someone trying to remove an expensive or difficult to develop building, often in a prime development location, or some hoping to claim on the insurance.
Uppark House springs to mind.Old buildings often lack any kind of fire safety systems, they were never designed to incorporate them and it is often regarded as counter productive to have them installed. Unlike a modern building there isn't fire retardant cladding or insulation or any kind of design to limit the spread of a fire.
The building in question was undergoing external repairs at the time. This is normally when old buildings are rather vulnerable, you have all kinds of cutting, electrically powered installations like lights and material handling and hot works like leading on the roof.
Now, it could have been terrorists, but I wouldn't automatically assume that unless there was convincing evidence that this was the case. Deliberate fires set by people in historic buildings are much more often caused by someone trying to remove an expensive or difficult to develop building, often in a prime development location, or some hoping to claim on the insurance.
On the matter of fire safety systems, apparently there was a sophisticated detection system in place, it was on, but when the alarm sounded it was determined to be a false alarm and silenced; 30 minutes later...
biggbn said:
One wonders if that billion should be spent on more worthy causes? Or is the historic and aesthetic significance of this building worth it to France? If it is, why doesnt the state fund it, put the jobless to work labouring, create a scheme to train craftsmen etc... Discuss....
difficult one isnt it. on one hand the immediate thought is that it should be rebuild immediately to hell with the cost. on the other hand its disgusting people are dying and we cannot help them as quickly. my view is the church should stump up most of the money. if they taxed the likes of amazon, google etc they could probably afford to repair it and help people..
petemurphy said:
difficult one isnt it. on one hand the immediate thought is that it should be rebuild immediately to hell with the cost. on the other hand its disgusting people are dying and we cannot help them as quickly. my view is the church should stump up most of the money.
if they taxed the likes of amazon, google etc they could probably afford to repair it and help people..
Shouldn't the church we help people first and then rebuild? They have plenty of land and assets to sell.if they taxed the likes of amazon, google etc they could probably afford to repair it and help people..
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