45th President of the United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 7)
Discussion
captain_cynic said:
Also they need the case against Trump to be water tight. We cant let Trump get off on a technicality.
Unindicted co-conspirator in election fraud that sent Cohen to prison is waiting for him, oh and Cohen was jailed for lying to investigators to protect trump (sounds familiar)trump and family have already been found guilty of charity fraud and got off lightly
There's two cases of defamation against him going through the courts. Summer Zervos is well established, will be heard in January, and E Jean Carroll.
Then there's SDNY, New Yorks tax evasion investigation, after the story of how trump senior gifted money to trump, how trump inflated values to get bank loans (which manafort was jailed for), how trump devalued to avoid taxes, theres still investigations into how his inauguration money was used, the probe of Deutsche Bank, which loaned Trump more than $2 billion over the course of 20 years....
just off the top of my head - there's actually much more waiting for him...
stevesingo said:
There are some interesting observations to be made with all of this. Firstly, the Dems can't hide their partisan nature in everything, even Schiff can't. I do sometimes think they are not doing themselves any favours in lowering themselves to the level of the Reps. Schiff didn't need to mention Trump's critical tweet today, it was just theatre which served no legal purpose in the proceedings. He just couldn't help himself, but could have ended up looking petty and being theatrical and that undermines the gravity of the situation and gives the Reps something to criticise Schiff for and point to the witch hunt, distract from the purpose. It is the latest of many snipes which add nothing the the legal proceedings. To have credibility, you need to be above this.
Secondly, I can't help but think Trump has set the standards for the US political system for the years to come if not for ever. His conduct has highlighted what a President can do. He may not get away will all of it, but he has exposed the loopholes in the system. If a Dem becomes the next president, will the first executive order be to close down the opportunities to do similar? I'm not so sure. It is all about power and the lot of them crave it, and when they have it, the don't want to let go. It is interesting when in times of election, politicians always say "when we/I am in power we will...". Poor choice of words which belies their hunger for power, not their desire to take responsibility and be accountable for that.
Sorry I disagree. Witness intimidation, which it was, is an impeachable offence. Schiff was right to call it out, as it happened, during a hearing about trumps impeachment.Secondly, I can't help but think Trump has set the standards for the US political system for the years to come if not for ever. His conduct has highlighted what a President can do. He may not get away will all of it, but he has exposed the loopholes in the system. If a Dem becomes the next president, will the first executive order be to close down the opportunities to do similar? I'm not so sure. It is all about power and the lot of them crave it, and when they have it, the don't want to let go. It is interesting when in times of election, politicians always say "when we/I am in power we will...". Poor choice of words which belies their hunger for power, not their desire to take responsibility and be accountable for that.
Baby Shark doo doo doo doo said:
Penelope Stopit said:
Is this Trump chap still in power?
Surprising considering many said he’d be gone in a matter of months 
He's certainly been a historic president, for all the wrong reasons
Stepping into this discussion very late, but as a Brit living in the USA, I have a few views on the current situation.
There are those who feel alienated and left behind by America and given the issues with the last few presidents, feel disconnected to the whole political process. Where certain areas (such as the two coasts) have their own issues, they have grown considerably in the last 20 years in terms of wealth and prosperity, are always going to be naturally leaning towards the Dems. Those who are disconnected tend to lean towards the Reps.
However, where you have such a link between party and person (such as the president), it becomes a personal issue, rather than a political one. Trump has said some very nasty things over the years, but those who support him will most likely do so at all costs - to admit anything else becomes personal, especially when they have the perception of being left behind. The same is true for the other side also.
When this all gets wrapped up in conspiracy theories, rhetoric, social media and echo chambers, it becomes hard for people to separate the person from the politics and the truth. Given the current situation with these hearings, the Reps HAVE to support Trump no matter what. To not do so would undermine everything and hence the blind support and deflections that occur. Equally, the Dems HAVE to sink him to get anywhere. Who wins? No one. Who loses? Everyone.... its a rather stupid situation.
I will admit to living in California (Dem state) but I live in the country which is VERY Republican. So I have a very unusual view on things. I do not have the history that many natives have and hence my opinions will be clearly different. That doesnt make anyone wrong, but the baggage of years of blind support and almost the cult of personality has lead us to this place. There is a playbook that is being used (and has been since 2016) and from what I can see of what is happening in the UK, the exact same one is being used there - this is a warning!!! Politicians have always been sleazy, nasty, self opinionated liars - but its getting worse with more to loose than ever. I am afraid that this is the new norm and the UK is following suit.
And what is my guess on these hearings? I think Trump will survive, damaged and hurt, but will remain. He even has a shot at winning in 2020 too, if he can pull together something cohesive as a strategy. However, if the US economy falls into contraction and then recession, he's doomed. All indicators are showing this and if the average person on the street is impacted, the Reps are lost and will be likely doomed to another 8 years in the desert. In the meantime though, it makes interesting watching and as a conspiracy theory watcher, makes for great YouTube watching. There are some really crazy nuts out there....
There are those who feel alienated and left behind by America and given the issues with the last few presidents, feel disconnected to the whole political process. Where certain areas (such as the two coasts) have their own issues, they have grown considerably in the last 20 years in terms of wealth and prosperity, are always going to be naturally leaning towards the Dems. Those who are disconnected tend to lean towards the Reps.
However, where you have such a link between party and person (such as the president), it becomes a personal issue, rather than a political one. Trump has said some very nasty things over the years, but those who support him will most likely do so at all costs - to admit anything else becomes personal, especially when they have the perception of being left behind. The same is true for the other side also.
When this all gets wrapped up in conspiracy theories, rhetoric, social media and echo chambers, it becomes hard for people to separate the person from the politics and the truth. Given the current situation with these hearings, the Reps HAVE to support Trump no matter what. To not do so would undermine everything and hence the blind support and deflections that occur. Equally, the Dems HAVE to sink him to get anywhere. Who wins? No one. Who loses? Everyone.... its a rather stupid situation.
I will admit to living in California (Dem state) but I live in the country which is VERY Republican. So I have a very unusual view on things. I do not have the history that many natives have and hence my opinions will be clearly different. That doesnt make anyone wrong, but the baggage of years of blind support and almost the cult of personality has lead us to this place. There is a playbook that is being used (and has been since 2016) and from what I can see of what is happening in the UK, the exact same one is being used there - this is a warning!!! Politicians have always been sleazy, nasty, self opinionated liars - but its getting worse with more to loose than ever. I am afraid that this is the new norm and the UK is following suit.
And what is my guess on these hearings? I think Trump will survive, damaged and hurt, but will remain. He even has a shot at winning in 2020 too, if he can pull together something cohesive as a strategy. However, if the US economy falls into contraction and then recession, he's doomed. All indicators are showing this and if the average person on the street is impacted, the Reps are lost and will be likely doomed to another 8 years in the desert. In the meantime though, it makes interesting watching and as a conspiracy theory watcher, makes for great YouTube watching. There are some really crazy nuts out there....
For the second day in a row, President Trump asked the Supreme Court on Friday to protect his personal and business financial records from disclosure, this time to a congressional committee.
Trump’s private lawyers asked Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. to put a hold on an appeals court decision that said the House Oversight and Reform Committee was within its rights to subpoena the information from Trump’s longtime accounting firm, Mazars USA.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law...
Trump’s private lawyers asked Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. to put a hold on an appeals court decision that said the House Oversight and Reform Committee was within its rights to subpoena the information from Trump’s longtime accounting firm, Mazars USA.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law...
trumps manipulated summary of the call he released today?
The rough transcript released Friday of an April phone call President Trump had with the incoming president of Ukraine bears little resemblance to the paragraph-long official summary that the White House released the day of the conversation.
https://apnews.com/2f3c9910e0a14ec08d6d76ed9314805...
The rough transcript released Friday of an April phone call President Trump had with the incoming president of Ukraine bears little resemblance to the paragraph-long official summary that the White House released the day of the conversation.
https://apnews.com/2f3c9910e0a14ec08d6d76ed9314805...
Byker28i said:
Sorry I disagree. Witness intimidation, which it was, is an impeachable offence. Schiff was right to call it out, as it happened, during a hearing about trumps impeachment.
He is being impeached for using US influence to bribe another nation for personal political gain. Witness intimidation s another impeachable act to start fresh proceedings on. The Dems will be banging on about this for days. It's a distraction.Gameface said:
Baby Shark doo doo doo doo said:
Surprising considering many said he’d be gone in a matter of months
Not sure anyone actually said that.It's been a source of amazement, and sinking disappointment, frankly, that somehow this clusterf
k has got as far as this.Having just caught up on the last few weeks of this thread it really is amazing how much the GOP are taking their plays straight out of the African dictator's handbook, and I do mean the GOP. A few pages ago it was asked why the GOP are standing behind trump* and the answer came that he's packed the courts with conservative judges. I'd argue it's more than than that.
Trump as a front man is disposable, a brightly coloured plastic coffee cup whose purpose will have been served so long as you have drunk the coffee (aka tax cuts and deregulation which if you take to their logical conclusion look a bit like Nigeria). The coffee itself has been on the brew since GWB, exhibit one being defunding the IRS (tl:dr - repuplicans keep slashing the IRS budget meaning billions in taxes remain uncollected, Obama started to repair the damage but I'm sure you'll be shocked to know that under Trump the IRS has again had its funding slashed) https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/...
'America first' is the thinking that went in to the aftermath of the Iraq war and we all know how well that's turned out. There's the cuts to environmental protections, various drinking water fiascos, the horrendous state of American telecoms, etc, etc, etc. The whole tea party movement of which Trump is the current apogee has roots that took hold long before 2016. What links this all together and why should it all come out now is the real question?
There won't be a comprehensive answer to that question until the data revolution is over and we're all long dead but I'd like to put forward one strand of thought from the realist school of geopolitics that says it's because the centre of the earth has shifted, to whit I give you this picture:
A few hundred years ago Brussels was just another city that the powers of France, Prussia, etc used as a node in their forever war because frankly the only important bit of the map went from Portugal to Russia (/me ducks the rotten tomatoes for being eurocentric but it's true, from the era of musket to rifle Europe was ascendant and Belgium was the middle of the important bit of the map so ended up being the battleground where world powers sorted their differences). That Brussels became the centre of European bureaucracy should tell us something about the pattern human evolution follows.
The rise of India and China puts a certain perspective on Trump's policy of ending what he calls the forever wars because the moment these wars stop Iraq becomes the centre of the map, Baghdad may yet be tomorrow's Brussels for a smaller world.
I understand if this sounds insane to you, after all if I had said to someone in 1900 that Brussels would be the centre of a unified Europe then I would have been laughed out of the room, however lets look at what the map says and what's actually happening. In Lebanon and Iraq right now we have mass protests demanding one thing, competence. The unrest that's been happening since the start of the Arab Spring is in the UK and US misrepresented and skewed horribly through our media who want to talk about extremists and end of the bell curve types but the real demand from the people is and always has been competence.
Should peace break out in the middle east then McKinder's heartland theory becomes reality and China for one are working very hard towards this reality with all their railroads and infrastructure projects.
There's some monkey nature stuff going on here that I don't understand but what I do know is that the geopolitical centre of gravity has moved. People nearer the centre of geopolitical gravity become more competent, the people further away from the centre of geopolitical gravity become less competent. I don't know how or why, answers on a postcard please.
What I do know is that the current zeitgeist in geopolitics where the next century is seen as being either American or Chinese is utter rubbish. Look to the heartland.
<><><>
Do feel free to throw grenades at the above post, I'm not sure it's right and am pretty much rambling to try and get my thoughts in order so yeah, disagree as much as you can, that'd be really helpful
<><<>
*Honestly would never have seen that little t as an insult until Byker pointed it out and I've spent half my life in England, no wonder Americans struggle. Might employ it myself on occasion but I'll put it in my pocket for now
Trump as a front man is disposable, a brightly coloured plastic coffee cup whose purpose will have been served so long as you have drunk the coffee (aka tax cuts and deregulation which if you take to their logical conclusion look a bit like Nigeria). The coffee itself has been on the brew since GWB, exhibit one being defunding the IRS (tl:dr - repuplicans keep slashing the IRS budget meaning billions in taxes remain uncollected, Obama started to repair the damage but I'm sure you'll be shocked to know that under Trump the IRS has again had its funding slashed) https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/...
'America first' is the thinking that went in to the aftermath of the Iraq war and we all know how well that's turned out. There's the cuts to environmental protections, various drinking water fiascos, the horrendous state of American telecoms, etc, etc, etc. The whole tea party movement of which Trump is the current apogee has roots that took hold long before 2016. What links this all together and why should it all come out now is the real question?
There won't be a comprehensive answer to that question until the data revolution is over and we're all long dead but I'd like to put forward one strand of thought from the realist school of geopolitics that says it's because the centre of the earth has shifted, to whit I give you this picture:
A few hundred years ago Brussels was just another city that the powers of France, Prussia, etc used as a node in their forever war because frankly the only important bit of the map went from Portugal to Russia (/me ducks the rotten tomatoes for being eurocentric but it's true, from the era of musket to rifle Europe was ascendant and Belgium was the middle of the important bit of the map so ended up being the battleground where world powers sorted their differences). That Brussels became the centre of European bureaucracy should tell us something about the pattern human evolution follows.
The rise of India and China puts a certain perspective on Trump's policy of ending what he calls the forever wars because the moment these wars stop Iraq becomes the centre of the map, Baghdad may yet be tomorrow's Brussels for a smaller world.
I understand if this sounds insane to you, after all if I had said to someone in 1900 that Brussels would be the centre of a unified Europe then I would have been laughed out of the room, however lets look at what the map says and what's actually happening. In Lebanon and Iraq right now we have mass protests demanding one thing, competence. The unrest that's been happening since the start of the Arab Spring is in the UK and US misrepresented and skewed horribly through our media who want to talk about extremists and end of the bell curve types but the real demand from the people is and always has been competence.
Should peace break out in the middle east then McKinder's heartland theory becomes reality and China for one are working very hard towards this reality with all their railroads and infrastructure projects.
There's some monkey nature stuff going on here that I don't understand but what I do know is that the geopolitical centre of gravity has moved. People nearer the centre of geopolitical gravity become more competent, the people further away from the centre of geopolitical gravity become less competent. I don't know how or why, answers on a postcard please.
What I do know is that the current zeitgeist in geopolitics where the next century is seen as being either American or Chinese is utter rubbish. Look to the heartland.
<><><>
Do feel free to throw grenades at the above post, I'm not sure it's right and am pretty much rambling to try and get my thoughts in order so yeah, disagree as much as you can, that'd be really helpful
<><<>
*Honestly would never have seen that little t as an insult until Byker pointed it out and I've spent half my life in England, no wonder Americans struggle. Might employ it myself on occasion but I'll put it in my pocket for now
Edited by Tartan Pixie on Saturday 16th November 00:01
Good news!
Trump Administration Releases Transparency Rule in Hospital Pricing: https://www.reddit.com/r/Economics/comments/dwrquw...
Credit where it's due and I think Trump genuinely has a bee in his bonnet about this but some transparency in hospital pricing is due to be introduced.
Still got another 2/3 of pricing to cut until America gets in to line with the rest of the civilized world but hey it's something?!?
Trump Administration Releases Transparency Rule in Hospital Pricing: https://www.reddit.com/r/Economics/comments/dwrquw...
Credit where it's due and I think Trump genuinely has a bee in his bonnet about this but some transparency in hospital pricing is due to be introduced.
Still got another 2/3 of pricing to cut until America gets in to line with the rest of the civilized world but hey it's something?!?
Totally off topic but as I was writing I stumbled across this you tube playlist that goes from the Baghdadies to George Carlin, Tchaikovsky, Ramones and the Hobbit.
I have no idea how I ended up here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtO1JzGCR4o&li...
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Also a big thanks to all contributors, Byker's updates and everybody's thoughts which is what makes it fun. Been a hectic few weeks so apologies for disappearing mid conversation a few weeks ago, just old folks n hospitals n stuff, nothing serious in the scheme of things.
Does look like the A1 and I might be becoming good friends though so any suggestion about good farm shops or roads while going from west (Glasgow) to east (Norfolk) would be appreciated. There's only so many times you can turn up with a pheasant pie from that farm shop on the A66 before it gets old.
I have no idea how I ended up here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtO1JzGCR4o&li...
<><><><>
Also a big thanks to all contributors, Byker's updates and everybody's thoughts which is what makes it fun. Been a hectic few weeks so apologies for disappearing mid conversation a few weeks ago, just old folks n hospitals n stuff, nothing serious in the scheme of things.
Does look like the A1 and I might be becoming good friends though so any suggestion about good farm shops or roads while going from west (Glasgow) to east (Norfolk) would be appreciated. There's only so many times you can turn up with a pheasant pie from that farm shop on the A66 before it gets old.
Edited by Tartan Pixie on Saturday 16th November 00:45
Tartan Pixie said:
Does look like the A1 and I might be becoming good friends though so any suggestion about good farm shops or roads while going from west (Glasgow) to east (Norfolk) would be appreciated. There's only so many times you can turn up with a pheasant pie from that farm shop on the A66 before it gets old.
McCaskies do good pies(and other meaty goodness) but not exactly enroute for you; Skelmorlie is a nice day out though.paulguitar said:
I am prepared to hold my hand up here and admit I thought he wouldn't last past 6 weeks, after the opening day 'crowd size' fiasco, and pretty much daily scandals thereafter.
It's been a source of amazement, and sinking disappointment, frankly, that somehow this clusterfk has got as far as this.
It is amazing, I guess I never realised quite how morally bankrupt the Republican Party is, I am not sure how America can recover from this sIt's been a source of amazement, and sinking disappointment, frankly, that somehow this clusterf
k has got as far as this.tshow or what will come next after the horrors of the last few years.Gameface said:
Baby Shark doo doo doo doo said:
Surprising considering many said he’d be gone in a matter of months
Not sure anyone actually said that.Edited by Byker28i on Saturday 16th November 08:05
trumps trying again to send messages. Remember he pardoned people before such as Sherrif Joe Arpaio when team trump members were up for trial. Dinesh D'Souza, pardoned for campaign fraud
trump pardoned three people in three war-crimes cases, despite Pentagon opposition to the move. He issued at least two full pardons that will prevent the Pentagon from pursuing future charges against the individuals involved.
No coincidence this came as Giuliani spoke about his 'insurance'?
The service members were notified by Trump over the phone late Friday afternoon, according to lawyers for Army Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn and former Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher, the SEAL. Golsteyn faced a murder trial scheduled for next year, while Gallagher recently was acquitted of murder and convicted of posing with the corpse of an Islamic State fighter in Iraq.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2...
trump pardoned three people in three war-crimes cases, despite Pentagon opposition to the move. He issued at least two full pardons that will prevent the Pentagon from pursuing future charges against the individuals involved.
No coincidence this came as Giuliani spoke about his 'insurance'?
The service members were notified by Trump over the phone late Friday afternoon, according to lawyers for Army Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn and former Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher, the SEAL. Golsteyn faced a murder trial scheduled for next year, while Gallagher recently was acquitted of murder and convicted of posing with the corpse of an Islamic State fighter in Iraq.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2...
trump doesn't like strong women. I think Pelosi is trying to get into his head, is this to deliberately distract him from other attacks?
Pelosi: "He should not frivolously throw out insults, but that's what he does. I think part of it is his own insecurity as an imposter. I think he knows full well that he's in that office way over his head. And so he has to diminish everyone else."
Pelosi: "He should not frivolously throw out insults, but that's what he does. I think part of it is his own insecurity as an imposter. I think he knows full well that he's in that office way over his head. And so he has to diminish everyone else."
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