45th President of the United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 7)
Discussion
minimoog said:
Trump will be acquitted today.
Probably, and most likely by a vote 100% along party lines, which will show, whatever side you are on, that the American system is funded broken and the president is now above the law. Or at least republican presidents are. God help us all once Trump knows this rather than thinking it. If he gets another term he is going to become even more dangerous.
I doubt many of us will ever know, however I suspect Trump's conversations with the Ukrainians were not highly unusual in historical terms. The US has thrown it's weight around for many many years and I'd be amazed if Presidents have always avoided applying pressure when the preferred outcome would also be politically beneficial, from a domestic viewpoint.
I'm no particular Trump fan or apologist (though neither do I harbour any specific negativity towards him), however I do get the feeling the Democrats in this instance have been behaving a little bit like our Parliament did in respect of Brexit. As much as they say it's all about the President behaving badly, their motivation in using the impeachment procedure is personal gain, rather than true abhorrence at what Trump did.
I'm no particular Trump fan or apologist (though neither do I harbour any specific negativity towards him), however I do get the feeling the Democrats in this instance have been behaving a little bit like our Parliament did in respect of Brexit. As much as they say it's all about the President behaving badly, their motivation in using the impeachment procedure is personal gain, rather than true abhorrence at what Trump did.
Electro1980 said:
minimoog said:
Trump will be acquitted today.
Probably, and most likely by a vote 100% along party lines, which will show, whatever side you are on, that the American system is funded broken and the president is now above the law. Or at least republican presidents are. God help us all once Trump knows this rather than thinking it. If he gets another term he is going to become even more dangerous.
t, that's what the polls are for, and the idea you'd impeach him for such with a republican Senate is more lunatic than anything trumps done or said. The democrats will probably lose the next election too because they've been too busy with this nonsense which incidentally plays right into trumps whole elitist swamp narrative, they've been talking about impeachment since day 2 of his presidency not because of whatever weak ass grounds they've managed to conjure up but because they can't look in the mirror and square that he beat them, that how dare the stupid public vote for this thing instead of them, and all they can think to do is this pathetic muck flinging.You're correct in that the system is "broken" but that's trumps whole shtick my friend its corrupt and rotten - the democrats could win by a landslide if they'd pay slightly more attention to the people but the elite at the top won't and can't. Thus trump.
And the really sad thing is you dolts will be thinking I support him duh.
janesmith1950 said:
I doubt many of us will ever know, however I suspect Trump's conversations with the Ukrainians were not highly unusual in historical terms. The US has thrown it's weight around for many many years and I'd be amazed if Presidents have always avoided applying pressure when the preferred outcome would also be politically beneficial, from a domestic viewpoint.
You are missing the point entirely.Teddy Lop said:
its not broken - the impeachment process was designed to remove a president who'd gone mental, not a fruitbat whose done some dodgy st, that's what the polls are for, and the idea you'd impeach him for such with a republican Senate is more lunatic than anything trumps done or said. The democrats will probably lose the next election too because they've been too busy with this nonsense which incidentally plays right into trumps whole elitist swamp narrative, they've been talking about impeachment since day 2 of his presidency not because of whatever weak ass grounds they've managed to conjure up but because they can't look in the mirror and square that he beat them, that how dare the stupid public vote for this thing instead of them, and all they can think to do is this pathetic muck flinging.
You're correct in that the system is "broken" but that's trumps whole shtick my friend its corrupt and rotten - the democrats could win by a landslide if they'd pay slightly more attention to the people but the elite at the top won't and can't. Thus trump.
And the really sad thing is you dolts will be thinking I support him duh.
Hard to know where to begin isn't it...t, that's what the polls are for, and the idea you'd impeach him for such with a republican Senate is more lunatic than anything trumps done or said. The democrats will probably lose the next election too because they've been too busy with this nonsense which incidentally plays right into trumps whole elitist swamp narrative, they've been talking about impeachment since day 2 of his presidency not because of whatever weak ass grounds they've managed to conjure up but because they can't look in the mirror and square that he beat them, that how dare the stupid public vote for this thing instead of them, and all they can think to do is this pathetic muck flinging.You're correct in that the system is "broken" but that's trumps whole shtick my friend its corrupt and rotten - the democrats could win by a landslide if they'd pay slightly more attention to the people but the elite at the top won't and can't. Thus trump.
And the really sad thing is you dolts will be thinking I support him duh.
janesmith1950 said:
I doubt many of us will ever know, however I suspect Trump's conversations with the Ukrainians were not highly unusual in historical terms. The US has thrown it's weight around for many many years and I'd be amazed if Presidents have always avoided applying pressure when the preferred outcome would also be politically beneficial, from a domestic viewpoint.
Actually that is highly incorrectly. Whilst the US has always used it's power and influence to get favourable outcomes for the United States (I.E. foisting their laws onto other nations, effectively bypassing the governments of those nations, democratic or otherwise) a US president hasn't used the power of the US to elicit personal favours from other nations and especially not to ask a foreign nation to interfere with a US election.
In fact Trump is the first president in at least half a century to buck the trend on using US power to force other nations to accept US laws, albeit for the wrong reasons. He tore up the TPP not because it was bad for the US (it wasn't, it was bad for everyone else but not the US) but because not was an Obama era thing.
Trumps diplomacy has been great for other nations (I.E. Brazil had been selling soy to China since the trade war began) but not for the one he was elected to represent.
captain_cynic said:
janesmith1950 said:
I doubt many of us will ever know, however I suspect Trump's conversations with the Ukrainians were not highly unusual in historical terms. The US has thrown it's weight around for many many years and I'd be amazed if Presidents have always avoided applying pressure when the preferred outcome would also be politically beneficial, from a domestic viewpoint.
Actually that is highly incorrectly. Whilst the US has always used it's power and influence to get favourable outcomes for the United States (I.E. foisting their laws onto other nations, effectively bypassing the governments of those nations, democratic or otherwise) a US president hasn't used the power of the US to elicit personal favours from other nations and especially not to ask a foreign nation to interfere with a US election.
In fact Trump is the first president in at least half a century to buck the trend on using US power to force other nations to accept US laws, albeit for the wrong reasons. He tore up the TPP not because it was bad for the US (it wasn't, it was bad for everyone else but not the US) but because not was an Obama era thing.
Trumps diplomacy has been great for other nations (I.E. Brazil had been selling soy to China since the trade war began) but not for the one he was elected to represent.
64 US troops now being treated for Traumatic Brain Injury as toll of Iranian attack continues to increase
Is this number being ramped up to try to force trump to do something, take further escalation?
https://taskandpurpose.com/more-troops-tbi-iraq
Is this number being ramped up to try to force trump to do something, take further escalation?
https://taskandpurpose.com/more-troops-tbi-iraq
The Pence aid who testified to the hopuse, ignoring trumps demands that no-one testifys, is leaving her job early
Jennifer Williams, the national security aide to Pence and key witness in the House's impeachment investigation, will be leaving her post in the VP's office early. She'll join Central Command, according to two people with knowledge.
Her testimony was brought up by Schiff this week in the impeachment hearing
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/pence-jen...
Jennifer Williams, the national security aide to Pence and key witness in the House's impeachment investigation, will be leaving her post in the VP's office early. She'll join Central Command, according to two people with knowledge.
Her testimony was brought up by Schiff this week in the impeachment hearing
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/pence-jen...
A Justice Department lawyer said in federal court that the House can impeach a president over ignored subpoenas, a noted contrast to what lawyers for Trump are arguing at his Senate impeachment trial.
"In the category of you can't make this stuff up," Schiff said on the Senate floor. "The judge says if the Congress can't enforce its subpoenas in court, then what remedy is there? And the Justice Department lawyer's response is impeachment."
Eliciting laughter from the senators, Schiff, a California Democrat, continued, "You can't make this up. I mean, what more evidence do we need of the bad faith of this effort to cover up?"
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/30/politics/trump-...
"In the category of you can't make this stuff up," Schiff said on the Senate floor. "The judge says if the Congress can't enforce its subpoenas in court, then what remedy is there? And the Justice Department lawyer's response is impeachment."
Eliciting laughter from the senators, Schiff, a California Democrat, continued, "You can't make this up. I mean, what more evidence do we need of the bad faith of this effort to cover up?"
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/30/politics/trump-...
Parnas has released another video, showing trump again lying when he says he doesn't know him or Fruman. It shows that ten days before Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman dined with Trump at his Washington hotel, they were part of a small group of Republican Party donors who met with the president at Mar-a-Lago,
New video released by the attorney for Lev Parnas, the indicted associate of President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani who worked to drum up an investigation of Joe Biden out of Ukraine, appears to show Parnas and his business partner Igor Fruman mingling with Trump and GOP officials at a donor event in April 2018.
The recording appears to have been by Fruman, who was indicted along with Parnas on campaign finance charges last year, and is further evidence that Parnas and Fruman were invited to several events with Trump—who has since claimed not to know them—and other high-ranking GOP officials.
The encounter suggests a level of familiarity with Fruman, who along with Parnas donated more than $600,000 to 26 federal candidates, all Republicans, in 2016 and 2018. Most of the then-candidates who are now sitting members of Congress and plan to run for re-election in 2020, including House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, pledged to return the donations shortly after the indictment was made public.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/lev-parna...
The RNC used the trump excuse
“On a given day, the chairwoman greets hundreds if not thousands of people at events across the country,” an RNC spokesperson said in response to the video. “This is nothing more than that.”
Remember Parnas has worked with trump for 30 years
New video released by the attorney for Lev Parnas, the indicted associate of President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani who worked to drum up an investigation of Joe Biden out of Ukraine, appears to show Parnas and his business partner Igor Fruman mingling with Trump and GOP officials at a donor event in April 2018.
The recording appears to have been by Fruman, who was indicted along with Parnas on campaign finance charges last year, and is further evidence that Parnas and Fruman were invited to several events with Trump—who has since claimed not to know them—and other high-ranking GOP officials.
The encounter suggests a level of familiarity with Fruman, who along with Parnas donated more than $600,000 to 26 federal candidates, all Republicans, in 2016 and 2018. Most of the then-candidates who are now sitting members of Congress and plan to run for re-election in 2020, including House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, pledged to return the donations shortly after the indictment was made public.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/lev-parna...
The RNC used the trump excuse
“On a given day, the chairwoman greets hundreds if not thousands of people at events across the country,” an RNC spokesperson said in response to the video. “This is nothing more than that.”
Remember Parnas has worked with trump for 30 years
minimoog said:
Trump will be acquitted today.
RobDickinson said:
It's not an acquittal it's a cover up.
Discussing the decision not to hear from witnesses, Carl Bernstein slammed the Republican-controlled Senate, which he referred to as the "so-called world's greatest deliberative body." Bernstein said, "This is a cover up, plain and simple." He added, "We have seen now a really shameful episode in our history that is going to read down for many, many years."After Bernstein's comments, Anderson Cooper floated a hypothetical to the CNN panel. "I just don't understand," Cooper said. "So tomorrow Rudy Giuliani could set up an office, like two blocks from the White House, and hire Igor Fruman ... or Lev Parnas ... and he could start operating for the President again overseas doing stuff, and that would be fine?"
Elliot Williams replied, "It would be foolish for him not to because the rules now say that it is very much, number one, perfectly permissible behavior for a President and his stooges to engage in, and number two, even if he does it and they know he does it he cannot be impeached for it and won't be removed for it." Bernstein added, "This is a license."
https://mailchi.mp/cnn/rs-jan-30-2020
Chairman Burr who leads the ongoing Senate Intel Committee Russia investigation, says he has no problem with the WH team's suggestion that it's fine to accept dirt on a political adversary from a foreign power.
No syurprise there as Burr was named in the Mueller report as having leaked info from his committee's investigations to to the White House.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/richard-b...
No syurprise there as Burr was named in the Mueller report as having leaked info from his committee's investigations to to the White House.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/30/richard-b...
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