How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 11)

[anonymous-user]

In light of current events

https://www.ft.com/content/04ef404e-b826-11e8-b3ef...

[jakesmith]

Just come back from Spain
I drove 90 mins to a Seat dealership to but the correct touch in pencil for the hire car that I scratched
They did not notice on return despite it being a terrible repair - I am delighted
I have changed my mind on EU membership and think we should stay in, as I have been treated fairly - and I will take the CDW in the future to for the same reason

[mx5nut]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

[Vanden Saab]

mx5nut said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

Hunt campaigned for and voted to remain....He is your idiot

[alfie2244]

Vanden Saab said:

mx5nut said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

Hunt campaigned for and voted to remain....He is your idiot

Not very bright some of these Remainers.

[Elysium]

andymadmak said:

More remarkable still is that the pillars of Remainer debating tactics are as loud and proud with some (note: not all) Remainers today as they were 3 years ago

Ok I will play and see which ones I can claim:

andymadmak said:

* Be as insulting and demeaning and scornful as possible towards Brexit voters.

No

andymadmak said:

* Keep playing the racist, xenophobic, bigoted, uneducated, stupid, poor, cards in the hope that somebody might listen

No

andymadmak said:

* Always assume the worst possible motives on the Brexit side, whilst assuming the best of intentions from the EU side

No

andymadmak said:

* Base arguments on the principal that UK=crap EU= our saviour

No

andymadmak said:

* Align themselves with the utterings of rude, obnoxious bigots like JOB

If this refers to James O'Brien then I recommend his book

andymadmak said:

* Challenge (rightly so) all things related to Brexit, but without subjecting the Remain position to anything like the same level of scrutiny (aka hypocrisy)

No

andymadmak said:

* Demand from other blokes on the internet precise, dissectible answers to nuanced questions and then squeal like banshees when they don't get one.

No

andymadmak said:

* Refuse to answer any questions themselves, unless it's to insult, invoke whataboutery, or simply answer a question with another question - which they demand must be answered before the original question to them can be addressed

No

andymadmak said:

* Deliberately misinterpret and misquote people they disagree with

No

andymadmak said:

* See the situation quite literally in black and white. No nuances, no shade and then refuse to believe that anyone else can see things in a different way to them.

Absolutely no

andymadmak said:

* Tell us all about how Brexiteers think, (likely as not, without ever actually having met or possibly really engaged one in reasoned debate) then ascribe whatever thought process they come up with to Brexiteers and use that as a stick to beat them with!

No

andymadmak said:

* Tell us how compromise is essential because it was only 52 48, but then admit that if it had been 52 48 Remain, there would have been no concessions to Brexit voters at that point

No

andymadmak said:

* Talk wildly about democracy, but only so long as it's democracy that aligns with their own views

no

andymadmak said:

* Tell us that there must be compromise, - the compromise being to Remain

No

andymadmak said:

* Talk about dodgy campaign funding, but provide no evidence beyond the speculation. (This is interesting when you consider the Remainer desire for precise evidence before believing anything, and yet here they are believing any old rumour cos it suits them)

no

andymadmak said:

* See no problem with that £9m Government leaflet

OK - you can have that one, I see no problem with it. I think Brexiteers also like it as they regularly quote from it.

andymadmak said:

* Don't question where the LBD campaign gets its money from, but are happy to post their posters up here.

Irrelevant really as their posters are factual. They are holding a mirror up to politicians lies.

andymadmak said:

* Refuse to acknowledge the role that May and Robbins, both Remainers to their cores played in getting to this point

No

andymadmak said:

* Keep getting banned and coming back under new identities. (Why is that I wonder?)

No

[DeepEnd]

Elysium said:

OK - you can have that one, I see no problem with it. I think Brexiteers also like it as they regularly quote from it.

[gooner1]

Elysium said:

andymadmak said:

More remarkable still is that the pillars of Remainer debating tactics are as loud and proud with some (note: not all) Remainers today as they were 3 years ago

Ok I will play and see which ones I can claim:

andymadmak said:

* Be as insulting and demeaning and scornful as possible towards Brexit voters.

No

andymadmak said:

* Keep playing the racist, xenophobic, bigoted, uneducated, stupid, poor, cards in the hope that somebody might listen

No

andymadmak said:

* Always assume the worst possible motives on the Brexit side, whilst assuming the best of intentions from the EU side

No

andymadmak said:

* Base arguments on the principal that UK=crap EU= our saviour

No

andymadmak said:

* Align themselves with the utterings of rude, obnoxious bigots like JOB

If this refers to James O'Brien then I recommend his book

andymadmak said:

* Challenge (rightly so) all things related to Brexit, but without subjecting the Remain position to anything like the same level of scrutiny (aka hypocrisy)

No

andymadmak said:

* Demand from other blokes on the internet precise, dissectible answers to nuanced questions and then squeal like banshees when they don't get one.

No

andymadmak said:

* Refuse to answer any questions themselves, unless it's to insult, invoke whataboutery, or simply answer a question with another question - which they demand must be answered before the original question to them can be addressed

No

andymadmak said:

* Deliberately misinterpret and misquote people they disagree with

No

andymadmak said:

* See the situation quite literally in black and white. No nuances, no shade and then refuse to believe that anyone else can see things in a different way to them.

Absolutely no

andymadmak said:

* Tell us all about how Brexiteers think, (likely as not, without ever actually having met or possibly really engaged one in reasoned debate) then ascribe whatever thought process they come up with to Brexiteers and use that as a stick to beat them with!

No

andymadmak said:

* Tell us how compromise is essential because it was only 52 48, but then admit that if it had been 52 48 Remain, there would have been no concessions to Brexit voters at that point

No

andymadmak said:

* Talk wildly about democracy, but only so long as it's democracy that aligns with their own views

n

andymadmak said:

* Tell us that there must be compromise, - the compromise being to Remain

No

andymadmak said:

* Talk about dodgy campaign funding, but provide no evidence beyond the speculation. (This is interesting when you consider the Remainer desire for precise evidence before believing anything, and yet here they are believing any old rumour cos it suits them)

no

andymadmak said:

* See no problem with that £9m Government leaflet

OK - you can have that one, I see no problem with it. I think Brexiteers also like it as they regularly quote from it.

andymadmak said:

* Don't question where the LBD campaign gets its money from, but are happy to post their posters up here.

Irrelevant really as their posters are factual. They are holding a mirror up to politicians lies.

andymadmak said:

* Refuse to acknowledge the role that May and Robbins, both Remainers to their cores played in getting to this point

No

andymadmak said:

* Keep getting banned and coming back under new identities. (Why is that I wonder?)

No

Why did you feel the need to differentiate your answers with a host of " No" and
a singular " Absolutely no"? It makes it appear as if you are not at all convinced by the
majority of your own answers.

Edited by gooner1 on Saturday 20th July 01:12

[gooner1]

DeepEnd said:

Elysium said:

OK - you can have that one, I see no problem with it. I think Brexiteers also like it as they regularly quote from it.

While you are both here, what's your opinions on old Johnny "send them back" Belrcow?


.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/5651054/Speaker-John-Bercow-called-for-assisted-repatriation-of-immigrants.html

[mx5nut]

Vanden Saab said:

mx5nut said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

Hunt campaigned for and voted to remain....He is your idiot

I take it you disagree with him? And that a generation of British people will thank the EU for a no deal outcome?

[anonymous-user]

mx5nut said:

Vanden Saab said:

mx5nut said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

Hunt campaigned for and voted to remain....He is your idiot

I take it you disagree with him? And that a generation of British people will thank the EU for a no deal outcome?

I think a generation of British people will see the EU for what it is if there’s a no seal outcome.

If they didn’t know already.

[mx5nut]

REALIST123 said:

mx5nut said:

Vanden Saab said:

mx5nut said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/18/je...

I must be losing track of the Brexiter talking points - why would anyone need to forgive Brussels for causing something that Brexiters tell us everybody voted for all along?

Hunt campaigned for and voted to remain....He is your idiot

I take it you disagree with him? And that a generation of British people will thank the EU for a no deal outcome?

I think a generation of British people will see the EU for what it is if there’s a no seal outcome.

What do you mean by that? Isn't no deal what they voted for? Why are Brexiters talking about it as if it's a negative outcome now?

[DeepEnd]

mx5nut said:

What do you mean by that? Isn't no deal what they voted for? Why are Brexiters talking about it as if it's a negative outcome now?

It’s Schrödinger’s no deal. Both exactly what they voted for and the EU are evil for letting us have it.

Another one for the LBC/PH list of leavers who contradict themselves and expose their arguments and beliefs as fundamentally flawed.

[DeepEnd]

gooner1 said:

While you are both here, what's your opinions on old Johnny "send them back" Belrcow?


.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/5651054/Speaker-John-Bercow-called-for-assisted-repatriation-of-immigrants.html

He’s on record as distancing himself from those views, which are ignorant and ill-judged.

—

“As a young activist, Bercow was a member of the right-wing Conservative Monday Club. He stood as a candidate for the club's national executive in 1981 with a manifesto calling for a programme of "assisted repatriation" of immigrants, and became secretary of its immigration and repatriation committee. However, at the age of 20 he left the club, citing the views of many of the club's members as his reason, and has since then called his participation in the club "utter madness" and dismissed his views from that period as "bone headed".

—

That looks like something daft he went along with in his late teens and has since completely rejected - his current politics suggests that rejection is genuine.

I’m less sure you can assume the same for Farage and his dislike of foreigners on trains etc. Pretty sure he holds the same views.

Do you think Bercow still has these views, and do you think Farage still has train views?

[Crackie]

DeepEnd said:

That looks like something daft he went along with in his late teens and has since completely rejected - his current politics suggests that rejection is genuine.

Reverse Gammon??

Fair play to him for acknowledging and rejecting the abhorrent views he had as young man. He is now at an age where he is more experienced and far better informed and makes better decisions...…….like a leave voter.

[gooner1]

DeepEnd said:

It’s Schrödinger’s no deal. Both exactly what they voted for and the EU are evil for letting us have it.

Another one for the LBC/PH list of leavers who contradict themselves and expose their arguments and beliefs as fundamentally flawed.

Strange, I was convinced you were a Remainer, yet here you are condemning the
EU as evil. Nearly as strange as the fact that some remainers have continually
insisted that No Deal will not happen and have done everything in their power to
stop it, and here you are, again, telling all and sundry that your beloved EU are
"letting us have it". Do you consider yourself betrayed?

Btw, not sure how to take your silence on John " send them back" Bercow.


Am I doing this right?

[frisbee]

REALIST123 said:

I think a generation of British people will see the EU for what it is if there’s a no seal outcome.

If they didn’t know already.

I voted for my seal and I demand to have one!

[DeepEnd]

gooner1 said:

Strange, I was convinced you were a Remainer, yet here you are condemning the
EU as evil. Nearly as strange as the fact that some remainers have continually
insisted that No Deal will not happen and have done everything in their power to
stop it, and here you are, again, telling all and sundry that your beloved EU are
"letting us have it". Do you consider yourself betrayed?

Btw, not sure how to take your silence on John " send them back" Bercow.


Am I doing this right?

The “EU is evil” is the soundbite for leavers like you. Not aimed at remainers.

Do you blame the EU if we get no deal or is that what you want? Or both? Take your time.

And I answered the bercow question - see if you can answer the follow up.

[Vanden Saab]

Crackie said:

DeepEnd said:

That looks like something daft he went along with in his late teens and has since completely rejected - his current politics suggests that rejection is genuine.

Reverse Gammon??

Fair play to him for acknowledging and rejecting the abhorrent views he had as young man. He is now at an age where he is more experienced and far better informed and makes better decisions...…….like a leave voter.

Boom... The same people who criticise others for things they said years ago posting LBD nonsense quotes to prove their point praise one of their own when he does the same thing. All without a trace of the self awareness to realise what they are doing...

[gooner1]

DeepEnd said:

The “EU is evil” is the soundbite for leavers like you. Not aimed at remainers.

Do you blame the EU if we get no deal or is that what you want? Or both? Take your time.

And I answered the bercow question - see if you can answer the follow up.

DeepEnd said:

The “EU is evil” is the soundbite for leavers like you. Not aimed at remainers.

Do you blame the EU if we get no deal or is that what you want? Or both? Take your time.

And I answered the bercow question - see if you can answer the follow up.

On the subject of No Deal, I would prefer a negotiated deal beneficial to both parties.
But if the EU refuse to negotiate then I'm confident in my countries ability to
survive and thrive with the negotiations that would invariably follow our leaving.

As for your John " send them back" Bercow reply, no I don't think he's changed at all.

I bet he loved Mays efforts to repatriate our fellow citizens during the Windrush debacle.

And yes, of course I think his nigelness has views on trains. What a bizarre question.