How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 11)

[Otis Criblecoblis]

Elysium said:

Otis Criblecoblis said:

DeepEnd said:

They can’t (or should not be allowed to) have it both ways.

One minute it is “we must leave CU and SM it was all promised (ironically by remain but not “absolutely” leave)”

Next minute “no just leaving is all that matters”.

It’s a dishonesty that does not command respect.

Elysium’s argument is compelling.

Sod such dishonesty, another vote would of course be democratic. They are terrified as they know it is a clusterfk.

I see Boris is now saying “hang on don’t get your hopes up”.

Elysium added a dishonest twist to fit his agenda, one you gloss over because it doesn't fit yours either.
I'm more than happy to discuss the chat on SM and CU, but you'd make yourself look a fool if you go there.
Dress it up how you please, buy your cry is little more than 'vote again ! ' garnished in bullst.

I did nothing dishonest.

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

[DeepEnd]

Otis Criblecoblis said:

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

[gooner1]

DeepEnd said:

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

So ask away, as often as you like.

[DeepEnd]

gooner1 said:

DeepEnd said:

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

So ask away, as often as you like.

Just the once will do goon.

It’ll be close mind as leave is going soooooo well with all the clear benefits just around the corner.

[NoNeed]

DeepEnd said:

gooner1 said:

DeepEnd said:

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

So ask away, as often as you like.

Just the once will do goon.

It’ll be close mind as leave is going soooooo well with all the clear benefits just around the corner.

Actually, it was made very clear by many remainers at the time that the EU will not negotiate with a member state so we would have to leave and then try and get a deal

[gooner1]

DeepEnd said:

Just the once will do goon.

It’ll be close mind as leave is going soooooo well with all the clear benefits just around the corner.

Had any answers from the majority you appear to be asking DP, or are they playing you at your own game?

[Le Controleur Horizontal]

Brooking10 said:

Eh ?

My tongue in cheek point was that the E.U. is frequently held up as allowing ideology to trump common sense decision making and here is a poster doing something rather similar from the other side of the fence.

You do not know that.....pompous or what ! (fits type)

[anonymous-user]

Le Controleur Horizontal said:

Brooking10 said:

Eh ?

My tongue in cheek point was that the E.U. is frequently held up as allowing ideology to trump common sense decision making and here is a poster doing something rather similar from the other side of the fence.

You do not know that.....pompous or what ! (fits type)

Erm ????

Ok then.

I would suggest that somebody who wants to leave irrespective of how we do it is wedded to an ideology. Just for clarity ideology is not a bad word. It’s just a word.

[Otis Criblecoblis]

DeepEnd said:

Otis Criblecoblis said:

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

You are adding your own twist now. I agree with you, and I don't speak for the 17m.
I would guess a majority thought a decent deal possible and perhaps a likely outcome. That however was not garanteed and I don't know of anything that ruled it out. Remainers fked up and forgot to put any caveats in and actually campaigned using the no deal outcome as a possible result.
As I've said, I went to the polls knowing there was a possible route to no deal. Did you, or what do you think blocked it ?

[Burwood]

DeepEnd said:

Otis Criblecoblis said:

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

I was under no illusion what the vote meant. Leave or Remain. There was no deal. Nice if we get one but no fks given if we don’t.

[gooner1]

Brooking10 said:

Erm ????

Ok then.

I would suggest that somebody who wants to leave irrespective of how we do it is wedded to an ideology. Just for clarity ideology is not a bad word. It’s just a word.

Needless to say the same applies to some remainers but with the - points of wanting the ideology they are wedded to to supplant a democratically reached decision.

[anonymous-user]

gooner1 said:

Needless to say the same applies to some remainers but with the - points of wanting the ideology they are wedded to to supplant a democratically reached decision.

What’s your point caller ?

[DeepEnd]

Otis Criblecoblis said:

You are adding your own twist now. I agree with you, and I don't speak for the 17m.
I would guess a majority thought a decent deal possible and perhaps a likely outcome. That however was not garanteed and I don't know of anything that ruled it out. Remainers fked up and forgot to put any caveats in and actually campaigned using the no deal outcome as a possible result.
As I've said, I went to the polls knowing there was a possible route to no deal. Did you, or what do you think blocked it ?

You just seem to dismiss those leavers who wanted a deal as irrelevant. Does it not matter that they might change their mind on brexit now the promises have been broken? If the govt can break the deal promise, why bother leaving the SM and CU, or even stopping free movement? If you take the view nothing about leaving actually matters you expose your arguments completely.

It is good that you actually remember the remainers warning about the threats of no deal - at the time that was project fear and rubbished by brexit errs as nonsense - of course we’d get a great deal they said. Didn’t influence voters? Nonsense - I’ll bet you were saying & thinking the same - we’d get a great deal. Now it seems you want project fear. The desired outcomes have become so skittish as to be very hard to take seriously.

You say remainers fked up by not caveating - it is like you know full well no deal is daft but just don’t care. Weird.

[Le Controleur Horizontal]

Brooking10 said:

Le Controleur Horizontal said:

Brooking10 said:

Eh ?

My tongue in cheek point was that the E.U. is frequently held up as allowing ideology to trump common sense decision making and here is a poster doing something rather similar from the other side of the fence.

You do not know that.....pompous or what ! (fits type)

Erm ????

Ok then.

I would suggest that somebody who wants to leave irrespective of how we do it is wedded to an ideology. Just for clarity ideology is not a bad word. It’s just a word.

Assumes and pompous....well done = confirmed type.

You have zero clue about his driver for that choice.

The choice of being free from the EU political project is a worthy principle to hold, political freedom is worth a lot, many fight oppressors for it, others vote in a free election or referendum.

Edited by Le Controleur Horizontal on Friday 23 August 22:13

[gooner1]

Brooking10 said:

What’s your point caller ?

Equality, receptionist , equality.
Now if you wouldn't mind putting me through to someone in charge , I'd be most grateful.
Oh, hang on, I see from your post on another thread that you consider that to be yourself.

[philv]

DeepEnd said:

Otis Criblecoblis said:

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

Don’t suppose you have a copy of a ballot paper on which this is all written?

[gooner1]

philv said:

Don’t suppose you have a copy of a ballot paper on which this is all written?

I wouldn't be at all surprised if DP hadn't participated in the Referendum at all.

[don'tbesilly]

philv said:

DeepEnd said:

Otis Criblecoblis said:

I think your claim, that the only mandate is to leave with a decent deal , has an added dishonest twist with regard to the 'decent deal' bit.
I went to the polls knowing there was a no deal scenario that was a possible consequence.
You need to demonstrate why the mandate was only to leave with a decent deal, and why there was no posible route to leaving without a deal and what blocked this.

You don’t speak for the 17m

Plenty were promised and expected a deal.

It is dishonest to pretend they didn’t.

It is not dishonest - as Elysium suggests - to ask what the majority now want as leave is not turning out anything remotely like what was promised.

Don’t suppose you have a copy of a ballot paper on which this is all written?

This is what I received back in 2016:



I'm guessing everyone else received the same?
Or did some (papers) have a caveat about a deal was a requirement if the vote was to leave

[DeepEnd]

philv said:

Don’t suppose you have a copy of a ballot paper on which this is all written?

Yes, it was written just under the bit that said we had to leave the CU, SM and stop free movement of foreigners and [angry mode on] we CANNOT be like Norway under any fking circumstances OK!!!, or its a massive betrayal of the will of the Nigel people and will SHAME democracy!!!! [/angry mode off]

Sounds stupid and inconsistent eh? Indeed it does.

[anonymous-user]

Le Controleur Horizontal said:

Brooking10 said:

Le Controleur Horizontal said:

Brooking10 said:

Eh ?

My tongue in cheek point was that the E.U. is frequently held up as allowing ideology to trump common sense decision making and here is a poster doing something rather similar from the other side of the fence.

You do not know that.....pompous or what ! (fits type)

Erm ????

Ok then.

I would suggest that somebody who wants to leave irrespective of how we do it is wedded to an ideology. Just for clarity ideology is not a bad word. It’s just a word.

Assumes and pompous....well done = confirmed type.

You have zero clue about his driver for that choice.

The choice of being free from the EU political project is a worthy principle to hold, political freedom is worth a lot, many fight oppressors for it, others vote in a free election or referendum.

Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 23 August 22:13

You do realise you have just described an underlying ideology ?

I wasn’t commenting on the validity or otherwise of that ideology. We’ve done that to death.

Feel free to continue the “type” chat.