Boris Johnson- Prime Minister
Discussion
Murph7355 said:
It broadly covers what I noted, but also gets upset by us effectively still being members for the transition period.
This is why the backstop was so toxic. Without it, we are time limited on that arrangement with the idea we have an FTA at the end of it. So big deal really... We waited nearly 25yrs for a vote, and have had to tolerate Parliamentary incompetence for 3yrs. 2yrs more to actually leave will pass in no time.
If the backstop can be removed then I'm sure it can also be added that new stuff (EU army etc,) is to be excluded... But the chances of that being established and doing anything in the next two years are near zero.
And other items are genuinely useful two way options... Ie they're actually balanced but being portrayed there as not being.
Compromise has to happen somewhere
But there’s absolutely no guarantee or even reasonable prospect, with the EU’s track record on these things, even assuming good faith, that an FTA with the EU would take less than ten to fifteen years to conclude. It’s best written off in my view, or at least left to develop at its own pace. This is why the backstop was so toxic. Without it, we are time limited on that arrangement with the idea we have an FTA at the end of it. So big deal really... We waited nearly 25yrs for a vote, and have had to tolerate Parliamentary incompetence for 3yrs. 2yrs more to actually leave will pass in no time.
If the backstop can be removed then I'm sure it can also be added that new stuff (EU army etc,) is to be excluded... But the chances of that being established and doing anything in the next two years are near zero.
And other items are genuinely useful two way options... Ie they're actually balanced but being portrayed there as not being.
Compromise has to happen somewhere
Losing a minimum of another two years of being able to negotiate FTAs with people who are actually interested in developing trade with us rather than playing politics seems a very high price to pay.
psi310398 said:
But there’s absolutely no guarantee or even reasonable prospect, with the EU’s track record on these things, even assuming good faith, that an FTA with the EU would take less than ten to fifteen years to conclude. It’s best written off in my view, or at least left to develop at its own pace.
Losing a minimum of another two years of being able to negotiate FTAs with people who are actually interested in developing trade with us rather than playing politics seems a very high price to pay.
The WA allows us to negotiate trade agreements, just not put them into force until we're gone gone.Losing a minimum of another two years of being able to negotiate FTAs with people who are actually interested in developing trade with us rather than playing politics seems a very high price to pay.
2yrs of proper preps for no deal in parallel to negotiating as good a deal as possible. Perhaps phasing it to cover Eire/NI goods and services as a priority.
Also 2yrs to negotiate as good a deal elsewhere with as many countries as we can.
See how both of those things are going and if all is good, depart at 2yrs. Or 2yrs and a month.... Etc.
I'd much sooner have got to that point 2yrs ago. But s
t happens.I forgot to also reiterate that the link banged on about the PD. That's not binding.
Yes there'd be scope for politicians playing fast and loose. But IMO only to the point of a GE. So call it a max of 5yrs.
Compromise.
alfie2244 said:
minimoog said:
alfie2244 said:
Made me smile 
He was just goofing after Macron suggested he could use the table as footstool if he wanted to recline a bit.Wot larks eh?
loafer123 said:
No one will bother negotiating deals with us unless there is a fixed timescale to work to, and that the definitive date is relatively soon.
No one will insist on a set time right at the outset as no one knows how protracted discussions might be. The US averages 18mths IIRC. So 2yrs is hardly a stretch. And I'm sure if a big enough, juicy enough arrangement were to be feasible within that with someone then I'm sure we could use the financial harm clauses to our advantage
hyphen said:
Dominating the coffee table, the mannerless oaf 
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“I’m not shining your shoes Boris”https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“Don’t mind me Emmanuel ... I’m just scraping off some dogs
t “Edited by alfaman on Friday 23 August 06:31
valiant said:
I think some on here misjudge the electorate a bit.
People are sick and tired over Brexit, they want it finished, ended and to move on and I don’t think they’re that bothered now on what kind of Brexit we get whether it’s Canada this or Norway that and apart from a minority who are diehard Brexiteers who’ll never be happy unless they crowdfund a few hundred tugs to drag us as far away from the EU as possible, they’ll settle.
If Boris comes back with a hackneyed version of the WA which will be written differently but essentially the same but covered in glitter and fairy dust then I think it will get through.
Whilst politicians have not handled themselves well over all of this they are not blind to how the wind is blowing - they know we’re sick of it and they’ll vote in favour except a few blowhards like Francois and Cash who seem to have lost their voice now JRM has taken his 20 pieces of silver.
Just my two pence worth.
Most people I know just want Brexit to happen in whatever shape or form is quickest, they're sick to the back teeth of all the can kicking and just want it to happen so they can move on with their lives.People are sick and tired over Brexit, they want it finished, ended and to move on and I don’t think they’re that bothered now on what kind of Brexit we get whether it’s Canada this or Norway that and apart from a minority who are diehard Brexiteers who’ll never be happy unless they crowdfund a few hundred tugs to drag us as far away from the EU as possible, they’ll settle.
If Boris comes back with a hackneyed version of the WA which will be written differently but essentially the same but covered in glitter and fairy dust then I think it will get through.
Whilst politicians have not handled themselves well over all of this they are not blind to how the wind is blowing - they know we’re sick of it and they’ll vote in favour except a few blowhards like Francois and Cash who seem to have lost their voice now JRM has taken his 20 pieces of silver.
Just my two pence worth.
eccles said:
valiant said:
I think some on here misjudge the electorate a bit.
People are sick and tired over Brexit, they want it finished, ended and to move on and I don’t think they’re that bothered now on what kind of Brexit we get whether it’s Canada this or Norway that and apart from a minority who are diehard Brexiteers who’ll never be happy unless they crowdfund a few hundred tugs to drag us as far away from the EU as possible, they’ll settle.
If Boris comes back with a hackneyed version of the WA which will be written differently but essentially the same but covered in glitter and fairy dust then I think it will get through.
Whilst politicians have not handled themselves well over all of this they are not blind to how the wind is blowing - they know we’re sick of it and they’ll vote in favour except a few blowhards like Francois and Cash who seem to have lost their voice now JRM has taken his 20 pieces of silver.
Just my two pence worth.
Most people I know just want Brexit to happen in whatever shape or form is quickest, they're sick to the back teeth of all the can kicking and just want it to happen so they can move on with their lives.People are sick and tired over Brexit, they want it finished, ended and to move on and I don’t think they’re that bothered now on what kind of Brexit we get whether it’s Canada this or Norway that and apart from a minority who are diehard Brexiteers who’ll never be happy unless they crowdfund a few hundred tugs to drag us as far away from the EU as possible, they’ll settle.
If Boris comes back with a hackneyed version of the WA which will be written differently but essentially the same but covered in glitter and fairy dust then I think it will get through.
Whilst politicians have not handled themselves well over all of this they are not blind to how the wind is blowing - they know we’re sick of it and they’ll vote in favour except a few blowhards like Francois and Cash who seem to have lost their voice now JRM has taken his 20 pieces of silver.
Just my two pence worth.
alfaman said:
hyphen said:
Dominating the coffee table, the mannerless oaf
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“I’m not shining your shoes Boris”https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“Don’t mind me Emmanuel ... I’m just scraping off some dogs
t “Edited by alfaman on Friday 23 August 06:31
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-49440952
Blackpuddin said:
alfaman said:
hyphen said:
Dominating the coffee table, the mannerless oaf
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“I’m not shining your shoes Boris”https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“Don’t mind me Emmanuel ... I’m just scraping off some dogs
t “Edited by alfaman on Friday 23 August 06:31
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-49440952
Reminds me of the photograph of a migrant holding a woman on a railway line with police stood over them. Photo looks like police brutality. The video shows the man grab the woman and drag her down from the platform onto the railway line and the police trying to help her...
John145 said:
Blackpuddin said:
alfaman said:
hyphen said:
Dominating the coffee table, the mannerless oaf
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“I’m not shining your shoes Boris”https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7383181/B...
“Don’t mind me Emmanuel ... I’m just scraping off some dogs
t “Edited by alfaman on Friday 23 August 06:31
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-49440952
Reminds me of the photograph of a migrant holding a woman on a railway line with police stood over them. Photo looks like police brutality. The video shows the man grab the woman and drag her down from the platform onto the railway line and the police trying to help her...
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