Boris Johnson- Prime Minister (Vol. 2)
Discussion
Breadvan72 said:
The privileged few who find ZHCs to their liking are not likely to be the people working in fulfilment centres and other low wage, low status, low security jobs. For those people, ZHCs suck great big hairy monkey balls, but they are stuck with them. People like to bang on about unions, mainly because of perceptions of the 1970s (some of those perceptions are not always accurate), but the hapless staff doing the McJobs on ZHCs could do with getting unionised.
It's far from a "privileged few"...https://fullfact.org/economy/how-many-people-zero-...
A sizeable majority of people on ZHCs are happy with them.
I am sure a minority do think their ZHCs suck moose cock. I would wager a larger amount think their PAYE contracts suck it harder. Everything has its place.
As for unions.... In some cultures and operated sanely they can be a decent balance. It has never really worked that well here as far as I can tell. "Fairness" seems to be a one sided concept to many of the more politically charged Union types. Balance can never be achieved while the McLuskeys of this world are still in positions of influence.
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: ...
Either way not releasing it simply looks like there's something in it that they don't want people to know prior to voting and that's always going to look suspicious.
It wouldn’t surprise me if Johnson and Cummings are playing silly buggers with this as much as their opponents are. Squirrels. Either way not releasing it simply looks like there's something in it that they don't want people to know prior to voting and that's always going to look suspicious.
However... I'm not sure any government should get into the habit of public release of this sort of thing... As long as there's a cross party committee adjudicating (or an independent panel).
It's not hard to conceive of times when withholding is in our national interests. If you blab routinely and then one of those times comes up, you're double buggered.
We live in an age where everyone thinks they have a right to know everything. Or to at least think they do. I'm far from convinced that's healthy.
XCP said:
A general, non political question, now that there are hoards of politicians seeking photo opportunities in hospitals.
Why do they tuck their ties into their shirts? Is the top of the tie and the shirt front sterile and the bottom isn't?
Years ago I developed a paper coating that killed bacteria. ( hospital admission notes at that time were a hotbed, a veritable gourmet dinner for bacteria). Why do they tuck their ties into their shirts? Is the top of the tie and the shirt front sterile and the bottom isn't?
We did lots of work on the chain of bacterial contamination in hospitals.
Doctors and Consultants ties were like a petri dish of undesirable bacteria.
However, the very worst thing for bacteria, the summit of bacterial transmission achievement was the humble lift button.
Dirtier then the toilets, more contaminated than a pathology lab, if you want to catch something in a hospital press a lift button.
Stuff of nightmares. Just think about it.
20 years ago there was no minimum wage and the labour market had not been flooded with cheap unskilled labour so employers mostly offered proper contracts with pensions and other benefits like sick pay, retaining staff was important now we have a minimum wage which removed some flexibility employers had some offered a lower hourly rate but great benefits and vice vera, pensions are now also mandatory so they contract will have that cost, reducing flexibility even further now all this coupled with the fact that if somebody leaves all you have to do is call the local agency for immediate replacement and there you go.
Employers no longer have to worry about retention especially in low skilled jobs and the answer you get from the left is more legislation ban this contract ban that contract which is just more reduced flexibility and increased costs.
It is like saying when you come home to the bath overflowing you grab the mop, didn't bother turning off the tap just keep mopping
Employers no longer have to worry about retention especially in low skilled jobs and the answer you get from the left is more legislation ban this contract ban that contract which is just more reduced flexibility and increased costs.
It is like saying when you come home to the bath overflowing you grab the mop, didn't bother turning off the tap just keep mopping
Toaster said:
It is actually highly relevant, if the country was influenced by the Russians how did they do this and by how much was the effect. In addition Cambridge Anaytica and the associated dirty tricks have never been properly investigated. What if the referendum result actually meant we would have voted to remain by 55 or 60% ? So yes the report should be released............if you believe in truth and justice
How would you actually gauge the impact of Russian involvement on how people voted?I wouldn't be surprised if the report does attempt some such absurd calculation, probably using the same methodology which tells us our GDP will be 3.651% lower in June 2030. That's because the committee is headed by Dominic Grieve and unless anyone can say differently, seems to be composed entirely of vehement remainers.
http://isc.independent.gov.uk/committee-members
We already know that these people think at least 52% of the electorate were misinformed, stupid or racist in 2016 so the fact they've been working on a report to say this for the last 2 years changes nothing.
Quite why Johnson feels he needs to suppress this I don't know. All it would do is further entrench the views already held on both sides.
However the idea that we were influenced to the tune of between 7-12% of the electorate (to get the 55-60% Remain vote you mentioned) is probably even beyond the fantastical imagination of Dominic Grieve. It would require about 3 million votes to be cast differently. That's more than the Lib Dems got in the last election. If any politician seriously thought Putin had that sort of ability to influence UK voters then they would not be gunning for him. They would be paying him fortunes as a special advisor.
Tony427 said:
Years ago I developed a paper coating that killed bacteria. ( hospital admission notes at that time were a hotbed, a veritable gourmet dinner for bacteria).
We did lots of work on the chain of bacterial contamination in hospitals.
Doctors and Consultants ties were like a petri dish of undesirable bacteria.
However, the very worst thing for bacteria, the summit of bacterial transmission achievement was the humble lift button.
Dirtier then the toilets, more contaminated than a pathology lab, if you want to catch something in a hospital press a lift button.
Stuff of nightmares. Just think about it.
I've just spent time in a hospital - not for me, but visiting. A chap wheeled in a patient on a trolley; a pregnant woman about to give birth. He, rather extravagantly, used his elbow to press the lift button. I thought him a bit of an idiot. We did lots of work on the chain of bacterial contamination in hospitals.
Doctors and Consultants ties were like a petri dish of undesirable bacteria.
However, the very worst thing for bacteria, the summit of bacterial transmission achievement was the humble lift button.
Dirtier then the toilets, more contaminated than a pathology lab, if you want to catch something in a hospital press a lift button.
Stuff of nightmares. Just think about it.
Seems I might have been wrong.
I've been to a few parties given by doctors, not to mention a drug raid at one of their get-togethers. I can believe the petri dish bit, but remain surprised a lift button can beat a doctor's tie.
Trophy Husband said:
It is very simple to me. We are where we are now. We allegedly have the brightest people running our country whether they are politicians, economists, et al. Therefore my question is "Why is everything so flucked up?".
The only answer I have is that we do not have the brightest people running our country whomever they may be. We are not a PLC and if we were we would be a version of Carillion, kicking the can down the road to definite failure.
If I ran my business with the demonstrable and evident levels of failure evident in our Government/Parliament I'd be signing on by now.
It really is comic book stuff we are witnessing whether leave or remain.
My p1ss is boiling about the idea that parties are now choosing where to contest! If you are going to contest then you contest in all constituencies or none at all.
I listened to Nigel Farrago on R4 today and he is beyond contempt in my opinion. Machiavelli could learn from him.
Harrumph over!
So the SNP should contest every seat in the UK then?The only answer I have is that we do not have the brightest people running our country whomever they may be. We are not a PLC and if we were we would be a version of Carillion, kicking the can down the road to definite failure.
If I ran my business with the demonstrable and evident levels of failure evident in our Government/Parliament I'd be signing on by now.
It really is comic book stuff we are witnessing whether leave or remain.
My p1ss is boiling about the idea that parties are now choosing where to contest! If you are going to contest then you contest in all constituencies or none at all.
I listened to Nigel Farrago on R4 today and he is beyond contempt in my opinion. Machiavelli could learn from him.
Harrumph over!
Derek Smith said:
I've just spent time in a hospital - not for me, but visiting. A chap wheeled in a patient on a trolley; a pregnant woman about to give birth. He, rather extravagantly, used his elbow to press the lift button. I thought him a bit of an idiot.
Seems I might have been wrong.
I've been to a few parties given by doctors, not to mention a drug raid at one of their get-togethers. I can believe the petri dish bit, but remain surprised a lift button can beat a doctor's tie.
Makes complete sense to me Derek.Seems I might have been wrong.
I've been to a few parties given by doctors, not to mention a drug raid at one of their get-togethers. I can believe the petri dish bit, but remain surprised a lift button can beat a doctor's tie.
Ties should be banned in the workplace, they serve no useful purpose but provide many risks.
jsf said:
Trophy Husband said:
It is very simple to me. We are where we are now. We allegedly have the brightest people running our country whether they are politicians, economists, et al. Therefore my question is "Why is everything so flucked up?".
The only answer I have is that we do not have the brightest people running our country whomever they may be. We are not a PLC and if we were we would be a version of Carillion, kicking the can down the road to definite failure.
If I ran my business with the demonstrable and evident levels of failure evident in our Government/Parliament I'd be signing on by now.
It really is comic book stuff we are witnessing whether leave or remain.
My p1ss is boiling about the idea that parties are now choosing where to contest! If you are going to contest then you contest in all constituencies or none at all.
I listened to Nigel Farrago on R4 today and he is beyond contempt in my opinion. Machiavelli could learn from him.
Harrumph over!
So the SNP should contest every seat in the UK then?The only answer I have is that we do not have the brightest people running our country whomever they may be. We are not a PLC and if we were we would be a version of Carillion, kicking the can down the road to definite failure.
If I ran my business with the demonstrable and evident levels of failure evident in our Government/Parliament I'd be signing on by now.
It really is comic book stuff we are witnessing whether leave or remain.
My p1ss is boiling about the idea that parties are now choosing where to contest! If you are going to contest then you contest in all constituencies or none at all.
I listened to Nigel Farrago on R4 today and he is beyond contempt in my opinion. Machiavelli could learn from him.
Harrumph over!
My point remains. It is undemocratic, utterly undemocratic and is making this 'country' look a proper fool's paradise to the rest of the world.
I have a banana if you'd like one?
Slight change of direction from the last couple of pages, but still about Boris, so I thought I would put this here.
I'm seeing a lot of criticism aimed at him about his response (or lack of) to the floods around Notts, Derbyshire and S Yorks.
I can't help feel this is slightly unfair, on the basis that (photo opportunities aside) you wouldn't normally expect the PM to "actually" be co-ordinating the response (there are agencies for that) and flooding across 3 counties is hardly a national crisis?
Venice is flooding far worse, but I don't see Italy calling for a national emergency.
Maybe it's down to election season, where a candidate can't even eat a sandwich without it becoming a political football.
I'm seeing a lot of criticism aimed at him about his response (or lack of) to the floods around Notts, Derbyshire and S Yorks.
I can't help feel this is slightly unfair, on the basis that (photo opportunities aside) you wouldn't normally expect the PM to "actually" be co-ordinating the response (there are agencies for that) and flooding across 3 counties is hardly a national crisis?
Venice is flooding far worse, but I don't see Italy calling for a national emergency.
Maybe it's down to election season, where a candidate can't even eat a sandwich without it becoming a political football.
stongle said:
So why put it in quotation - is it the remain trick of putting words into peoples mouths, or painting us all with the same brush?
If I went on the look for Russian money it's, everywhere. I'd expect oligarchs did make donations to the conservatives. I would, if I owned half or Mayfair.
Did it influence millions of votes, unlikely - but I'm not a dreamer.
As I said, I would have published it anyway. Its a storm in a teacup - probably. We have bigher issues at hand, and thats to get BREXIT done. Trying to explain which Russian is a Kremlin stooge will get lost in the fake outrage. Which Corbyn is doing a great job with given his blatent BS and rabble raising on the NHS.
Interesting you tried to fake a quote, only last night one of team remain got caught using spurious numbers. Is this the new M.O? Is there anyone on team remaim whom can debate the issues at hand? I know the counter to Macron's latest Russian appeasement. Thats a bigger geopolitical issue than potential Russian money. Ok, some of us look at BREXIT as a financial exercise, bit like the Wu Tang Clan said - C.R.E.A.M. (Cash Rules Everything Around Me), but team remain, is now D.R.E.A.M. (Drugs Rule Everything Around Me).
It seems team remain have lost all sight of the wider world. Everytime Trump has a twitter spaz, the shockwaves are global. He threatened to ramp trade tensions last night. Team UK (that's all of us) are not immune. Likewise, none of you seem to be watching internal EU developments, you just talk about the nirvana that was, not Is (bit like Derek's posts). Look at the tensions between Germany and France on defence, Germany, Netherlands Vs rest of EUzone on finance. Look at acceleration of federal policy, such as banking union. Look at the budgetary problems, when many of the economies are struggling. Look at the record on inflation. Everytime these issues are brought up, remain avoids and goes into distraction mode.
But hey-ho, its forum sport. Either way.
I hardly think you can point fingers at a "remainer using spurious numbers " given the outright lies that leave plastered over a bus. Or had you forgotten about that ? or did we decide that lie was ok ? If I went on the look for Russian money it's, everywhere. I'd expect oligarchs did make donations to the conservatives. I would, if I owned half or Mayfair.
Did it influence millions of votes, unlikely - but I'm not a dreamer.
As I said, I would have published it anyway. Its a storm in a teacup - probably. We have bigher issues at hand, and thats to get BREXIT done. Trying to explain which Russian is a Kremlin stooge will get lost in the fake outrage. Which Corbyn is doing a great job with given his blatent BS and rabble raising on the NHS.
Interesting you tried to fake a quote, only last night one of team remain got caught using spurious numbers. Is this the new M.O? Is there anyone on team remaim whom can debate the issues at hand? I know the counter to Macron's latest Russian appeasement. Thats a bigger geopolitical issue than potential Russian money. Ok, some of us look at BREXIT as a financial exercise, bit like the Wu Tang Clan said - C.R.E.A.M. (Cash Rules Everything Around Me), but team remain, is now D.R.E.A.M. (Drugs Rule Everything Around Me).
It seems team remain have lost all sight of the wider world. Everytime Trump has a twitter spaz, the shockwaves are global. He threatened to ramp trade tensions last night. Team UK (that's all of us) are not immune. Likewise, none of you seem to be watching internal EU developments, you just talk about the nirvana that was, not Is (bit like Derek's posts). Look at the tensions between Germany and France on defence, Germany, Netherlands Vs rest of EUzone on finance. Look at acceleration of federal policy, such as banking union. Look at the budgetary problems, when many of the economies are struggling. Look at the record on inflation. Everytime these issues are brought up, remain avoids and goes into distraction mode.
But hey-ho, its forum sport. Either way.
Leavers defend the referendum by saying that the vote is democracy in action and the result should be respected.
Ok, fine. But what if that democratic process was interfered with and the report has evidence ?
Would you be concerned at all or do you not care because the referendum gave the "right" answer ?
Had the result been remain and it was shown that interference had undue influence you'd be most unhappy I would suspect. Unhappier still if there might be some evidence, but it was being withheld from you.
Releasing the report either shows that there was no influence - so why not release it ?
Or there is something to hide - either in terms of brexit or Tory support, maybe both, who knows - none of us, because the report is being withheld.
If there is nothing to hide it looks bad that they are withholding it for apparently "no reason". Trust in politicians wherever you stand is at an all time low, this doesn't help/ in the slightest.
Corbyn/Labour being undesireable for office doesn't automatically mean one should support Johnson/Tories.
Derek Smith said:
I thought parliament, and the government, were against a hard brexit. That's somewhat different to "overturn[ing] a referendum result".
Offering a subsequent referendum is not "overturn[ing] a referendum result" either. It's a perfectly legitimate step in a democracy. Unless, it seems, it fails to give the result some people want.
So why not a single mention of it until the powers-that-be lost in a surprise result?Offering a subsequent referendum is not "overturn[ing] a referendum result" either. It's a perfectly legitimate step in a democracy. Unless, it seems, it fails to give the result some people want.
Why promise ‘once in a lifetime’ and ‘the government will enact your decision’ if doing it all again straight away would be ‘perfectly legitimate’?
Sour grapes.
First time I've read this board.
What I dislike is the dishonesty of so many claims.
I've voted both Tory and LibDem in the past but looking at many of the posts from the Conservative Party on Twitter it's concerning how many of their posts are at best misleading often dishonest and sometimes lies.
How can we be governed by anyone we can't trust?
I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Have a 2nd ref and settle on implementing the result of that whethers it's Leave or Remain.
The country is politically empty and really needs a good clear out.
What I dislike is the dishonesty of so many claims.
I've voted both Tory and LibDem in the past but looking at many of the posts from the Conservative Party on Twitter it's concerning how many of their posts are at best misleading often dishonest and sometimes lies.
How can we be governed by anyone we can't trust?
I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Have a 2nd ref and settle on implementing the result of that whethers it's Leave or Remain.
The country is politically empty and really needs a good clear out.
g7jhp said:
I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Thing is, you might get a short stint of Corbyn, until Momentum get rid of him and replace him with McDonnell, the self-proclaimed Marxist. That's the guy they really want as PM. You know, the one who wants to "smash capitalism".Then any issues related to Brexit will pale into insignificance as crazy ideas like the 4 day week, abolition of private schools, forced transfer of shares to the Marxists and a bunch of other Loony Labour policies get enacted.
Even the worst possible Brexit damage would be nothing compared to what Loony Labour would inflict on the UK, if allowed in.
g7jhp said:
First time I've read this board.
I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Hopefully it's the last as well!I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Even the Labour voters round here say Corbyn's Labour would f
k the UK. Second referendum?
I voted leave, but I would be happy with another, on one condition. It is best of 3.
If leave get the 2nd then that really is it, we leave, however, we have the third vote, but only those that voted to leave get to vote in the 3rd, and that is the deal vs wto.
jsf said:
Makes complete sense to me Derek.
Ties should be banned in the workplace, they serve no useful purpose but provide many risks.
Completely OT but there are so many elements of traditional male working attire that are bizarre (never mind women’s office clothing).Ties should be banned in the workplace, they serve no useful purpose but provide many risks.
A tie, an ancestral remnant of a cravat, that dangles down adding... a pattern. The cravat was the ancestral remnant of the ruff. Which was a bib to prevent food staining cloths. So what does the tie add?
Collared shirts. Exist for giving a tie something to tuck into.
A jacket: designed to be front opening over a collared shirt which is there to give the dangled bit of coloured cloth something to tuck into. As to allow you to admire said dangled cloth.
It’s all a bit bemusing really. I regard Corbyn as a uselesssack but I did have a smidgeon of sympathy back in the day when Cameron would lambast him on his appearance because he didn’t wear ties.
Thank god I work in IT and only have to suit and boot once in a while for client pitches.
Trophy Husband said:
Nobody likes a smart ar5e.
My point remains. It is undemocratic, utterly undemocratic and is making this 'country' look a proper fool's paradise to the rest of the world.
I have a banana if you'd like one?
Nobody likes their rant blown out of the water by logic, would be more appropriate. My point remains. It is undemocratic, utterly undemocratic and is making this 'country' look a proper fool's paradise to the rest of the world.
I have a banana if you'd like one?
You against independents standing too? Should they stand in every ward?
jsf said:
Ties should be banned in the workplace, they serve no useful purpose but provide many risks.
All workplaces?I find a buttoned up collar on a well fitting shirt helps to prevent neck pain because it encourages you to hold your neck and head at the right angle and if you have a done up top button you need to wear a tie otherwise it doesn't look right.
Neck pain can be just as big a problem for the office worker as back pain so those ties might be serving a more useful purpose than you think.
g7jhp said:
I really don't want Corbyn, can't stand the man but faced with him or Boris I'd probably take a short stint of Corbyn.
Have a 2nd ref and settle on implementing the result of that whethers it's Leave or Remain.
.
I'm going to take a wild guess here and suggest you voted Remain Have a 2nd ref and settle on implementing the result of that whethers it's Leave or Remain.
.
. If we do end up with Corbyn as PM on December 13 there are going to be more than a few wealthy remainers going "maybe leaving the EU wasn't so bad after all". A bit late then though when they are going to made to squeal like a pig.
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