Brexit, what have you learnt
Discussion
chrispmartha said:
colin_p said:
What have we learnt?
In the words of Lance Corporal Jones, "They don't like it up em".
And long may it continue they not liking it up em.
What have we learnt?, some Brexiteers have a strange fixation with the War and Germans.In the words of Lance Corporal Jones, "They don't like it up em".
And long may it continue they not liking it up em.
P-Jay said:
I suppose it's valid to claim that it's not in the EU interest for us to flourish post-Brexit, although even a 5% hike in GDP would probably be seen as 'not worth the arseache' given the cost so far, not to mention most other members are in the Euro as well which makes it much harder, but the EU works because of it's members, if it becomes smaller it gets eaten by bigger economies.
I think more fundamentally though you don't need a Masters in Economics to know that it's not possible for everyone to flourish, as you can't be wealthy in isolation, only in comparison with other economies. Either the EU and the UK are wealthy compared to the rest of the world together or one is wealthy compared to the other, and in competition, size matters.
I'm not sure that size has anything to do with it.I think more fundamentally though you don't need a Masters in Economics to know that it's not possible for everyone to flourish, as you can't be wealthy in isolation, only in comparison with other economies. Either the EU and the UK are wealthy compared to the rest of the world together or one is wealthy compared to the other, and in competition, size matters.
UK is the 5th largest economy globally. Germany is 4th. France and Italy are 7 & 8th.
We are massive economically speaking, but making your economy flourish is not about how big you BUT if you can grow it.
Harvard University put out some interesting research that effecticely states Germany has reached it's peak -snd can no longer grow in the manner it has done. The UK by comparison is ranked much lower for industrial adaption and efficiency. Furthermore, we are better diversified.
If the world stops buying BMWs, what does Germany do then or switch too? Their services sector is a mess, and they staring down the barrel of a nationalised banking system. They have made themselves great in one sector.... the spend they need to innovate is in the billions (and many multiples thereof). They also need to change how they think.
The medicine each economy needs to grow are different. Comparisons of GDPs are largely nonsense as no 2 economies are alike. In a tarriff fight with the US, Germany gets ironed out. Our GDP growth is poor due to under investment in business. Irelands GDP growth is very large, but relies heavily on corporation tax wheezes (that they are going to the ECJ to have a tussle on). That super sized GDP isn't actually benefitting the populous.
Big is good in a negotiation or getting a bulk discount (on tarriffs) - but it doesn't generate growth on its own. If we get the promised FTA, we are not disadvantaged exporting to the EU. If you look at the Eurozone, size is actually killing them. You have a lopsided credit build up, a negative rate only tracking lower and a split down the middle ECB. It's a car crash of epic proportions, and the only way to survive is doing sone extra, extra, extraordinary intervention (or every member is going to have to put taxes into orbit to do fiscal drop). The ECB expansive monetary policy might have saved the EURO, but its not generating growth....
Anyhoo, I don't want to be an argumentative prick about - its an observation / opinion (that some happen to share).
If BREXIT taught me anything, people make statements based on anecodotal and subjective experienece and try to apply that to debate. These experiences simply are not representative of the economic situation. Even worse, sone of these people are walts / trolls of the highest order.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Pastor Of Muppets said:
but another thing we have learned in the last 3 or so years from politicians, Its all
about what they want not what the public votes.
Many leading Brexiteers, include Rees Mogg and the now PM, voted against May's deal, hence blocking Brexit, a fact that now seems to have been conveniently overlooked. Boris and his "let's get Brexit done" mantra, well it could have been done in March if you hadn't blocked it. Blocked because it wasn't the Brexit they wanted.about what they want not what the public votes.
As for self serving politicians, well 20+ of them recently threw their entire political careers under the bus to vote against the government because they thought it was the right thing to do, even though it was bad for them personally. How many on here who moan about politicians have sacrificed a job they loved on a point of principle?
308 opposition MP's did.
Here's a handy guide
https://ig.ft.com/brexit-exit-deal-vote/
digimeistter said:
I love the way the remainers keep trotting this out.
308 opposition MP's did.
Here's a handy guide
https://ig.ft.com/brexit-exit-deal-vote/
Is that the point he's making though? What I genuinely don't get is that Rees Mogg etc did eventually vote for May's deal, having previously voted against it twice calling it a bad deal. After he resigned from the cabinet Boris allegedly stated that staying in was better than the WA, yet from all accounts he's about to present the exact same deal in a new frock and suddenly that sits well with most leavers. Though I have little time for Farage, I consider him to be one of the few to have been consistent in all of this.308 opposition MP's did.
Here's a handy guide
https://ig.ft.com/brexit-exit-deal-vote/
kingcatastrophe BREXIT is much like religion.
You pick a side, based on zero actual facts, then manically support your completely arbitrary God, even if it means killing someone else because your made-up god is much betterer than their made-up god. Anyone who has an opposite opinion is quite clearly completely insane and needs to be killed to death to prove the point.
You pick a side, based on zero actual facts, then manically support your completely arbitrary God, even if it means killing someone else because your made-up god is much betterer than their made-up god. Anyone who has an opposite opinion is quite clearly completely insane and needs to be killed to death to prove the point.
Electro1980 said:
Biggest thing I have learnt, a worryingly high percentage of people (on all side) can vote yet have absolutely no idea what they are voting for or how our political or legal system works.
What.....you seriously never knew that!!!! 
Winston Churchill once said that the biggest argument against democracy was a 5 minute chat with the average voter. And that was about 60 years ago!
The average member of the British public couldn't pour piss out of a boot without instructions on the heel.
Max_Torque said:
BREXIT is much like religion.
You pick a side, based on zero actual facts, then manically support your completely arbitrary God, even if it means killing someone else because your made-up god is much betterer than their made-up god. Anyone who has an opposite opinion is quite clearly completely insane and needs to be killed to death to prove the point.
I was going to post earlier that it does seem like the divide between the religious and atheists, namely we all have our views, and all the shouting and internet posting in the world is unlikely to change anyone's mind. You pick a side, based on zero actual facts, then manically support your completely arbitrary God, even if it means killing someone else because your made-up god is much betterer than their made-up god. Anyone who has an opposite opinion is quite clearly completely insane and needs to be killed to death to prove the point.
Helicopter123 said:
I've learnt that the true value of a university education is the ability to understand difficult problems, to analyse and to identify spurious information.
A questioning mind can see through the "fake news" peddled on Social Media and will identify the truth.
But you still peddle twitter and facebook in your rants? So how do you justify your post?A questioning mind can see through the "fake news" peddled on Social Media and will identify the truth.
All SM is fake and no rational person would believe it, so a uni education is worth nothing if SM is accepted as the truth.
Helicopter123 said:
I've learnt that the true value of a university education is the ability to understand difficult problems, to analyse and to identify spurious information.
A questioning mind can see through the "fake news" peddled on Social Media and will identify the truth.
Or the ability to work in a call centre A questioning mind can see through the "fake news" peddled on Social Media and will identify the truth.
GT119 said:
Murph7355 said:
BOR said:
...
2.Very surprised how many millions of english people really, really do not like foreigners living in the UK and would like to send them all back.
Evidence of this?2.Very surprised how many millions of english people really, really do not like foreigners living in the UK and would like to send them all back.
Or are you one of those who cannot understand the difference between controlled immigration (something the rest of the world does, and even the EU where it suits) and racism?
The evidence suggest that the UK ranks better most of our european peers with regard to prejudice against immigrants. BOR's anecdotal claim about "Many millions of English people would like to send all foreigners back" could benefit with some evidence to support it.........
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2019/02/26/bri...
https://inews.co.uk/news/uk/intolerance-of-immigra...
Regarding the use of Johnny Foreigner; it's still regularly used by supercilious dimwits on PH.........I don't recall seeing or hearing anyone else use it.
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