Climate change - the POLITICAL debate (Vol 6)
Discussion
hairykrishna said:
Sensei Rob said:
Great. So what caused it?
And how about the rest of my points you were going to debunk:
1. Early Earth had higher CO2 levels.
2. The Medieval Warm period was not caused by humans, rather it occurred naturally.
3. CO2 makes plants grow bigger
4. We know have the technology to remove CO2 from the air and convert it back into fuel.
1) Yes, depending on when you decide 'early earth' was.And how about the rest of my points you were going to debunk:
1. Early Earth had higher CO2 levels.
2. The Medieval Warm period was not caused by humans, rather it occurred naturally.
3. CO2 makes plants grow bigger
4. We know have the technology to remove CO2 from the air and convert it back into fuel.
2) Yes.
3) It's a bit more complicated than that. A lot of plant growth is nitrogen-limited and benefits of high CO2 are easily reduced or removed by even a degree or two of extra heat.
4) "Know have"? If you mean "now have", we've had the technology for donkeys years. It's at an energy cost though so if your goal is to reduce atmospheric CO2 it doesn't really help unless you're going to dedicate a load of new solar/nuclear purely to carbon capture.
Did you actually have a point? Or was this just a tour of denier starting points from decades past for nostalgia purposes?
My point is that we ought to stop worrying about the climate, which is totally fine with around 15 million species living in harmony.
Sensei Rob said:
robinessex said:
Sensei Rob said:
My point is that we ought to stop worrying about the climate, which is totally fine with around 15 million species living in harmony.
Are the occupants of this room included in that statement?
powerstroke said:
Sensei Rob said:
robinessex said:
Sensei Rob said:
My point is that we ought to stop worrying about the climate, which is totally fine with around 15 million species living in harmony.
Are the occupants of this room included in that statement?Sensei Rob said:
hairykrishna said:
Sensei Rob said:
Great. So what caused it?
And how about the rest of my points you were going to debunk:
1. Early Earth had higher CO2 levels.
2. The Medieval Warm period was not caused by humans, rather it occurred naturally.
3. CO2 makes plants grow bigger
4. We know have the technology to remove CO2 from the air and convert it back into fuel.
1) Yes, depending on when you decide 'early earth' was.And how about the rest of my points you were going to debunk:
1. Early Earth had higher CO2 levels.
2. The Medieval Warm period was not caused by humans, rather it occurred naturally.
3. CO2 makes plants grow bigger
4. We know have the technology to remove CO2 from the air and convert it back into fuel.
2) Yes.
3) It's a bit more complicated than that. A lot of plant growth is nitrogen-limited and benefits of high CO2 are easily reduced or removed by even a degree or two of extra heat.
4) "Know have"? If you mean "now have", we've had the technology for donkeys years. It's at an energy cost though so if your goal is to reduce atmospheric CO2 it doesn't really help unless you're going to dedicate a load of new solar/nuclear purely to carbon capture.
Did you actually have a point? Or was this just a tour of denier starting points from decades past for nostalgia purposes?
My point is that we ought to stop worrying about the climate, which is totally fine with around 15 million species living in harmony.
Based on the science I think your point is incorrect but there you go.
durbster said:
powerstroke said:
Hopefully the climate cretins will die out
Bit harsh. I'd settle for them simply learning how to do basic critical thinking.Good luck with that!! Belief has replaced it , hence no critical objective work on climate change,
Just the same crap going round in circles....
powerstroke said:
durbster said:
powerstroke said:
Hopefully the climate cretins will die out
Bit harsh. I'd settle for them simply learning how to do basic critical thinking.Good luck with that!! Belief has replaced it , hence no critical objective work on climate change,
Just the same crap going round in circles....
Government has no climate change plan - MPs
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56285239
The government has been hit by a double whammy of reports from MPs criticising its performance on climate change.
The influential Public Accounts Committee (PAC) says ministers have "no plan" to meet climate change targets, two years after setting them in law. And the business committee says the vital UN climate conference scheduled for Glasgow in November will fail unless its goals are made clear.
The government says both reports are inaccurate and unfair.
The PAC's report says ministers still don't have a coordinated strategy to realise the goal of removing almost all the carbon emissions from Britain by 2050. The report notes that the government intends to publish what the MPs call a "plethora" of strategies setting out how it will reduce emissions in sectors ranging from transport to heating buildings.
But, it says, the policies aren't agreed yet.
What's happened to the CC emergency then?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56285239
The government has been hit by a double whammy of reports from MPs criticising its performance on climate change.
The influential Public Accounts Committee (PAC) says ministers have "no plan" to meet climate change targets, two years after setting them in law. And the business committee says the vital UN climate conference scheduled for Glasgow in November will fail unless its goals are made clear.
The government says both reports are inaccurate and unfair.
The PAC's report says ministers still don't have a coordinated strategy to realise the goal of removing almost all the carbon emissions from Britain by 2050. The report notes that the government intends to publish what the MPs call a "plethora" of strategies setting out how it will reduce emissions in sectors ranging from transport to heating buildings.
But, it says, the policies aren't agreed yet.
What's happened to the CC emergency then?
Then and now: A 'megadrought' in California
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
Recent revelation but no surprise - the cost of Net Zero is now put at £1.3 trillion by 2050, with annual costs 40% higher in 2050, compared to the joke numbers from the Climate Change Committee which government officials were previously pressured to use ... "the Treasury admitted". Still a lowball, watch this space.
turbobloke said:
Recent revelation but no surprise - the cost of Net Zero is now put at £1.3 trillion by 2050, with annual costs 40% higher in 2050, compared to the joke numbers from the Climate Change Committee which government officials were previously pressured to use ... "the Treasury admitted". Still a lowball, watch this space.
Even if net zero cost £1.59 it can’t be delivered by 2050.
Kawasicki said:
turbobloke said:
Recent revelation but no surprise - the cost of Net Zero is now put at £1.3 trillion by 2050, with annual costs 40% higher in 2050, compared to the joke numbers from the Climate Change Committee which government officials were previously pressured to use ... "the Treasury admitted". Still a lowball, watch this space.
Even if net zero cost £1.59 it can’t be delivered by 2050.Kawasicki said:
kerplunk said:
Nobody can predict the future Kawasicki!
Of course they can.Here’s a prediction. I bet you that the sun isn’t going to turn into a pine tree within the next 50 years.
kerplunk said:
Kawasicki said:
kerplunk said:
Nobody can predict the future Kawasicki!
Of course they can.Here’s a prediction. I bet you that the sun isn’t going to turn into a pine tree within the next 50 years.
robinessex said:
Then and now: A 'megadrought' in California
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
Just like the wildfire issue, the lack of water issue in California is largely self-inflicted.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
robinessex said:
Then and now: A 'megadrought' in California
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
It is just your fundamental lack of understanding of chaotic systems as shown by many posts on here. A simple experiment you can try at home to prove the point. Place a bowl or something else that is a hemisphere, upside down on the floor. Balance a table tennis ball on top (or something else - point is that it has to be unstable and likely to drop off). Assuming you have some breezes or vibrations in the house at some point the ball will roll off. This is equivalent to a chaotic system - it is very sensitive to an initial input as a slight push in any direction will set the ball rolling. Yet if you tried to model the movement of air in the room you wouldn’t be able to do so with enough precision. So the exact end position of the ball can’t be known - because it all depends upon which direction it starts to roll in. However that doesn’t mean we can’t say anything about the end position of the ball. In fact we can work out fairly precisely how far it will roll away from the bowl. We just don’t know in which direction. Same with the climate. We can’t model exactly what is going to happen every day of the year but we can say what is going to happen over a whole year at a global level. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-562...
In our monthly feature, Then and Now, we reveal some of the ways that planet Earth has been changing against the backdrop of a warming world. Here, we look at the effects of extreme weather on a crucial reservoir that supplies water to millions of people in northern California.
This year is likely to be critically dry for California. Winter storms that dumped heavy snow and rain across the state are not expected to be substantial enough to counterbalance drought conditions.
Lake Oroville plays a key role in California's complex water delivery system.
We can't predict the weather for more than a few days in advance, yet we can apportion weather events to CC.
Humans and their domesticated animals now comprise 96% of the biomass of all mammals.
The mass of human made artefacts (buildings, roads, vehicles, etc) now exceeds total biomass of all living things on the planet (plants, animals, bacteria etc). As of 1900 it was about 1%, just to show the pace of change.
Micro plastic pollution is found pretty much everywhere on the planet and in almost all food chains.
But of course human activity is insignificant when it comes to the atmosphere and climate...
The mass of human made artefacts (buildings, roads, vehicles, etc) now exceeds total biomass of all living things on the planet (plants, animals, bacteria etc). As of 1900 it was about 1%, just to show the pace of change.
Micro plastic pollution is found pretty much everywhere on the planet and in almost all food chains.
But of course human activity is insignificant when it comes to the atmosphere and climate...
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