Climate change - the POLITICAL debate (Vol 6)
Discussion
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Yes, but now I am beginning to understand Gretianity; you believe that modern life is going to destroy the planet, but only the faithful are allowed to continue in it, it's the kafirs who must give up everything.
Bit of a comprehension fail there.I'm not asking you, the individual, to do or not do anything. Or saying that people accepting the scientific position of AGW should be allowed to do anything you conspiracy theorists can't do.
Get a grip.
Edited by Gadgetmac on Wednesday 20th November 11:50
Amazing.
For some strange reason the word "credulous" comes to mind, perhaps applicable to the whole of humanity but almost certainly applicable the majority of the ER foot soldiers and those not mobilised but sharing the same world view.
ZeroGroundZero said:
I noticed on the election TV debate last night that both Corbyn and Johnson looked scared to death to not say a single opposing word on the question "is global warming the most important issue of politics".
So many people out there being pushed in to a "one political narrative" mindset (much like "political correctness" does), that any leader daring to question that entrenched narrative would face huge media backlash and would quite likely impact on votes at election time.
It is worrying times that people are fed the same narrative over and over again and as such our potential leaders not be in a position to even question it.
Welcome to the modern world.logic and reason fell by the wayside a while ago.So many people out there being pushed in to a "one political narrative" mindset (much like "political correctness" does), that any leader daring to question that entrenched narrative would face huge media backlash and would quite likely impact on votes at election time.
It is worrying times that people are fed the same narrative over and over again and as such our potential leaders not be in a position to even question it.
LongQ said:
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Yes, but now I am beginning to understand Gretianity; you believe that modern life is going to destroy the planet, but only the faithful are allowed to continue in it, it's the kafirs who must give up everything.
Bit of a comprehension fail there.I'm not asking you, the individual, to do or not do anything. Or saying that people accepting the scientific position of AGW should be allowed to do anything you conspiracy theorists can't do.
Get a grip.
Edited by Gadgetmac on Wednesday 20th November 11:50
Amazing.
For some strange reason the word "credulous" comes to mind, perhaps applicable to the whole of humanity but almost certainly applicable the majority of the ER foot soldiers and those not mobilised but sharing the same world view.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Gadgetmac said:
LongQ said:
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Yes, but now I am beginning to understand Gretianity; you believe that modern life is going to destroy the planet, but only the faithful are allowed to continue in it, it's the kafirs who must give up everything.
Bit of a comprehension fail there.I'm not asking you, the individual, to do or not do anything. Or saying that people accepting the scientific position of AGW should be allowed to do anything you conspiracy theorists can't do.
Get a grip.
Edited by Gadgetmac on Wednesday 20th November 11:50
Amazing.
For some strange reason the word "credulous" comes to mind, perhaps applicable to the whole of humanity but almost certainly applicable the majority of the ER foot soldiers and those not mobilised but sharing the same world view.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
On what basis would one adopt a philosophy for what it the "right" thing for a human to be doing and then ignore the actions that support that view?
Are you suggesting that people, fundamentally, prefer to follow instructions rather than take personal responsibility?
You could well have a point in terms of ER and similar and the "Climate Debate" . Miss Greta instructing the massed young, whose primary life experience up to their age is probably defined by being fed with instructions, would be a clear example.
Most human mass movements, notably political and religious, have been based on leaders with a desire to dominate and direct their flocks of pliant subservients.
If the only way to make them follow requirements is to manage their lives for them it's probably not too difficult in the age of global communications to find a way to do that more completely than ever before. It will be a Brave New World when Climate Control is implemented.
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
El stovey said:
Lots of conflicting messages on this page alone.
At the top we’ve got posters saying government climate policy is losing jobs
Then we have posters saying corbyn and Boris perhaps don’t believe it all but pretend they do to get votes. Then the same poster is saying it’s about wealth redistribution but from the individual to big companies
Then another is disagreeing and saying it’s about wealth redistribution but from the big companies to the government for taxation purposes.
Then the old it’s all b
ks because it was hot in 1976.
So really, do you guys think ‘the government’ is pretending to agree with AGW science to raise tax and votes but lose jobs? And that most other governments are simultaneously involved in the same deception?
Seems more likely that the government agrees with the scientists that AGW is real and is trying to reduce emissions and make some money and help the economy and industry with becoming a leader in new technologies whilst not damage the economy too much along the way.
People have different views, personally I think that jobs have and will be lost on a large scale in the quest to achieve zero carbon, unless we are going to only buy products from zero CO2 countries we will be at a disadvantage cost wise, Honda was a big employer in Swindon, now they are moving back production to Japan, the British government told them diesel was the future not petrol, so at great expense they designed and built one, a few years down the line the government declared diesel is bad and electric was the future even those may not have the capacity to charge them, would you stay? I wouldn't.At the top we’ve got posters saying government climate policy is losing jobs
Then we have posters saying corbyn and Boris perhaps don’t believe it all but pretend they do to get votes. Then the same poster is saying it’s about wealth redistribution but from the individual to big companies
Then another is disagreeing and saying it’s about wealth redistribution but from the big companies to the government for taxation purposes.
Then the old it’s all b
ks because it was hot in 1976. So really, do you guys think ‘the government’ is pretending to agree with AGW science to raise tax and votes but lose jobs? And that most other governments are simultaneously involved in the same deception?
Seems more likely that the government agrees with the scientists that AGW is real and is trying to reduce emissions and make some money and help the economy and industry with becoming a leader in new technologies whilst not damage the economy too much along the way.
There will be a lot of companies that require cheap reliable electricity that will not survive in the UK, what will replace them where are the green jobs ? As a country we will get poorer, that mean less for schools hospitals and police for what benefit, it will not affect the global temperature so I ask the question why?
Altering data to make it appear colder in the past is wrong, the problem the scientists have is the same as the king's new clothes, they have to maintain the narrative and are prepared to do anything to maintain the story for the politicians, who pay for more research,
all politicians are trying to out do one another with regards decarbonisation, they believe it's good for votes, sadly they are unable to tell the truth about the real consequences of their actions
turbobloke said:
Etypephil said:
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
Mmmmm that sounds truly carbonaceous 
PRTVR said:
all politicians are trying to out do one another with regards decarbonisation, they believe it's good for votes, sadly they are unable to tell the truth about the real consequences of their actions
Good reply.The last part seems to be very true and also very concerning to the modern western world.
I am just wondering however if the politicians in the UK will be as bad as Merkel has been in Germany on her 'green crusade' ?
Germany now finds itself in dire need for reliable energy sources, having gone on the green crusade due to heavy green influence in their government party membership. The german economy has been stuttering for a number of years as green levies are placed up on businesses and consumers - along with political decisions that have detrimental effects.
But in the world of politicians and their ultimate desire for government office, it seems economic performance and public services come second place to vote gainer missions.
I think it may take more than one country's economy to go bust to demonstrate to the indoctrinated climate crowd that going "zero carbon dioxide" is foolhardy and totally unnecessary.
But at the end of the day its not the politicians that pay the price for such incompetence and ignorance, it is the public. The public are the ones having to pay inflated consumer prices, inflated energy prices to keep warm in the winter, also the results of poor economic performance etc. , all giving rise to unnecessary rise in poverty levels, additional winter deaths and lack of investment and services provision by government.
All coming to a door step near you in the coming years ! (as it seems none of our politicians have the ball$ to stand up to the greeny narrative)
jshell said:
Randy Winkman said:
dickymint said:
Randy Winkman said:
Exactly. That argument is a complete distraction.
Distraction from what? It’s bang on topic at the moment.t who wants to change things for everyone else whilst not adhering or being an example. Sounds a bit like Communism to me...Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
If so it seems we actually agree about something - the "can't see how it would work" part.
Is that about right?
The big difference could be that I am prepared to question the so called and often self proclaimed experts and the proposals they put forward.
It seems like a reasonable thing to do. None of them are perfect. Some of them are likely to be deeply flawed for various reasons. The most voluble and self promoting are the ones most likely to be compensating for their shortcomings. That seems to be the way things tend to be. It's a perfectly common human trait.
Which is all the more reason to question everything.
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
Thought I'd better post this before I get my nose rubbed in it......................
https://www.nme.com/news/greta-thunberg-and-extinc...
https://www.nme.com/news/greta-thunberg-and-extinc...
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Etypephil said:
Gadgetmac said:
Crikey the stupidometer is hitting max today.
I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
Indeed it is.I said I'm (personally) not telling anyone what to do or not do. That's not MY job.
Work the rest out for yourself.
You are however, telling us that we cannot expect the mega rich to cease exacerbating a problem which they, you, and your fellow Gretians are convinced exists.
We kafirs have already worked it out; there is no man made climate emergency, therefore nothing we do, or don't do will have any measurable effect on whatever (natural) climate changes do occur.
For my part, I'm off out in my supercharged V8, to buy steaks for this evening's dinner, which I will marinate with melted butter, then grill on a gas hob.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
I was thinking that, but didn't post it.
dickymint said:
Thought I'd better post this before I get my nose rubbed in it......................
https://www.nme.com/news/greta-thunberg-and-extinc...
Leader in 'under fire' industry trying to appease the green loonies! Utter, utter waste of time, they are relentless in their self flagellating idiocy. Witness some of the mental posts on this thread.https://www.nme.com/news/greta-thunberg-and-extinc...
Gadgetmac said:
Look flat earther, I'm telling you that at the moment i, that's me, not anyone else, is telling you that I, yes that's me again not anyone else, can't see how it would work.
People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
No, people think they need to travel. If only they could only truly accept just how dire the climate emergency is, then they would shurely change their minds.People need to travel and some people need to travel privately as far as I can see.
I've given you an example of why from just yesterday.
I would like it to be otherwise but I don't think it's doable now.
It's dire 
The world is going to end in 12 years if we don't adopt socialism and go vegan.
Debatable? You'd think so.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8JZo6PzpCU&fe...
It's good all-round: there are objective data-based rejections of agw climate wibble, and lots of messengers fior agw supporters to shoot while not making any valid point whatsoever.
The world is going to end in 12 years if we don't adopt socialism and go vegan.Debatable? You'd think so.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8JZo6PzpCU&fe...
It's good all-round: there are objective data-based rejections of agw climate wibble, and lots of messengers fior agw supporters to shoot while not making any valid point whatsoever.
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