Jeremy Corbyn (Vol. 4)
Discussion
kev1974 said:
Been in politics since 2015. 2015! And even then got an easy ride to selection as it was the era of women-only shortlists. That would be truly a meteoric rise, from zero to party leader in under five years. It will show.
Though to be fair, William Hague was only an MP for 8 years before becoming leader of the opposition.paulrockliffe said:
REALIST123 said:
They might just go underground within Labour for a few years, regroup and try again later.
A new split from Labour, (The Militant Party?) with their loony left policies and nothing else wouldn’t have a chance. They need some level of cover of respectability.
Why would they go underground? .A new split from Labour, (The Militant Party?) with their loony left policies and nothing else wouldn’t have a chance. They need some level of cover of respectability.
So what they need is some kind of Trojan horse i.e. to *look* much more moderate than they are, use that to get into Government & then "unleash hell".
Brown & Blair did exactly the same to a lesser degree : "No income tax rises under Labour"....
Just fiscal drag on allowances, a raid on the pension funds, sell off the gold & raise every other kind of tax & duty you can think of instead - but oh no, they didn't raise taxes
Wombat3 said:
Because they now know that a full frontal Marxist campaign goes down like a lead balloon.
So what they need is some kind of Trojan horse i.e. to *look* much more moderate than they are, use that to get into Government & then "unleash hell".
Brown & Blair did exactly the same to a lesser degree : "No income tax rises under Labour"....
Just fiscal drag on allowances, a raid on the pension funds, sell off the gold & raise every other kind of tax & duty you can think of instead - but oh no, they didn't raise taxes
I don't think that is the message from this election.So what they need is some kind of Trojan horse i.e. to *look* much more moderate than they are, use that to get into Government & then "unleash hell".
Brown & Blair did exactly the same to a lesser degree : "No income tax rises under Labour"....
Just fiscal drag on allowances, a raid on the pension funds, sell off the gold & raise every other kind of tax & duty you can think of instead - but oh no, they didn't raise taxes
Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
kev1974 said:
Been in politics since 2015. 2015! And even then got an easy ride to selection as it was the era of women-only shortlists. That would be truly a meteoric rise, from zero to party leader in under five years. It will show.
At least she has actually had a proper job, several of them in fact, from about 2000 to 2015. So many of today's politicians (on all sides) have only one or two year's "work" on their CV if that, and spent most of their "working life" sitting on the councillor / MP gravy train. Swinson was one of those, one job wonders for a couple of years before being elected.
Long-Bailey is one of the few MPs who nominated Corbyn for leader so is considered "sound" by the Momentum lot. That, and the fact that she is a woman, seem to be her primary qualifications for the job.At least she has actually had a proper job, several of them in fact, from about 2000 to 2015. So many of today's politicians (on all sides) have only one or two year's "work" on their CV if that, and spent most of their "working life" sitting on the councillor / MP gravy train. Swinson was one of those, one job wonders for a couple of years before being elected.
biggbn said:
ORD said:
I don't think that is the message from this election.
Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
Agreed, have said as much on this very board. Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
biggbn said:
ORD said:
I don't think that is the message from this election.
Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
Agreed, have said as much on this very board. Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
The world cannot be put in reverse to give an alternative Labour leader or to change the referendum result. Complex national and international dynamics could and would have led to an alternative present condition, one that is simply not knowable and certainly not by removing Corbyn for an unknown other, reversing brexit, then expecting everything else to be somehow the same.
vaud said:
kev1974 said:
Been in politics since 2015. 2015! And even then got an easy ride to selection as it was the era of women-only shortlists. That would be truly a meteoric rise, from zero to party leader in under five years. It will show.
Though to be fair, William Hague was only an MP for 8 years before becoming leader of the opposition.Dont like rolls said:
What a dynamic duo that would be 
turbobloke said:
biggbn said:
ORD said:
I don't think that is the message from this election.
Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
Agreed, have said as much on this very board. Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
The world cannot be put in reverse to give an alternative Labour leader or to change the referendum result. Complex national and international dynamics could and would have led to an alternative present condition, one that is simply not knowable and certainly not by removing Corbyn for an unknown other, reversing brexit, then expecting everything else to be somehow the same.
That is a view I agree agree with. Corbyn is toxic.
Whether Labour would have had a majority is another matter but the election would certainly have been a much more close run event.
768 said:
That made me laugh almost as much as when I saw the Emily Thornberry is threatening to sue Caroline Flint!!
The guardian:
“Emily Thornberry, a potential Labour leadership candidate, has threatened to sue her former colleague Caroline Flint for “making up s
t” about her.Thornberry said she had consulted lawyers after Flint, who lost her Don Valley seat last week, claimed on live television that Thornberry had once said to a fellow MP in a leave-voting seat that she was “glad my constituents aren’t as stupid as yours”.
biggbn said:
I merely answered a question as a poster questioned my 'authority' to comment on a first (albeit mine is from a normal university and not oxbridge) and yes, I rarely proof read informal chats on an internet forum. I did not realise it was a prerequisite of membership?
It’s pretty safe to say that a 2:1 from Oxford will tend to indicate someone being more academic than many who got a first elsewhere.Edited by biggbn on Sunday 15th December 18:34
Oxbridge does still tend to get the pick of the best students at age 18.
turbobloke said:
Dont like rolls said:
What a dynamic duo that would be ORD said:
I don't think that is the message from this election.
Remove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
I don't think many individual policies were a big problem, but the sheer scale of the spending, coupled with the message that these were not a wish list to bring in over 10-15 years but policies they would bring through in their first term, then added to with more spending promises in addition to those in the manifesto just a few days later, was IMO seen by many as an indication of just how little grasp of the real world Corbynites have. Add to that the idea that this can all be done by taxing just the top 5% ,,,,,,,,,,, people just aren't that stupidRemove Corbyn and Brexit and Labour would have done fine. The manifesto was not anything like as big a problem as people are now saying.
vaud said:
kev1974 said:
Been in politics since 2015. 2015! And even then got an easy ride to selection as it was the era of women-only shortlists. That would be truly a meteoric rise, from zero to party leader in under five years. It will show.
Though to be fair, William Hague was only an MP for 8 years before becoming leader of the opposition.Although he had worked in the party for decades.
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