Manchester Derby (football) racism arrest.

[chrispmartha]

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

[Thankyou4calling]

chrispmartha said:

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

[anonymous-user]

Thankyou4calling said:

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

Utter bks

[Digga]

Thankyou4calling said:

chrispmartha said:

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

I think the caveat would be, in this case, the business would have to be seen to actively condemn racism and deal, robustly, with the employee.

[chrispmartha]

Thankyou4calling said:

chrispmartha said:

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

Have you had much experience in employing racists?

[ChevyChase77]

chrispmartha said:

Thankyou4calling said:

chrispmartha said:

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

Have you had much experience in employing racists?

What's your suggestion then? Never employ this chap again?

[Keoparakolo]

stitched said:

I work for a German multinational company, coincidentally I hold a CIPD qualification, if my firm tried to dismiss me for behaviour outside work with nothing tying me to the company then I would, quite rightly imho, take them to the cleaners.

That’s great. Assuming you work within the UK then your definition of the cleaners might be quite disappointing. The maximum you can claim is probably a lot lower than you think it is.

[chrispmartha]

ChevyChase77 said:

chrispmartha said:

Thankyou4calling said:

chrispmartha said:

Flip the situation around.

I run a small local business, if one of my employees was caught making racist gestures on national TV and my companies name was then put in the press and my customers decide to take their business elsewhere because of that association, why should I be able to dismiss the employee?

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

Have you had much experience in employing racists?

What's your suggestion then? Never employ this chap again?

My suggestion is that it’s up to his employers to decide whether the suspend him or eventually dismiss him if it’s within the law. And any other employers can employ him if they see fit.

What’s your suggestion? You can do whatever you like outside of work even if it is detrimental to your employers and expect to keep your job?

[The Moose]

Warby80 said:

I think the wages in football make more sense when you look at it as an entertainment industry rather than a sport.

I dont ever really hear anyone complaining about actors earning $100million+ a year…

Which actors make over 100 million bucks a year?

[Thankyou4calling]

Brooking10 said:

Utter bks

Not in my experience. Seen it dozens of times

[Thankyou4calling]

The Moose said:

Which actors make over 100 million bucks a year?

Tony Blair maybe.

[Keoparakolo]

Thankyou4calling said:

Not in my experience. Seen it dozens of times

Well let’s see half a dozen examples of this then.

[Thankyou4calling]

Keoparakolo said:

Well let’s see half a dozen examples of this then.

Really!

Ryanair 60 minute national tv show slagging em off. Sales go through the roof

Easy jet. As above.

Energies fitness. Dozens of complaints about ad for fat people. Goes viral. Member numbers soar

Celebrity breaks law. Clicks go up. Career takes off.

Land Rover slated for reliability. Sales increase.

Hotel knocked for refusing gays. Rooms full.

1000s more. I’m surprised you are unaware

[Keoparakolo]

Thankyou4calling said:

Keoparakolo said:

Well let’s see half a dozen examples of this then.

Really!

Ryanair 60 minute national tv show slagging em off. Sales go through the roof

Easy jet. As above.

Energies fitness. Dozens of complaints about ad for fat people. Goes viral. Member numbers soar

Celebrity breaks law. Clicks go up. Career takes off.

Land Rover slated for reliability. Sales increase.

Hotel knocked for refusing gays. Rooms full.

1000s more. I’m surprised you are unaware

They are nothing like this. Nothing at all

There are only two that are breaking the law. The celebrity isn’t a company, so that’s irrelevant.

The hotel refusing the gay couple isn’t quite the success story that you’ve painted

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/10320111...

Just to add. I can’t ever see any company increasing turnover / profit on the back of having an employee acting like a racist moron. Feel free to prove me wrong though.

Edited by Keoparakolo on Wednesday 11th December 15:42

[Thankyou4calling]

I can’t be bothered. You’ll be banned soon anyway. Jeeez.

Asks for examples of bad publicity not being damaging.

Gets examples.

Still argues the opposite

I’m out!

[Keoparakolo]

Thankyou4calling said:

I can’t be bothered. You’ll be banned soon anyway. Jeeez.

Asks for examples of bad publicity not being damaging.

Gets examples.

Still argues the opposite

I’m out!

You said for any reason, but as this is a specific racist reason, then it would help your cause if you chose examples like that. The only one that came close was the hotel one, which didn’t really work.

Bad publicity isn’t always damaging, I’ll accept that, but it depends why. In this case it can’t and won’t be positive for the business, not least because they operate a lot in the public sector and that could make it difficult for them to win new contracts.

[Neonblau]

Thankyou4calling said:

Really!

Ryanair 60 minute national tv show slagging em off. Sales go through the roof

Easy jet. As above.

Energies fitness. Dozens of complaints about ad for fat people. Goes viral. Member numbers soar

Celebrity breaks law. Clicks go up. Career takes off.

Land Rover slated for reliability. Sales increase.

Hotel knocked for refusing gays. Rooms full.

1000s more. I’m surprised you are unaware

Not exactly "small businesses" as you mentioned though are they. The one small business in your list is a hotel that's gone tits up as a direct result of the publicity.

[Neonblau]

Thankyou4calling said:

In my experience and observation if a small business appears on national TV for any reason it’s trade spikes!

No publicity is bad publicity.

[stitched]

Keoparakolo said:

stitched said:

I work for a German multinational company, coincidentally I hold a CIPD qualification, if my firm tried to dismiss me for behaviour outside work with nothing tying me to the company then I would, quite rightly imho, take them to the cleaners.

That’s great. Assuming you work within the UK then your definition of the cleaners might be quite disappointing. The maximum you can claim is probably a lot lower than you think it is.

I’m quite aware what an employee can claim in an unfair dismissal case thanks, the question of course was whether the firm were correct in disciplinary action of an employee on their day off who wasn’t visibly an employee.
I say not.

[Keoparakolo]

stitched said:

I’m quite aware what an employee can claim in an unfair dismissal case thanks, the question of course was whether the firm were correct in disciplinary action of an employee on their day off who wasn’t visibly an employee.
I say not.

That’s fine. Look further up the thread and you’ll see that my thoughts are very similar to yours from an employment perspective, from a personal perspective I believe he deserves to lose his job. There’s a distinct possibility this could happen. If he is working on contracts in some aspects of the public sector then he’ll need a CRB, if he’s prosecuted and found guilty this could be a simple way to dismiss him. Kier may simply be awaiting the police outcome before proceeding whilst leaving him suspended on full pay in the meantime.

Of course, they may choose to act beforehand. It’s up to them.

My point around limits was just your choice of words about “taking them to the cleaners”, that really doesn’t happen given the limits. Depending on your salary I’ve seen a lot of company’s simply ignore the whole worry of employment law and offer more than could possibly be won. You’d be a fool to risk that for a 50/50 chance of a lower sum.