So what now for the Labour party?

[Foliage]

Johnnytheboy said:

Mothersruin said:

The Momentum talking heads last night kept saying that their policies were extremely popular, Brexit was the issue.

For the time being, they're going to double-down on this...

Then why, in the name of all that's holy, if they knew this, did they try so hard not to make their offering about Brexit?

Yep all they had to say is 'make Brexit happen' as part of the manifesto and it would have been closer.

Labour is too far left as everyone else has been saying, and they need to knock the use of the word 'comrade' on the fking head its 2020 next year ffs. Im all for socialism but its too much.

[PAULJ5555]

I think all parties need scrapping and new ones made up - too much baggage all of them.

Hopefully this will stop the "But I always vote Lab/Cons" mentality, maybe give others a chance and people can make their minds up from whats being offered not thier history. They would also need to be held to enacting there promises

[BOR]

Jasandjules said:

You understand that we need a strong opposition right? We don't have one, and I don't think we will for a few years, but we need one.

Why do we ?

The northern voters have just stabbed in the back probably the only politician who would have gone into bat for them, and voted for the most venal, cowardly, lying Conservative leader of my lifetime.

Johnson was however, truthful enough to make clear that he woud be passing on tax cuts to his high earning supporters, so they knew fully what they were voting for and they have given Johnson a clear mandate to give them just that.

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

[Mothersruin]

BOR said:

Jasandjules said:

You understand that we need a strong opposition right? We don't have one, and I don't think we will for a few years, but we need one.

Why do we ?

The northern voters have just stabbed in the back probably the only politician who would have gone into bat for them, and voted for the most venal, cowardly, lying Conservative leader of my lifetime.

Johnson was however, truthful enough to make clear that he woud be passing on tax cuts to his high earning supporters, so they knew fully what they were voting for and they have given Johnson a clear mandate to give them just that.

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

[otolith]

BOR said:

Jasandjules said:

You understand that we need a strong opposition right? We don't have one, and I don't think we will for a few years, but we need one.

Why do we ?

The northern voters have just stabbed in the back probably the only politician who would have gone into bat for them, and voted for the most venal, cowardly, lying Conservative leader of my lifetime.

Johnson was however, truthful enough to make clear that he woud be passing on tax cuts to his high earning supporters, so they knew fully what they were voting for and they have given Johnson a clear mandate to give them just that.

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

U OK HUN?

[otolith]

(They are screwed because you and your fellow travellers wouldn't offer a moderate centrist party with a credible leader.)

[biggbn]

otolith said:

(They are screwed because you and your fellow travellers wouldn't offer a moderate centrist party with a credible leader.)

So take the middle road and sacrifice beliefs for power? Seems like an underhanded tactic to me. Centrist like Blair? Murdering, lying scumbag. Actually, on reflection he would fit in well with today's political class.

Johnson's Tories won handily and that result should be respected as should the mandate it gives them to carry out Brexit. Labour needs to ditch it's leadership not its policies. An opposition must be strong but must offer a clear alternative

Edited by biggbn on Friday 13th December 14:26

[Mothersruin]

biggbn said:

otolith said:

(They are screwed because you and your fellow travellers wouldn't offer a moderate centrist party with a credible leader.)

So take the middle road and sacrifice beliefs for power? Seems like an underhanded tactic to me. Centrist like Blair? Murdering, lying scumbag. Actually, on reflection he would fit in well with today's political class.

Blair was on a different level, on many levels.

[biggbn]

Mothersruin said:

biggbn said:

otolith said:

(They are screwed because you and your fellow travellers wouldn't offer a moderate centrist party with a credible leader.)

So take the middle road and sacrifice beliefs for power? Seems like an underhanded tactic to me. Centrist like Blair? Murdering, lying scumbag. Actually, on reflection he would fit in well with today's political class.

Blair was on a different level, on many levels.

Agreed, a charlatan with psychopathy at his base, zero empathy, zero sympathy, smelt power in the water and sold his soul for it.

[230TE]

BOR said:

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

You're the third person I've seen on here wishing suffering on the people who voted Conservative. Is it an official message that Seumas has told you all to get out onto social media? Or just proof that the "caring, compassionate" Left actually isn't very nice?

[egor110]

biggbn said:

So take the middle road and sacrifice beliefs for power? Seems like an underhanded tactic to me. Centrist like Blair? Murdering, lying scumbag. Actually, on reflection he would fit in well with today's political class.

Johnson's Tories won handily and that result should be respected as should the mandate it gives them to carry out Brexit. Labour needs to ditch it's leadership not its policies. An opposition must be strong but must offer a clear alternative

Edited by biggbn on Friday 13th December 14:26

So where do you go then ?

Huge swathes of traditional labour voting mining towns and working class union members have turned there backs on this momentum version of labour .

Do you tweek policies to win them back or just keep putting out this new version of labour been rejected ?

[biggbn]

egor110 said:

biggbn said:

So take the middle road and sacrifice beliefs for power? Seems like an underhanded tactic to me. Centrist like Blair? Murdering, lying scumbag. Actually, on reflection he would fit in well with today's political class.

Johnson's Tories won handily and that result should be respected as should the mandate it gives them to carry out Brexit. Labour needs to ditch it's leadership not its policies. An opposition must be strong but must offer a clear alternative

Edited by biggbn on Friday 13th December 14:26

So where do you go then ?

Huge swathes of traditional labour voting mining towns and working class union members have turned there backs on this momentum version of labour .

Do you tweek policies to win them back or just keep putting out this new version of labour been rejected ?

I think those area deserted because they were strongly pro brexit and these Muppet's sat on their hands do long on the issue.

[IanH755]

I 100% guarantee that the Momentum thought train right now is this - "Hmmmm, looks like the only reason we lost is that Corbyn wasn't left wing enough!!!! We'll have to ensure the next leader is even more hard left as thats what the confused people really want!!!"

Labour are screwed till Momentum dies and a slightly left of centre leader can get the party back on track - That won't happen though and the country will be left for at least the next year with the Tories able to run amok should they wish which is why a strong opposition party is always necessary!

[anonymous-user]

BOR said:

Why do we ?

The northern voters have just stabbed in the back probably the only politician who would have gone into bat for them, and voted for the most venal, cowardly, lying Conservative leader of my lifetime.

Johnson was however, truthful enough to make clear that he woud be passing on tax cuts to his high earning supporters, so they knew fully what they were voting for and they have given Johnson a clear mandate to give them just that.

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

Beautiful sentiment. Please keep it up for the next 5 years.

[Wacky Racer]

IanH755 said:

I 100% guarantee that the Momentum thought train right now is this - "Hmmmm, looks like the only reason we lost is that Corbyn wasn't left wing enough!!!! We'll have to ensure the next leader is even more hard left as thats what the confused people really want!!!"

[tali1]

Corbyn was dead rubber from the beginning -there was no way the tax -dodging billionaire right -wing gutter press barons where ever going to allow him to get into power.

[egor110]

IanH755 said:

I 100% guarantee that the Momentum thought train right now is this - "Hmmmm, looks like the only reason we lost is that Corbyn wasn't left wing enough!!!! We'll have to ensure the next leader is even more hard left as thats what the confused people really want!!!"

Labour are screwed till Momentum dies and a slightly left of centre leader can get the party back on track - That won't happen though and the country will be left for at least the next year with the Tories able to run amok should they wish which is why a strong opposition party is always necessary!

If this is true , then hopefully the moderate labour politicians join lib dem and they become the alternative.

[P5BNij]

230TE said:

BOR said:

I hope Johnson goes Full Tory on them, as he is quite entitled to do.

Don't come cryng to the opposition to save you from what you yourselves voted for.

You're the third person I've seen on here wishing suffering on the people who voted Conservative. Is it an official message that Seumas has told you all to get out onto social media? Or just proof that the "caring, compassionate" Left actually isn't very nice?

He'll go quiet for an hour or two, ignore your post, then come back with another little slice of snidiness.

[Johnnytheboy]

tali1 said:

Corbyn was dead rubber from the beginning -there was no way the voters were ever going to allow him to get into power.

EFA

[anonymous-user]

biggbn said:

I think those area deserted because they were strongly pro brexit and these Muppet's sat on their hands do long on the issue.

In the North West the memory of Militant Tendency is still fresh for the older generation. My FiL, a t&g convener for 30 years and staunch remainer, didn't vote Labour for the first time in his life not because of Brexit but because of Momentum.