Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 9
Discussion
sambucket said:
Number 1 goal does not equal only goal.
So, how about answering my point about the blatant dishonesty of pronouncing conflicting goals?You won't answer it though because I and others can see what you are trying to do here. Thing is Sturgeon does it too, at every election, and we are wise to it. It simply isn't true that people who utterly reject independence will trust the SNP with their vote - it is a bit like trusting a tiger not to bite you.
As for the floaters, every time Sturgeon uses a trojan to garner votes eg.....
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...she is being fundamentally dishonest to them. Voting SNP could never result in Brexit being stopped - quite the opposite in fact, as happened in reality......
Edited by Evercross on Tuesday 7th July 11:36
A.J.M said:
Didn’t realise that running our Police, NHS, education system into the ground counted as governance.
5 years ago she wanted to be judged on her education performance.
Can you, Sam, look up where we are in performance tables, what expects in Scotland are saying about the state of the system and then say.
Yes she’s done a superb job over the last 5 years.
Or, hang on, actually she’s not.
Its definitely a mixed bag. It would be good to see some serious commitment to things like raising taxes. Removing tax breaks for private schools. Improving Childcare. 5 years ago she wanted to be judged on her education performance.
Can you, Sam, look up where we are in performance tables, what expects in Scotland are saying about the state of the system and then say.
Yes she’s done a superb job over the last 5 years.
Or, hang on, actually she’s not.
I think people are also thinking more long term, looking at big issues such as Brexit and covid, and imagining how the next 10 or 20 years could look. We need governance on these big issues too, and there will be more of them.
sambucket said:
Evercross said:
Stuff
I won’t answer, because your posts are horrible to read and often distasteful. So I avoid them. biggbn said:
My tuppence worth. Replies like that are why you have become something of a bete noir for some around here. Rather rude and dismissive. People are going to disagree, and whilst I get that many disagree with you and have not been particularly polite about it, why react in kind? The backbiting and niggling that is becoming more apparent on this thread on a daily basis and it is spoiling it for me, which is a shame as I have found it informative and useful, but am getting to the point where sorting the wheat from the chaff is not worth the effort. As you were gents, as you were. Gbn
He was encouraging posters to ignore and blank my comments, echoing other threads. Which is fine, but don’t expect me to reply to him on demand after that. I ignored the first few baits, and just trying to close it down. I hope it’s obvious by now I couldn’t care less what people think of me.
sambucket said:
biggbn said:
My tuppence worth. Replies like that are why you have become something of a bete noir for some around here. Rather rude and dismissive. People are going to disagree, and whilst I get that many disagree with you and have not been particularly polite about it, why react in kind? The backbiting and niggling that is becoming more apparent on this thread on a daily basis and it is spoiling it for me, which is a shame as I have found it informative and useful, but am getting to the point where sorting the wheat from the chaff is not worth the effort. As you were gents, as you were. Gbn
He was encouraging posters to ignore and blank my comments, echoing other threads. Which is fine, but don’t expect me to reply to him on demand after that. I ignored the first few baits, and just trying to close it down. I hope it’s obvious by now I couldn’t care less what people think of me.
Please note, my post was not just directed at you, but at all the bad tempered and sometimes borderline rude posts made.
sambucket said:
He was encouraging posters to ignore and blank my comments, echoing other threads.
Untrue.If you can cite where I did that (rather than your interpretation of something) then please go ahead.
You seem to be creatively interpreting things to suit whether you want to reply to a question or not, based on imagined misgivings about others that you will invoke when a question gets awkward.
Straw-man arguments.
Blaming others for your own shortcomings
Having your cake and eating it.
Common themes for a Nationalist.....
I'll ask again - conflicting goals? Are you comfortable with the innate dishonesty?
Edited by Evercross on Tuesday 7th July 11:34
Jasey_ said:
The SNP have done a great job in positioning the debate in Scotland to be SNP v Conservatives (helped significantly by the Labour party in Scotland being full of complete dodgers).
The Conservative party are doing a pretty good job at shooting themselves in the foot.
If the SNP really want to get Independence they need to start concentrating on the economy - this is probably the only thing preventing Independence.
Given Tory do not have any impact on Scotland apart from honouring the Barnett Formulae and providing the massive financial support for Covid to the whole country not sure what foot they have shot themselves ?The Conservative party are doing a pretty good job at shooting themselves in the foot.
If the SNP really want to get Independence they need to start concentrating on the economy - this is probably the only thing preventing Independence.
sambucket said:
A.J.M said:
Didn’t realise that running our Police, NHS, education system into the ground counted as governance.
5 years ago she wanted to be judged on her education performance.
Can you, Sam, look up where we are in performance tables, what expects in Scotland are saying about the state of the system and then say.
Yes she’s done a superb job over the last 5 years.
Or, hang on, actually she’s not.
Its definitely a mixed bag. It would be good to see some serious commitment to things like raising taxes. Removing tax breaks for private schools. Improving Childcare. 5 years ago she wanted to be judged on her education performance.
Can you, Sam, look up where we are in performance tables, what expects in Scotland are saying about the state of the system and then say.
Yes she’s done a superb job over the last 5 years.
Or, hang on, actually she’s not.
I think people are also thinking more long term, looking at big issues such as Brexit and covid, and imagining how the next 10 or 20 years could look. We need governance on these big issues too, and there will be more of them.
What is tax breaks for private schools going to achieve? Bar being an envy strike to those who go.
That’s deck chairs on Titanic stuff.
Our education is in the gutter, kids are being failed, 1/3rd of Primary kids aren’t at the minimum standard for high school.
13 years in power and we have a generation being failed because of their incompetence.
Brexit is happening. The best approach is to work with the uk government to make sure a deal, if possible, can be met that helps all of the Uk.
Not throwing toys out the pram, or hiring local companies to shine images on buildings and claim the EU did it.
It would appear that useful idiot and swivel eyed lunatic Sean Clerkin is planning to hold further demonstrations at the border.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/nation...
Sean Clerkin said:
Instead of Nicola Sturgeon and Humza Yousef condemning the protest on Saturday, which I thought was a very good protest by people, patriots, they should be praising them for being good Scottish patriots, for standing up for the people of Scotland, instead of criticising them. They did nothing wrong. they were good people, and moderates.
If those protesting on Saturday typified the 'moderates' in their movement, I would hate to see the radicals. I can see the fundamentalist blood-and-soil ethno-nationalists on the extreme fringe of the independence movement properly splitting away from the SNP, disillusioned by Sturgeon's apparent lack of zeal for another referendum in the very near future. Mr Clerkin is an advocate of making a UDI, and cares little for the consequences. His views are so radical and far out, that he has even been expelled from radical fringe lunatic Scottish Resistance jakeys and halfwits. He was pictured demonstrating outside the Scottish Conservative Party conference last year proudly holding a "England get out of Scotland" banner, which apparently was in no way racist or Anglophobic.https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/nation...
W124Bob said:
hutchst said:
Never mind about all that nonsense. Have you heard about Scotland's new space rockets?
They're going to Mars apparently.
One way?They're going to Mars apparently.
Apparently the best locations to launch rockets are close to the equator.
Last time I checked - Scotland wasn't getting any closer.
Now, we do have a wee village called Houston. Does that count?
Also Astronauts will just get fed up with the constant "This is Mission Control. Take off have been aborted - as it's pishing with rain again for the next 6 months. "
Troubleatmill said:
W124Bob said:
hutchst said:
Never mind about all that nonsense. Have you heard about Scotland's new space rockets?
They're going to Mars apparently.
One way?They're going to Mars apparently.
Apparently the best locations to launch rockets are close to the equator.
Last time I checked - Scotland wasn't getting any closer.
Now, we do have a wee village called Houston. Does that count?
Also Astronauts will just get fed up with the constant "This is Mission Control. Take off have been aborted - as it's pishing with rain again for the next 6 months. "
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18562347.bonny...
Why is this ambition a negative? A couple of pages back there was criticism of Scotland for lacking STEM ambition?
"The space sector currently contributes £2.6 billion GDP to the Scottish economy directly and a further £1 billion via its supply chain. The Scottish Government recently announced ambitious plans to make the space sector a £4 billion industry by 2030."
1/5 of space industry jobs in the UK are in Scotland. And now this is ridiculed?
Help me understand.
"The space sector currently contributes £2.6 billion GDP to the Scottish economy directly and a further £1 billion via its supply chain. The Scottish Government recently announced ambitious plans to make the space sector a £4 billion industry by 2030."
1/5 of space industry jobs in the UK are in Scotland. And now this is ridiculed?
Help me understand.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 7th July 13:17
sambucket said:
Why is this ambition a negative? A couple of pages back there was criticism of Scotland for lacking STEM ambition?
"The space sector currently contributes £2.6 billion GDP to the Scottish economy directly and a further £1 billion via its supply chain. The Scottish Government recently announced ambitious plans to make the space sector a £4 billion industry by 2030."
1.5 of space industry jobs in the UK are in Scotland. And now this is ridiculed?
Help me understand.
Absolutely nothing wrong with having a Space industry. "The space sector currently contributes £2.6 billion GDP to the Scottish economy directly and a further £1 billion via its supply chain. The Scottish Government recently announced ambitious plans to make the space sector a £4 billion industry by 2030."
1.5 of space industry jobs in the UK are in Scotland. And now this is ridiculed?
Help me understand.
What is being ridiculed is that Scotland is in an ideal space to launch rockets.
It is not.
The best places are on/near the equator, and good weather makes a huge difference. Scotland lacks in both.
the biggest problem the snp/ independence supporters face, is for independence to work scotland needs to attract big business/ industry to scotland. to attract these industries they need to offer them incentives, the biggest incentive for business is low corporation tax.
with big business comes high earners, they have disposable income and assets to bring with them, but these people won’t enjoy being taxed to the hilt. they could maybe put up with the high tax if the national services (health, roads, infrastructure, education, police etc....) are all top notch. but they don’t want to pay a premium (tax) for sub standard services
but the exact people scotland need to welcome/ encourage to come here and do business are the exact people that they currently scream- tory!!!!!
with big business comes high earners, they have disposable income and assets to bring with them, but these people won’t enjoy being taxed to the hilt. they could maybe put up with the high tax if the national services (health, roads, infrastructure, education, police etc....) are all top notch. but they don’t want to pay a premium (tax) for sub standard services
but the exact people scotland need to welcome/ encourage to come here and do business are the exact people that they currently scream- tory!!!!!
Troubleatmill said:
Absolutely nothing wrong with having a Space industry.
What is being ridiculed is that Scotland is in an ideal space to launch rockets.
It is not.
The best places are on/near the equator, and good weather makes a huge difference. Scotland lacks in both.
It would obviosuly be a niche market, but apparently it would be okay for "high inclination and polar orbits".What is being ridiculed is that Scotland is in an ideal space to launch rockets.
It is not.
The best places are on/near the equator, and good weather makes a huge difference. Scotland lacks in both.
I certainly support the ambition even if it falls flat.
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