High Street chains favouring UK employees

[slightlyoldgit]

Sticks. said:

slightlyoldgit said:

Honestly and probably harshly - then that's their problem, if you don't want to better whatever your lot in life is, in whatever way you can for you and your family (or just you if you don't have one) then frankly I just don't get it and (even more harshly) I personally think you deserve whatever existence you end up with.

There are dozens and dozens of ways and largely free of charge other than effort and time, which people in this country can choose to better themselves and their position in life. Learning new skills, building a better network of connections and just understanding how to be better at whatever it is you do. Or don't and If you want to wallow in a pit of self pity citing woe is me - then I have zero sympathy nor should you expect any handouts or support because you won't support yourself.

Probably makes me a horrible person in some folks eyes but cest la vie.

Edited by slightlyoldgit on Sunday 23 February 14:55

Possibly, almost certainly naive. If you really think people deserve their lot I think you're distant from what is reality for a lot of people. Quite what a person who's holding down two or more min wage jobs to keep their family with no spare time or cash can actually do to better themselves I don't know. What makes that less likely is they are often less well equipped to do so, from poor education, both at home and at school, and with lower expectations. Also the ability of the less well off to handle things like time off work for health issues, the cost of debt can exacerbate matters.

This came up in the week. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-42946...

One news article from the BBC is not " a lot of people" - 50 news articles is also not "a lot of people" and you know what 1000 examples are not "a lot of people". There are always going to be examples that folks like to trot out to prove points, they honestly don't as they are by definition and in comparison to the volume of other people to whom the situation applies - massively isolated.

Do you have people dropping dead or taking their own lives in droves in you your circle of wider friends and acquaintances because of "work pressures"? I don't know about you but I don't.

Sometimes being able to do 2 minimum wage jobs and pulling in what £25k a year to support your family is just what your lot in life is - I can think of a couple of people in our wider circle of friends that applies to. Working day jobs and evening gigs in pubs and such, one is a delivery driver for a local takeaway as well as a warehouse packer for a distribution company. He does that to support his wife and son, works his ass off so his wife doesn't have to and they can afford what they want. He has asked at his day job about some management and supervisor training and I helped him write an email (as he isn't the most literate person in the world) to his boss before the New Year about that and he starts it I think in the next few weeks.

Naivety is believing that this is somehow the norm or needs catering for, as it really isn't and people have a responsibility to themselves to do what they can, do better or not and live with what life has laid before them.

Edited by slightlyoldgit on Sunday 23 February 18:24

[anonymous-user]

I hope you’ll forgive me because almost certainly it’s been mentioned at some point in this thread and I’m too lazy to read every post.

If employers struggle to hire because it’s not possible to get EU nationals in to work for minimum wage then they will likely increase wages to attract applicants, right? A great thing for everyone who's employed and I’m all for it. However surely the increased cost of wages then has to be passed on to customers or take a hit on profits (if you’re in profit). Is that not risking putting businesses out of business and then pushing up the benefits bill? I’m genuinely dumb so explain what I’m missing please

[slightlyoldgit]

tux said:

I hope you’ll forgive me because almost certainly it’s been mentioned at some point in this thread and I’m too lazy to read every post.

If employers struggle to hire because it’s not possible to get EU nationals in to work for minimum wage then they will likely increase wages to attract applicants, right? A great thing for everyone who's employed and I’m all for it. However surely the increased cost of wages then has to be passed on to customers or take a hit on profits (if you’re in profit). Is that not risking putting businesses out of business and then pushing up the benefits bill? I’m genuinely dumb so explain what I’m missing please

The point I think we have been discussing is that this perceived necessity to increase wages only exists because our current welfare system provides for a greater degree of lifestyle for its many denizens than a minimum wage (£16k a year) job does.

Which is - in and of itself - is a fundamental problem we ought to address. As when we do make sure that benefits cannot outstrip what is a perfectly reasonable minimum wage. Then said denizens will wilfully and happily fill all those jobs vacated by our EU brethren.

[Earthdweller]

I haven’t read every post so forgive me if some of this repetitive

I’ve seen migration from both sides and have had family and friends emigrate for work mostly to the US/Canada/Aus and the U.K. .. from Ireland

Most worked their asses off and did one of two things .. made their fortunes in NewYork or saved like mad and built a fabulous home back in Ireland and subsequently moved back

My best friends daughter and her husband have both been in Sydney for the last few years . They are currently building an amazing house back in Ireland wit the plan to move back

As the Celtic tiger ebbed and flowed so people returned or left again

I see the same pattern with Polish and other migrants. I was only chatting to a mother at my sons school who works 7 days a week in bakery, long hours including nights. They rent a house with another Polish family and she was happily showing me the house( mansion ) in Eastern Poland they are building .. they plan to be home within two years, with skills learnt and a house built and payed for

My Polish barber is exactly the same

My wife came to the UK to train as a nurse .. we are now back in her home village in a house that would be £1m+ in the U.K. which we have bought outright

My wife’s sister went out too NY .. she stayed, worked hard and is now senior VP in a global bank ..and lives in an amazing house up the Hudson Valley not bad for a girl that worked in the black economy as a Carer. Her plan with her husband is to retire back to ROI in a few years where they’ll be able to live like King/Queen

One of my other Brother in laws left Ireland as an 18 year old with nothing but a hard work ethic and is now listed in the Rich list

The common denominator.. they all worked their asses off and achieved success

[slightlyoldgit]

Earthdweller said:

I haven’t read every post so forgive me if some of this repetitive

The common denominator.. they all worked their asses off and achieved success

That statement there sir is the nail meeting the head....

You work, you are rewarded - does massive success await all that work hard, of course not. I would contend that for the vast majority it does result in significant improvement in your lot though. Significance is also subjective - could be that it means you get to £40k a year, could mean you get to £100k or £100m, there is just no knowing unless you try.....

One thing is for absolute certainty though - sitting there moaning about it but doing nothing about it and or expecting the state to support your desired lifestyle is just not going to help and deserves f**k all sympathy or support.

[Sticks.]

slightlyoldgit said:

One news article from the BBC is not " a lot of people" - 50 news articles is also not "a lot of people" and you know what 1000 examples are not "a lot of people". There are always going to be examples that folks like to trot out to prove points, they honestly don't as they are by definition and in comparison to the volume of other people to whom the situation applies - massively isolated.
]

Remarkably crass, if I may say so, he's dead ffs.

[slightlyoldgit]

Sticks. said:

slightlyoldgit said:

One news article from the BBC is not " a lot of people" - 50 news articles is also not "a lot of people" and you know what 1000 examples are not "a lot of people". There are always going to be examples that folks like to trot out to prove points, they honestly don't as they are by definition and in comparison to the volume of other people to whom the situation applies - massively isolated.
]

Remarkably crass, if I may say so, he's dead ffs.

I am not saying I don't sympathise with his personal situation - and attempting to moralise the debate by pulling me up on it is equally crass. I am saying it is not a representative situation across the UK.